Apple Blocks 3rd Party Devices from iTunes

[I-Hate-Hulse]

This has anti-trust lawsuit written all over it - may be not now, but certainly as Apple's dominance in online music sales gets even stronger.

The latest update of Apple's iTunes has included a fix to block devices such as the Palm Pre that use the program for synchronising music and content.
The Palm Pre smartphone is seen by many as a direct rival to Apple's iPhone because of its innovative interface and web based software.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/8155795.stm

On a tangent - I'm tired of the new iTunes updates every 2-3 freaking weeks as it is. Shiz like this gives me added reason to not accept these relentless updates.

[Barnes]

Apple has not allowed non Apple devices to sync for some time. I am not sure how this could result in a legitimate anti-trust lawsuit. They aren't the only place to buy music and the files can be added to any mp3 player that can handle AAC. Just not through iTunes.

Can I sync my iPod to Napster or Zune software? Nope.

And yes, all the updates suck. iTunes on Windows is pretty crappy. You would think that they would get it right at some point.

[FanIn80]

What's wrong with software built specifically for syncing with iPods?

Maybe Palm should have just written their own software (like everyone else does), instead of building a hack into their phone's OS that tricks iTunes into thinking it's an iPod.

[Jedi Ninja]

Originally Posted by FanIn80

What's wrong with software built specifically for syncing with iPods?

Maybe Palm should have just written their own software (like everyone else does), instead of building a hack into their phone's OS that tricks iTunes into thinking it's an iPod.

I have no problem with that, but used to have a problem with the fact that music purchased on the iTunes store could only be played on Apple hardware. Apple still exercises some monopolistic control over the MP3 player market by controlling the market for content (songs). I think some people are willing to overlook this issue because they see this success of Apple's somehow countering Microsoft's monopoly in some way. Two wrongs don't make a right.

[peter12]

Why should Apple be punished for having the most popular online music store? They've sold the most players and acquired the most content. Other hardware producers shouldn't be able to leech off of Apple's success. Like FanIn80 says, put the work in, write your own program and get the licenses to music.

[SebC]

Originally Posted by Jedi Ninja

I have no problem with that, but used to have a problem with the fact that music purchased on the iTunes store could only be played on Apple hardware. Apple still exercises some monopolistic control over the MP3 player market by controlling the market for content (songs). I think some people are willing to overlook this issue because they see this success of Apple's somehow countering Microsoft's monopoly in some way. Two wrongs don't make a right.

Apple "bundles" just as much as Microsoft, but with respect to computers it wasn't an anti-trust issue because of market share. Now that they're dominating some markets, they can no longer do that.

[Russic]

Originally Posted by Jedi Ninja

I have no problem with that, but used to have a problem with the fact that music purchased on the iTunes store could only be played on Apple hardware. Apple still exercises some monopolistic control over the MP3 player market by controlling the market for content (songs). I think some people are willing to overlook this issue because they see this success of Apple's somehow countering Microsoft's monopoly in some way. Two wrongs don't make a right.

I don't understand how Apple is controlling the market for songs when you can download drm-free mp3's from itunes.

[FanIn80]

Originally Posted by Jedi Ninja

I have no problem with that, but used to have a problem with the fact that music purchased on the iTunes store could only be played on Apple hardware. Apple still exercises some monopolistic control over the MP3 player market by controlling the market for content (songs). I think some people are willing to overlook this issue because they see this success of Apple's somehow countering Microsoft's monopoly in some way. Two wrongs don't make a right.

Apple dropped DRM (from music and music videos) last year. I'd say 80% of their catalogue is now DRM free, with the rest still being replaced.

DRM was never Apple's thing anyway. It was the record companies. The only way Apple could reliably implement DRM that actually worked was to also control the OS of the device playing the music... the only way to do that was to restrict syncing to Apple devices only.

Since Apple was the first (and only, really) company to successfully implement DRM that actually worked, they got the head start on all the songs from the record companies. Gradually, as time went on, the need for DRM lessened and that opened the doors for places like Amazon to distribute "DRM-free" music.

Anyway, it's all moot. Rest assured, when it comes to music, Apple is DRM free too now. It doesn't mean that other companies should be able to steal their iTunes software, though.

If Palm wants to put out their "iPhone Killer #4454677" phone, then they should also write the sync software to go with it. Expecting to be able to just piggy-back onto iTunes is kinda like Quebec wanting to separate, but still use the Canadian Dollar.

Add: In case anyone's wondering, there is nothing preventing people from buying DRM-free music from iTunes and manually copying it over to their Palm Pre (or any other mp3 device). The major reason that Apple is legally entitled to block 3rd-party devices from actively syncing with iTunes, is because they still sell/rent DRM-protected movies and TV shows. Since they have no control over the Palm OS (or any other device's OS), they are force to block those devices in order to 100% guarantee DRM protection to the movie/TV studios.

[Bill Bumface]

Originally Posted by Russic

I don't understand how Apple is controlling the market for songs when you can download drm-free mp3's from itunes.

Easy. I live with this frustration constantly. I paid a bunch of money to upgrade my songs to iTunes plus so I could play them in my car which uses SD cards of mp3s for music. Then I found out the utility I use to synch my playlists with my SD cards has been blocked by the latest release. The only way to get your mp3s out are so cumbersome that it's not feasible to use music I've purchased legitimately in my car. I shouldn't be forced into a less than perfect iPod integration that does a poorer job than what I already have. Luckily I found another third party utility that works for now but I'll no longer be upgrading my iTunes.

I think instead of relying on iPods taking over the world they should just focus on making iTunes the best music store in the world no matter what your device. There are already enough features in there that are a good incentive to use an iPod over other portable devices. Earn your business on merit, not because you force people into your products.

[FanIn80]

Originally Posted by hulkrogan

Easy. I live with this frustration constantly. I paid a bunch of money to upgrade my songs to iTunes plus so I could play them in my car which uses SD cards of mp3s for music. Then I found out the utility I use to synch my playlists with my SD cards has been blocked by the latest release. The only way to get your mp3s out are so cumbersome that it's not feasible to use music I've purchased legitimately in my car. I shouldn't be forced into a less than perfect iPod integration that does a poorer job than what I already have. Luckily I found another third party utility that works for now but I'll no longer be upgrading my iTunes.

I think instead of relying on iPods taking over the world they should just focus on making iTunes the best music store in the world no matter what your device. There are already enough features in there that are a good incentive to use an iPod over other portable devices. Earn your business on merit, not because you force people into your products.

I'm not being flippant, I just honestly don't understand the issue. All you're talking about here is just copying some mp3 files onto an SD card. Why do you need software for that?

Use iTunes to buy your music, use windows explorer to copy it to your SD card.

[Bill Bumface]

Originally Posted by FanIn80

I'm not being flippant, I just honestly don't understand the issue. All you're talking about here is just copying some mp3 files onto an SD card. Why do you need software for that?

Use iTunes to buy your music, use windows explorer to copy it to your SD card.

You have to convert them to mp3s first. When you do that iTunes leaves them buried in your folder structure and you have to go find them. Converting 700 songs one by one or album by album and then going in and digging them out of your library is not fun. Plus you need to remove the mp3s as they will be added to your library and your iPod will be full of duplicates. Or I can download a cd spoofer and burn to a folder 700mb at a time.

Or I can just use my tool and select the playlists I want and hit one button. See what I'm getting at here? It sucks and it can be so easy.

[MarchHare]

If, in an alternate reality, Microsoft was the dominant player in the digital music business and pulled a similar stunt (purposely breaking sync support on all devices other than Zunes), the Apple fanboys would be screaming bloody murder and demanding antitrust punishment. Because it's Apple, though, they can do no wrong, so it's no big deal if they purposely prevent their software from working with non-Apple devices.

I'm absolutely not an Apple-hater (I happily own an iBook, Mac Mini, and iPod Touch), but I find Apple zealots who blindly defend the company no matter what they do to be among the most insufferable people on the internet.

[Russic]

Originally Posted by hulkrogan

You have to convert them to mp3s first. When you do that iTunes leaves them buried in your folder structure and you have to go find them. Converting 700 songs one by one or album by album and then going in and digging them out of your library is not fun. Plus you need to remove the mp3s as they will be added to your library and your iPod will be full of duplicates. Or I can download a cd spoofer and burn to a folder 700mb at a time.

Or I can just use my tool and select the playlists I want and hit one button. See what I'm getting at here? It sucks and it can be so easy.

While I understand the method through itunes is much more cumbersome for you, I still don't see that as an example of itunes controlling the market.

[FanIn80]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

If, in an alternate reality, Microsoft was the dominant player in the digital music business and pulled a similar stunt (purposely breaking sync support on all devices other than Zunes), the Apple fanboys would be screaming bloody murder and demanding antitrust punishment. Because it's Apple, though, they can do no wrong, so it's no big deal if they purposely prevent their software from working with non-Apple devices.

I'm absolutely not an Apple-hater (I happily own an iBook, Mac Mini, and iPod Touch), but I find Apple zealots who blindly defend the company no matter what they do to be among the most insufferable people on the internet.

I think this is probably a valid point for some Apple topics.

This isn't one of them, though.

[Burninator]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

I'm absolutely not an Apple-hater (I happily own an iBook, Mac Mini, and iPod Touch), but I find Apple zealots who blindly defend the company no matter what they do to be among the most insufferable people on the internet.

I totally agree. Those people are also the same ones who pollute every PC or Microsoft conversation with uncalled for pro-apple sales pitches. Suggesting that someone buy a Mac because they need help with a minor PC problem is the equivalent of telling someone to buy a new car because theres is dirty.

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by FanIn80

I think this is probably a valid point for some Apple topics.

This isn't one of them, though.

What has this move done to improve Apple's iTune's software or iPod/iPhone hardware support? Nothing. All it does it break a feature of a competitor's product. That's not being innovative, it's being anti-competitive.

Apple fanboys have blasted Microsoft in the past because they used their market dominance in one area (operating systems) to cripple their competitors in other areas (web browsers, Java virtual machines, etc.). What Apple has done here with iTunes is really no different. They're using their dominance in the digital music field to damage their competitors in the smart phone/portable media player field.

[Bill Bumface]

Originally Posted by Russic

While I understand the method through itunes is much more cumbersome for you, I still don't see that as an example of itunes controlling the market.

I find the fact they make the use of other devices not plausible by intentionally blocking functionality already there a subtle way of controlling the market.

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by hulkrogan

I find the fact they make the use of other devices not plausible by intentionally blocking functionality already there a subtle way of controlling the market.

What is stopping some other developer such as Palm to release their own software? A hundred years ago I had a Sony MP3 player and they had their own program to manage music.

[Bill Bumface]

Originally Posted by Yeah_Baby

What is stopping some other developer such as Palm to release their own software? A hundred years ago I had a Sony MP3 player and they had their own program to manage music.

It's not about the music management. It's about the music store. If I'm buying music, I should be able to reasonably get it on to any device I have, not just an iPod. The problem is the best music store out there is completely tied to a closed system, thus screwing the non-iPod owning customer or anyone with a need that can't be fufilled by their iPod.

I already have an iPod touch and a MacBook pro. They've already won. Now can I please just listen to my music in my car?

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by hulkrogan

I already have an iPod touch and a MacBook pro. They've already won. Now can I please just listen to my music in my car?