Are ninjas obsolete?

[Burninator]

And did the UFC and MMA kill them all?

I would have thought a hardened monk trained in some ancient Chinese fighting style would have come down from his mountain top temple where he trained for 30 years and used the five-point palm exploding heart technique winning every belt in the UFC by now. Or is my view of these ancient martial arts completely the stuff of legend? Or are they overrated?

I'm not talking about discipline or any other stuff that people may get from martial arts. I'm only talking about which is made of more ass kick. I would think that if some far east, or from wherever, martial arts where truly that bad-ass that they should be able to hand the UFC chumps their lunch.

I pick on the UFC because it's the biggest and most popular fighting league right now and it's basically just a brawl. Any fighting style allowed. But everyone seems to fight more-or-less the same style. I don't see anyone doing that crane stance or anything cool like that. So in terms of pure fighting has the MMA style kicked the traditional martial arts in their proverbial girly robes?

[habernac]

A ninja's biggest strength is the element of surprise. Tough to sneak up on a guy in the ocatagon.

[vanisleflamesfan]

"Facts:

1. Ninjas are mammals.
2. Ninjas fight ALL the time.
3. The purpose of the ninja is to flip out and kill people."

The Official Ninja Webpage

[octothorp]

From what I know about it, ninjitsu stylistically doesn't fit at all with UFC-style fighting. It's as much about deception and stealth as the actual combat. As well, ninjitsu doesn't particularly value hand-to-hand combat, and weaponry is a big part of their idea of combat. Put a UFC fighter in a darkened factory against a well-trained and fully armed ninja, and I'd have to put money on the ninja. Unarmed and in a ring? Well, ninjitsu is all about defeating your enemy without getting into that position.

[jammies]

Ninjas also use weapons. I think the ref would frown on pulling out the nunchucks or putting a shuriken into your opponent.

You do have a point, though, in that everyone ends up on the ground now, and the chump that stands up and tries to just punch, kick or otherwise strike his opponent is gonna get smoked. On the other hand, the hero and villain rolling around on the ground and then another villain comes in and lays the boots to the head of the hero would make for crappy fight movies.

[REDVAN]

[driveway]

Well, the problem with comparing the UFC to real-world martial arts is that they have different goals.

In the UFC, the goal is to win without inflicting lasting damage on your opponent. As such there are rules and structure in place. As far as organized fighting goes, I think top-end MMA fighters would tune anyone operating in any style. Modern MMA is as close to perfect as a sportive fighting style can be.

In the real-world, however, the objectives are different. Lasting damage or even death can be a goal, disabling an opponent in order to escape can be a goal. I think that in an actual street-fight a trained MMA fighter's training could work against them, blinding them to possible avenues of attack, or blunting their force. Imagine being in a street fight and someone slaps a kimura on you and you just tap him on the arm three times and he lets go as an automatic response. Then you kick him in the jewels and run away.

As far as real-world applications go, I have no idea which martial art would prove the most effective, although this one looked pretty effing awesome in Dark Knight:

Keysi

[llama64]

1) pit a ninja vs any MMA fighter and the ninja wins. Why? Because the ninja will have killed him before they reached the arena. Ninja's are like that.

2) Pirates > Ninjas.

[Fobulous]

[FlamesAddiction]

I thought ninjas were royal assassins and not really melee fighters.

It would be like putting a sniper into a boxing ring.

And yeah, I think a lot of that stuff about ninjas and monks are just myths and legends.

[CaptainCrunch]

Daniel: Hey - you ever get into fights when you were a kid?
Miyagi: Huh - plenty.
Daniel: Yeah, but it wasn't like the problem I have, right?
Miyagi: Why? Fighting fighting. Same same.
Daniel: Yeah, but you knew karate.
Miyagi: Someone always know more.
Daniel: You mean there were times when you were scared to fight?
Miyagi: Always scare. Miyagi hate fighting.
Daniel: Yeah, but you like karate.
Miyagi: So?
Daniel: So, karate's fighting. You train to fight.
Miyagi: That what you think?
Daniel: [pondering] No.
Miyagi: Then why train?
Daniel: [thinks] So I won't have to fight.
Miyagi: [laughs] Miyagi have hope for you.



Miyagi: Karate come from China, sixteenth century, called te, "hand." Hundred year later, Miyagi ancestor bring to Okinawa, call *kara*-te, "empty hand."
Daniel: I thought it came from Buddhist temples and stuff like that.
Miyagi: You too much TV.

[John Doe]

I don't know much about MMA or UFC, but from the little I have seen a little of it a ninja might not be that effective, but a ninja Turtle would be very tough to beat. If it was taken down and got into trouble, it could just pull its arms, legs and head into its shell.

[photon]

That's exactly what ninjas want you to think. Then they make your pancreas obsolete.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by John Doe

I don't know much about MMA or UFC, but from the little I have seen a little of it a ninja might not be that effective, but a ninja Turtle would be very tough to beat. If it was taken down and got into trouble, it could just pull its arms, legs and head into its shell.

If I wanted to kill a ninja turtle, I would become its friend for about a year and then put poison in it's pizza. Then I would burn his remains.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

If I wanted to kill a ninja turtle, I would become its friend for about a year and then put poison in it's pizza. Then I would burn his remains.

I'd harvest it for its meat, turtle meat gets great profit on the black market, ninja turtle meat could be sold as an aphrodisiac

[photon]

All a shell does for a turtle is contain the explosion better when you toss a ninja gunpowder bomb in.

[Rhettzky]

Also, isn't it against some kind of ninja code to fight for money or profit? Or is that jedi? Either way, something about morals or ethics.

[octothorp]

Originally Posted by Rhettzky

Also, isn't it against some kind of ninja code to fight for money or profit? Or is that jedi? Either way, something about morals or ethics.

I'm pretty sure that's not ninjas. Ninjas were basically mercenaries in feudal Japan, and because of the nature of what they did (assassinations and espionage), and were not considered an honorable class of warrior. You're probably right about it being jedis though.

[LChoy]

ok folks, so I have taken a bit of a hitatus, but I do attend Ninjitsu classes here in Edmonton

it's not a sports art like MMA, in fact, I think it's quite likely a ninjitsu expert would loose against a close quarter MMA fighter.
Ninjas were essentially the anti-samauri. They were people for hire to do all the dirty work. Their fighting styles is more for escape and evasion than direct action.
Ninjas actually oriented in one place in the mountainous area of Japan and the various clans spread out from there.

Every martial arts claim that they are an efficient fighting system, and we claim that ours is as well. The major movements come from sinking (lowering your body closer to the ground), twisting, and thrusting to generate all of our power. Theoretically, our objective is to break our opponent line (something like balance or circle theory). In our school, there isn't very much emphasis on grappling, but we do a fair bit of striking and counter-attacking. We don't really do katas like karate (could be just my school though). In my opinion of studying it for about 6 months, is that it is mainly a defensive art. At a higher level, ninjitsu becomes more a dirty art. We strike nerve bundles to paralyze parts of the body, destroy joints and limbs to immobilize our opponents, and attack in such a way that we never appear in front of our opponent. Even in beginning level, we're doing things like eye jabs, and obscure pressure points when we're fighting.

Historically, a ninja on an assassination mission won't confront a target head on, rather they wait, observe and plan. A perfect ninja kill would be sneak in, and poison the targets tea while they are distracted, or slit their throats while they slept. The weapons reflect this as well, as things like throwing starts and caltrops are things utilized to cover the escape. As someone mentioned, if it was a ninja vs MMA, the MMA fighter would have had an accident the night before or would have been compromised in some way.

[CaptainCrunch]

note to self . . . don't frack with Lchoy