Should the US be p*ssed about this?

[Agamemnon]

It looks like the Mexican Government has created and distributed 1.5 million pamphlets advising would-be 'immigrants' to the US on how to remain safe (and make an efficient, succesful crossing?). "This guide is intended to give you some practical advice that could be of use if you already have made the difficult decision to seek new job opportunities outside your country."

Seems like the Mexican Administration isn't really playing fair on this issue. Were the accusations that GW was poor on illegal immigration true? I'd have thought he'd work hard to rectify that image (and situation).

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/americas/01/...c.ap/index.html

I'd also never heard this, The book also recommends adding salt to water to avoid dehydration when making desert crossings and notes it is best to walk during times of low heat intensity. I thought adding salt to water wasn't good, who knew?

[arsenal]

I just see this as a pamphlet on how not to die while crossing the boarder. People are going to do it anyway, why not try to keep them safe while doing it?

Its like the gov't handing out pamphlets on heroine use. Or the Democrats guide to immigrating to Canada. People are going to do it, might as well give them the information they need to do it safely.

[Agamemnon]

I guess that's one way to look at it. Since I have no real concern with the issue, I'm with you. But there are millions of people in the States I'm sure who wouldn't be pleased to find out that the Mexican government was facilitating illegal immigration into the US. I'd have thought this would be an issue that Bush might address to dispel those nasty campaign beefs about him being soft on the border.

[arsenal]

I am sure you would find alot of people that would be upset with this. Mainly in the south where they seem to congregate. I bet if you asked 10 (non-mexican) people in any of those states, 7 or 8 would be upset.

He probably will address the Mexican president about the issue. Wheither or not anything gets done is another story.

There needs to be a deterent, and right now, there really isn't one. If they get caught, they go to jail for a bit, and or get deported back to Mexico to try again. So short of calling open season on illegals entering the country, what is to keep them from attempting a crossing to the US?

I guess the Mexican gov't handing these out, might make it more appealing for people to attempt the crossing. But those are people that have probably already thought about it.

[InTheSlot]

Originally posted by Agamemnon@Jan 5 2005, 06:49 PM
It looks like the Mexican Government has created and distributed 1.5 million pamphlets advising would-be 'immigrants' to the US on how to remain safe (and make an efficient, succesful crossing?). "This guide is intended to give you some practical advice that could be of use if you already have made the difficult decision to seek new job opportunities outside your country."

Seems like the Mexican Administration isn't really playing fair on this issue. Were the accusations that GW was poor on illegal immigration true? I'd have thought he'd work hard to rectify that image (and situation).

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/americas/01/...c.ap/index.html

I'd also never heard this, The book also recommends adding salt to water to avoid dehydration when making desert crossings and notes it is best to walk during times of low heat intensity. I thought adding salt to water wasn't good, who knew?

Ocean water contains mostly, well …. water. Next it contains salt. Most of the fluid in your body is saline (salt water) …. so why can’t you drink salt water ?

The answer is because, in layman’s terms, salt absorbs water, so when you’re thirsty because you are dehydrated and you drink salt water.. you become even more dehydrated and thirsty.



So....after reading from what you said that this CNN article actually SUGGESTS that a person drink salt water to attempt to hydrate themselves, I'm not even gonna bother to read the rest -- that really discredits it.


Anyway, I would say the U.S. should be p*ssed. It's bad enough that people are migrating here illegally, but now there's a "how-to" book out there to aid them in their passage? C'mon! :angry:

[InTheSlot]

Originally posted by arsenal@Jan 5 2005, 07:07 PM
I just see this as a pamphlet on how not to die while crossing the boarder. People are going to do it anyway, why not try to keep them safe while doing it?

Its like the gov't handing out pamphlets on heroine use. Or the Democrats guide to immigrating to Canada. People are going to do it, might as well give them the information they need to do it safely.

I have a bit of a problem with what you said.

I partially agree that it is good to be informed when doing anything, whether it be intervenous drug use or crossing international borders, however, there really isn't any way to practice "safe" drug use. It's almost contradictory.


By your logic, there could be a "Running into oncoming traffic for Dummies" book that would teach people how to be "safe" when running into cars and trucks.


Do you understand what I'm saying?

[arsenal]

I completely understand and agree with what you saying. But the gov't cannot force people not to do something. Its like a rebelious teenager, doing exactly what their parents say not to do.
As far as "safe drug-use" goes. Take heroin for example. If all you use is clean needles, then the probability of you getting Hepatitis, or AIDS is greatly dimished. Does that mean that heroine is safe? Hell no, but if are going to do it, might as well as be as safe as you can about it.

Its the same thing about pre-marital sex. You can either accept that your child is probably going to have sex before they are married, and educate them so they are safe. This doesn't mean that you condone that your child have pre-marital sex. But it does show that you care about your child, and want them to have a long and healthy life. Or you can deny that it is going to happen, and let them find out for themselves. In the process of risking their lives.

Maybe the Mexicans need to attract more jobs so that more want to stay in the country, make it attractive to at least stay in Mexico rather than jumping the boarder. That is pretty much the only thing they could do.

Do I agree with illegals crossing the boarder? No. Personally, I think they should all be rounded up, deported, and if they are found in the US again, severly punished.
As a Canadian that wants to live in the US, I have more skills and can contribute more to the american society than an illegal. In a way, it p*sses me off becuase once they get into the US, they are almost treated as citizens. Makes me think "Why the hell do I want to do this legally, when I can sneak in".

[Flame Of Liberty]

Americans do have every right in the world to be p*ssed off, but on the other hand they do not have (a natural) right to ban anyone from property their do not own.

In other words, immigrants have no right to be on your property, but you have no right to ban them from staying on someone else`s property, engaging in a trade, looking for a job etc.

[Tiger]

Originally posted by InTheSlot+Jan 6 2005, 03:55 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (InTheSlot @ Jan 6 2005, 03:55 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin-Agamemnon@Jan 5 2005, 06:49 PM
It looks like the Mexican Government has created and distributed 1.5 million pamphlets advising would-be 'immigrants' to the US on how to remain safe (and make an efficient, succesful crossing?). "This guide is intended to give you some practical advice that could be of use if you already have made the difficult decision to seek new job opportunities outside your country."

Seems like the Mexican Administration isn't really playing fair on this issue. Were the accusations that GW was poor on illegal immigration true? I'd have thought he'd work hard to rectify that image (and situation).

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/americas/01/...c.ap/index.html

I'd also never heard this, The book also recommends adding salt to water to avoid dehydration when making desert crossings and notes it is best to walk during times of low heat intensity. I thought adding salt to water wasn't good, who knew?

Ocean water contains mostly, well …. water. Next it contains salt. Most of the fluid in your body is saline (salt water) …. so why can’t you drink salt water ?

The answer is because, in layman’s terms, salt absorbs water, so when you’re thirsty because you are dehydrated and you drink salt water.. you become even more dehydrated and thirsty.



So....after reading from what you said that this CNN article actually SUGGESTS that a person drink salt water to attempt to hydrate themselves, I'm not even gonna bother to read the rest -- that really discredits it.


Anyway, I would say the U.S. should be p*ssed. It's bad enough that people are migrating here illegally, but now there's a "how-to" book out there to aid them in their passage? C'mon! :angry: [/b][/quote]
Drinking water with a little bit of salt is actually helpful when you are dehydrated (ie when you sweat do you lose just water? no you lose salts as well that need to be replaced). Thats why drinks like powerade and such have some salt in them.

If I'm not mistake, when JSG was a flame they had a special blend of water with salts and sugers (and he also drank out of a straw) because he had hydration problems.

The key here is it is water with a little bit of salt, not salt water as in sea water.

[Bring_Back_Shantz]

Originally posted by InTheSlot+Jan 5 2005, 09:55 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (InTheSlot @ Jan 5 2005, 09:55 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Agamemnon@Jan 5 2005, 06:49 PM
It looks like the Mexican Government has created and distributed 1.5 million pamphlets advising would-be 'immigrants' to the US on how to remain safe (and make an efficient, succesful crossing?).# "This guide is intended to give you some practical advice that could be of use if you already have made the difficult decision to seek new job opportunities outside your country."

Seems like the Mexican Administration isn't really playing fair on this issue.# Were the accusations that GW was poor on illegal immigration true?# I'd have thought he'd work hard to rectify that image (and situation).

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/americas/01/...c.ap/index.html

I'd also never heard this, The book also recommends adding salt to water to avoid dehydration when making desert crossings and notes it is best to walk during times of low heat intensity.# I thought adding salt to water wasn't good, who knew?

Ocean water contains mostly, well …. water. Next it contains salt. Most of the fluid in your body is saline (salt water) …. so why can’t you drink salt water ?

The answer is because, in layman’s terms, salt absorbs water, so when you’re thirsty because you are dehydrated and you drink salt water.. you become even more dehydrated and thirsty.



So....after reading from what you said that this CNN article actually SUGGESTS that a person drink salt water to attempt to hydrate themselves, I'm not even gonna bother to read the rest -- that really discredits it.


Anyway, I would say the U.S. should be p*ssed. It's bad enough that people are migrating here illegally, but now there's a "how-to" book out there to aid them in their passage? C'mon! :angry: [/b][/quote]
Wow, that's a good attitude, I don't understand one bit of an article so I'm not gonna read or believe any of it.

Your body needs a certain level of salinity to funciton properly. Too much salt and you are in trouble. Too little salt and you're also in trouble.

Sea water contains too much salt so when you drink it your body needs to get rid of the extra, and that means p*ssing away more water than you drank in.

When you walk through the desert you lose salt by sweating. This means you have too little salt, and your body has to get rid of water so the salt levels get back to a reasonable level. This also means you get dehydrated.

So when you are sweating a whole lot you need some salt to keep you hydrated.

[InTheSlot]

Originally posted by Bring_Back_Shantz+Jan 6 2005, 08:24 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Bring_Back_Shantz @ Jan 6 2005, 08:24 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

Ocean water contains mostly, well …. water. Next it contains salt. Most of the fluid in your body is saline (salt water) …. so why can’t you drink salt water ?

The answer is because, in layman’s terms, salt absorbs water, so when you’re thirsty because you are dehydrated and you drink salt water.. you become even more dehydrated and thirsty.



So....after reading from what you said that this CNN article actually SUGGESTS that a person drink salt water to attempt to hydrate themselves, I'm not even gonna bother to read the rest -- that really discredits it.


Anyway, I would say the U.S. should be p*ssed. It's bad enough that people are migrating here illegally, but now there's a "how-to" book out there to aid them in their passage? C'mon! :angry:

Wow, that's a good attitude, I don't understand one bit of an article so I'm not gonna read or believe any of it.

Your body needs a certain level of salinity to funciton properly. Too much salt and you are in trouble. Too little salt and you're also in trouble.

Sea water contains too much salt so when you drink it your body needs to get rid of the extra, and that means p*ssing away more water than you drank in.

When you walk through the desert you lose salt by sweating. This means you have too little salt, and your body has to get rid of water so the salt levels get back to a reasonable level. This also means you get dehydrated.

So when you are sweating a whole lot you need some salt to keep you hydrated. [/b][/quote]
I didn't say I didn't understand it, I said it doesn't make much sense, so I wouldn't bother reading it.

BIG difference.


Anyhow, obviously I know that a human body has and needs salt. I already pointed that out by mentioning that it's called "saline".

EDIT: Bottom line is, drinking water with salt in it won't hydrate you any faster than water without salt in it, and, in fact, it will actually dehydrate you more.

[Maritime Q-Scout]

WRONG AGAIN FLANDERS!!!

there's water all around us



now gimme that water my socks feel dirty!

[Agamemnon]

Originally posted by InTheSlot@Jan 6 2005, 04:28 PM
I didn't say I didn't understand it, I said it doesn't make much sense, so I wouldn't bother reading it.

BIG difference.


Anyhow, obviously I know that a human body has and needs salt. I already pointed that out by mentioning that it's called "saline".

EDIT: Bottom line is, drinking water with salt in it won't hydrate you any faster than water without salt in it, and, in fact, it will actually dehydrate you more.

You're right, you didn't say you didn't understand it, you said, based on the (valid) notion of adding salt to drinking water, that the article was discredited. I think you're still clueless as to the fact that it was the Mexican Guide quote presented in CNN, not advice given by CNN, concering salt and water. But since you didn't bother to read the link, you wouldn't know.

You don't even have the guts to fess up when you're called out wrong. I love the sound of your credibility flushing down the toilet

[Bill Bumface]

Originally posted by InTheSlot@Jan 6 2005, 10:28 AM
EDIT: Bottom line is, drinking water with salt in it won't hydrate you any faster than water without salt in it, and, in fact, it will actually dehydrate you more.

WRONG AGAIN.

Thats why they send salt with the aid packs for the people in the hot dry parts of Africa.

[Bring_Back_Shantz]

Originally posted by InTheSlot+Jan 6 2005, 10:28 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (InTheSlot @ Jan 6 2005, 10:28 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

Wow, that's a good attitude, I don't understand one bit of an article so I'm not gonna read or believe any of it.

Your body needs a certain level of salinity to funciton properly. Too much salt and you are in trouble. Too little salt and you're also in trouble.

Sea water contains too much salt so when you drink it your body needs to get rid of the extra, and that means p*ssing away more water than you drank in.

When you walk through the desert you lose salt by sweating. This means you have too little salt, and your body has to get rid of water so the salt levels get back to a reasonable level. This also means you get dehydrated.

So when you are sweating a whole lot you need some salt to keep you hydrated.

I didn't say I didn't understand it, I said it doesn't make much sense, so I wouldn't bother reading it.

BIG difference.


Anyhow, obviously I know that a human body has and needs salt. I already pointed that out by mentioning that it's called "saline".

EDIT: Bottom line is, drinking water with salt in it won't hydrate you any faster than water without salt in it, and, in fact, it will actually dehydrate you more. [/b][/quote]
Oh my god. You are so wrong it isn't even funny. I just freakin' explained it to you. Too little salt in your body (lost due to sweating) means the concentration of salt is too low. Without taking in salt your body has to shed water to keep the salt concentration at a level you can survive with, and that means you get dehydrated. Drinking water with a little salt in it prevents this from happening.

You know, I was reading this article about this tsunami thing that happend, but they said somthing about earthquakes and that doesn't make much sense to me, so I didn't beleive any of the article.

[InTheSlot]

Originally posted by Bring_Back_Shantz+Jan 6 2005, 11:22 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Bring_Back_Shantz @ Jan 6 2005, 11:22 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

I didn't say I didn't understand it, I said it doesn't make much sense, so I wouldn't bother reading it.

BIG difference.


Anyhow, obviously I know that a human body has and needs salt. I already pointed that out by mentioning that it's called "saline".

EDIT: Bottom line is, drinking water with salt in it won't hydrate you any faster than water without salt in it, and, in fact, it will actually dehydrate you more.

Oh my god. You are so wrong it isn't even funny. I just freakin' explained it to you. Too little salt in your body (lost due to sweating) means the concentration of salt is too low. Without taking in salt your body has to shed water to keep the salt concentration at a level you can survive with, and that means you get dehydrated. Drinking water with a little salt in it prevents this from happening.

You know, I was reading this article about this tsunami thing that happend, but they said somthing about earthquakes and that doesn't make much sense to me, so I didn't beleive any of the article. [/b][/quote]
You know, mocking me really isn't the most mature thing to do. You don't see me doing that to you, now do you?

Moreover, and this is hte last time I will say this, of course salt is required by your body, but there is a big, big difference between drinking the minimal amount of salt required by your body, and flat our drinking salt water itself in an attempt to "hydrate yourself."

Did you miss this little tid bit of information?:

salt absorbs water,so when you’re thirsty because you are dehydrated and you drink salt water.. you become even more dehydrated and thirsty.,

[Bring_Back_Shantz]

Originally posted by InTheSlot+Jan 6 2005, 12:38 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (InTheSlot @ Jan 6 2005, 12:38 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

Oh my god. You are so wrong it isn't even funny. I just freakin' explained it to you. Too little salt in your body (lost due to sweating) means the concentration of salt is too low. Without taking in salt your body has to shed water to keep the salt concentration at a level you can survive with, and that means you get dehydrated. Drinking water with a little salt in it prevents this from happening.

You know, I was reading this article about this tsunami thing that happend, but they said somthing about earthquakes and that doesn't make much sense to me, so I didn't beleive any of the article.

You know, mocking me really isn't the most mature thing to do. You don't see me doing that to you, now do you?

Moreover, and this is hte last time I will say this, of course salt is required by your body, but there is a big, big difference between drinking the minimal amount of salt required by your body, and flat our drinking salt water itself in an attempt to "hydrate yourself."

Did you miss this little tid bit of information?:

salt absorbs water,so when you’re thirsty because you are dehydrated and you drink salt water.. you become even more dehydrated and thirsty.,

[/b][/quote]
See, I like mocking you becasue you rub me the wrong way and you are so freakin clueless it's funny. Where have I said you should drink ocean like salt water?????? I haven't. No one is suggesing you suck back tablespoons of salt with each glass of water but if you don't have any salt (like maybe putting some in your water) you'll dehydrate faster. It's basic physiology, too much salt = dehydration, too little salt = dehydration.

And no, salt does not absorb water. Salt dissoves in water (hudge difference) if you bothered to read and comprehend my previous posts you'd know that too much salt dehydrates you because the only way your body can get rid of it is by shedding a whole bunch of water with salt in in. Salt water is way too salty, so your body has to use even more water to get rid of the salt than what you drank.

Conversely (AS I'VE ALSO SAID BEFORE), if the salt concentration becomes too low, your body has to get rid of water (with little or no salt in in) to bring the concentraion up. Hence dehydration.

[InTheSlot]

Originally posted by Bring_Back_Shantz+Jan 6 2005, 11:41 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Bring_Back_Shantz @ Jan 6 2005, 11:41 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

You know, mocking me really isn't the most mature thing to do. You don't see me doing that to you, now do you?

Moreover, and this is hte last time I will say this, of course salt is required by your body, but there is a big, big difference between drinking the minimal amount of salt required by your body, and flat our drinking salt water itself in an attempt to "hydrate yourself."

Did you miss this little tid bit of information?:

See, I like mocking you becasue you rub me the wrong way and you are so freakin clueless it's funny. Where have I said you should drink ocean like salt water?????? I haven't. No one is suggesing you suck back tablespoons of salt with each glass of water but if you don't have any salt (like maybe putting some in your water) you'll dehydrate faster. It's basic physiology, too much salt = dehydration, too little salt = dehydration. [/b][/quote]
Are you freakin' kidding me? Just like you never suggested we swallow mouthfulls of salt, I never argued the "basic physiology" that too much salt = dehydration, too little salt = dehydration.


Somewhere I think we had a miscommunication. :unsure:

[Bring_Back_Shantz]

I don't think so. You've been arguing the whole time that drinking water with salt in it dehydrates you faster. If you didn't think that was wrong than every post you've put up is completely useless. That's like me arguing that using fire to keep warm when lost in the woods is a bad idea because forrest fires will kill you.

[Agamemnon]

Originally posted by InTheSlot@Jan 6 2005, 06:43 PM
Are you freakin' kidding me? Just like you never suggested we swallow mouthfulls of salt, I never argued the "basic physiology" that too much salt = dehydration, too little salt = dehydration.


Somewhere I think we had a miscommunication. :unsure:

No miscommunication. I started this thread, commenting that I didn't realize addingd salt to water was a good thing in dry places. You stated that this fact 'discredited' the article, and went on to give a little science lesson about why people shouldn't drink salt-water as it would dehydrate them, in all circumstances, which turned out to be wrong.

So....after reading from what you said that this CNN article actually SUGGESTS that a person drink salt water to attempt to hydrate themselves, I'm not even gonna bother to read the rest -- that really discredits it.

Why not just apologize for making a stupid statement talking out of your ass and save what's left of your tattered reputation here?

Flush!