A game

[CaptainCrunch]

In a effort to keep my mind fresh and gooey, I thought I would start a little thinking exercise, that at the worst will show the people on this board how you think. Trust me, I'm betting that the majority won't participate because its not an easy game to play.

Basically how it works.

Somebody asks a What if question, ie What if the Flames had won the Cup?

People can answer that question looking at how that event would impact either other events or other situations.

So here I go with a start, and its a tough one.

What if Adolf Hitler hadn't come to power?

(I'm not looking for essays, just maybe point forms)

Hopefully this is a fun way to answer the burning questions that haunt mankind

[Tron_fdc]

The USA wouldn't have entered the war, and would be a country of unarmes wussies.

What if Alexander Graham Bell never invented the phone?

Edit: is this right or does my brain need more "massaging"??

[the_only_turek_fan]

What if Adolf Hitler hadn't come to power?

Hmmmmm, where to start.

Perhaps Britan would still be the No. 1 country in the world over the United States?

Perhaps the America's rise to No. 1 would have been delayed. It is after WW2, that America came out as the super power that it is today.

There would have been no nuclear bomb on Heroshyma(sp?). The world might still not have a clue as to the destruction of a bomb that type can cause.

Ahhhhh lets see. The Germans would probably be one of the worst off countries in the world. Lets face it Hitler was a evil man, but he did one thing, bring pride to the Germans.

Probably the world's population would be larger. I think 55 million died in WW2. So all the potential families that could have been made from those ppl equals way more than 55 million.

Hmmmm, Income Tax would be delayed in Canada. (Was it introduced during WW1 or WW2??????)

[the_only_turek_fan]

What if Alexander Graham Bell never invented the phone?

Then someone else would have....

[calf]

Hmmmm, Income Tax would be delayed in Canada. (Was it introduced in WW1 or WW2??????)

it was introduced in WW1

[HelloHockeyFans]

^ TOTF isn't asking any "What If" questions...

[CaptainCrunch]

I think I'll answer my own questions just so I can play too

What if Hitler had never come to power

Germany would have remained crippled economically for another 20 years as they fought the terms of the Versaille treaty

The Soviet Unions economy would have possibly hit a boom period as they wouldn't have lost a generation of young men and woman to the war, and they wouldn't have lost transportation and manufacturing hubs to the war

The Cuban Missile crisis wouldn't have happened due to the non requirement of American Troops and in theatre nuclear weapons to protect Europe from the Russians after the war

The UN wouldn't exist due to the failure of the league of nations and the fact that there was no second world war there would have been no need for it. Thus

Isreal wouldn't exist in its present form due to the fact that there was no mass extermination of the jews therefore

The Middle East would still be at war, but it would be Muslim killing Muslim.

Afganistan would have happened 20 years earlier, and a stronger and more ruthless Soviet Union under Stalin would not have lost the political nerve

Japan and America alone would have fought a regional battle in the Pacific. The A bomb would not have been used, and millions of American Soldiers would have died in the island hopping campaigns.

[the_only_turek_fan]

Originally posted by HelloHockeyFans@Mar 1 2005, 12:58 PM
^ TOTF isn't asking any "What If" questions...

What if Canada became a part of the United States?

[CaptainCrunch]

What if Alexander Graham Bell hadn't invented the phone?

We can all agree that it would happen eventually as I believe Marconi (sp?) was working on something very similar.

[zarrell]

Originally posted by the_only_turek_fan@Mar 1 2005, 11:54 AM
What if Alexander Graham Bell never invented the phone?

Then someone else would have....

Hmm. I was thinking the exact same thing in responce to the Hitler question. An even worse evil could have evolved.

[Joe Nieuwendyk]

What if Hitler had never come to power?

Adolph would be a perfectly acceptable name for your child

[CaramonLS]

War delayed 5-10 years: Because of the treaty of Versallies, I don't see how war couldn't have been averted. The German people were ready to explode when ww2 happened... from all the built up anger over the outcome of WW1, they were disgraced, It was enevitable.

No Holocost: Although theres a war, Jews aren't labeled a scapegoat and this event does not happen. Isreal is not formed.

War is over in 3 years: France is the big, big loser. No big eastern expasion campaign by the Germans, therefore Germany controls most of Western Europe (except Spain and Great Britian). Since Germany is not fighting a 2 front war, they offer peace with the Brits: For Germany its too much of a hassle to capture an island with such a large navy and for Britian they fear that with sheer number of German forces they cannot launch an effective counter attack (Since Russia is not involved) even with the Americans.

Basically Europe looks like this around 1950: Great Britian, Spain, Scanadianvia, Germany + allies, Buffer states (Poland, Czechs), Russia.

[HelloHockeyFans]

Here's one:

What if Germany had won World War II?

[Incinerator]

Originally posted by HelloHockeyFans@Mar 1 2005, 07:26 PM
Here's one:

What if Germany had won World War II?

Instead of Bush we have Hitler III going after everyone in the world?

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally posted by HelloHockeyFans@Mar 1 2005, 07:26 PM
Here's one:

What if Germany had won World War II?

Thats a really tough one.

First of all, the end of the Soviet Union and Uncle Joe probably means no Korean war, no Vietnam war

Because of the success of the final solution there are very few Jews left in the world, there is no Israel, and probably no UN.

The entire European continent is behind an Iron Curtain.

The U.S. having no real trade partners outside of Britain and Canada spirals into a economic Depression, and because of its failure to beat Germany never becomes a Superpower

Hitler in his hatred of things non Aryan and communist goes after China with the help of pacific power house Japan. who realizes the Co-Prosperity dream after years of trying.

[Tron_fdc]

So what if there was no internet? If there was no cold war due "what if there's no Hitler", would the US government have still developed the net?

[Lurch]

I'll plug a few of the best alternate history books here.

1. Guns of the South: Harry Turtledove. Gist is that South Africans go back in time to the Civil War and provide AK 47's to the South, allowing them to win the war.

2. Last Castle (I believe) by Philip K Dick (of Bladerunner, Total Recall and Minority Report fame). Germany wins WWII and comes to dominate the world.

3. The Redemption of Christopher Columbus by Orson Scott Card. My personal favorite. Explores how vital Columbus was in history, and one scenario is that the South American 'sacrifice cults' end up becoming dominant as their technology was advancing very rapidly at the time they were taken out by the Spanish.

What if Hitler had never come to power? I like this one, b/c it depends on whether you believe a leader shapes history or merely focuses what is underlying in the population being lead. IMO, Germany would have attacked France, Poland, Czech, etc regardless, probably within 5 or 10 years of when they did. Annexing Austria was a given. Hitler had nothing to do with the Spanish Civil War, as far as I know, and Facism in Italy pre-dated Hitler's rise to absolute power. The key is that without the war, when does the world come out of the Depression? If it doesn't happen by the early 40's, I think WWII is ineveitable.

[kermitology]

I like the question of what if the Nazi's had won the Second World War..

Simply put, it wouldn't have lasted.. The population of soldiers requried to maintain a massive span of territory as would have been under Nazi control had this situation arisen creates massive logistical problems. With so many nations under foreign occupation the chances of up-rising (ie. Warsaw uprising) increases exponentially. There is virtually no way that Nazi Germany could have maintained control.

THe better question is what if Germany had won the First World War, as they very nearly did had it not been for the intervention of Wilson and the US.

[Abstract]

My 2 cents here is that some people are getting Hitler's foreign policy confused with Napoleon's. Hitler never wanted to go to war with the UK let alone the US. In my opinion if Hitler had won say Belgium, the Netherlands and space to the East and Alsace and Lorraine from France he would have settled for that, world domination in terms of empire was never something that struck me as a goal for Hitler. He wanted Germany to be a huge, powerful country certainly and also the eradication of the Jews but he was also focused internally with introducing motorways/freeways.

A great question though and i guess im more answering what if America and the UK didnt enter the war.

[kermitology]

Originally posted by Abstract@Mar 1 2005, 06:08 PM
My 2 cents here is that some people are getting Hitler's foreign policy confused with Napoleon's. Hitler never wanted to go to war with the UK let alone the US. In my opinion if Hitler had won say Belgium, the Netherlands and space to the East and Alsace and Lorraine from France he would have settled for that, world domination in terms of empire was never something that struck me as a goal for Hitler. He wanted Germany to be a huge, powerful country certainly and also the eradication of the Jews but he was also focused internally with introducing motorways/freeways.

A great question though and i guess im more answering what if America and the UK didnt enter the war.

The only thing is that Hitler knew the consiquences of his actions would bring the UK into the fray. That was predestined..

In truth, the major decline of the Wehrmacht was the Red Army throwing millions of soldiers on the Eastern front. So the question isn't what if the US entered, it's more appropriately what if the Wehrmacht had not lost the battle of Stalingrad.. (Courtesy Hitler thinking he knew something about military strategy..)