Shaw or Bell expressvu???

[droopydrew19]

I just got a new plasma HDTV set on the weekend with a Home Theatre package.

I currently have a couple of Shaw Digital Boxes but I want to upgrade to HDTV receivers. I am not keen on Star Choice so it comes down to Shaw vs Bell.

So I pose 3 questions....

#1 Which is better price wise? (given the number of channels provided)
#2 Which has better Digital / HDTV programming?
#3 Are the PVR models worth paying extra for?

Thanks for your input in this life changing experience

[underGRADFlame]

#1: I say Bell, but this can be disputed
#2: Bell, theres no doubt about this.
#3: Yes, once again there is no doubt.

[Hemi-Cuda]

Bell deffinetly has the better HD selection. and until Shaw gets rid of the analog stations i don't see that changing anytime soon

[transplant99]

#3 Are the PVR models worth paying extra for?

You will wonder how you ever lived without one.

[ken0042]

Originally Posted by underGRADFlame

#1: I say Bell, but this can be disputed
#2: Bell, theres no doubt about this.
#3: Yes, once again there is no doubt.

Couldn't agree more.

Bell's downsides? Customer service. Sucks doesn't begin to cover it. You have to get everything recorded; if somebody promises you a credit get their name and badge number.

[moon]

Originally Posted by underGRADFlame

#3: Yes, once again there is no doubt.

Out of curiosity why is the PVR worth it no doubt?

Doesn't seem to be any better than a VCR form what I have seen of them. Maybe I am missing something with them.

[photon]

Don't forget Starchoice. They are cheaper than Bell I think (for programming) and many say their HD quality is better. I think they have fewer HD channels though, and don't have Centre Ice.

[Tyler]

Originally Posted by moon

Out of curiosity why is the PVR worth it no doubt?

Doesn't seem to be any better than a VCR form what I have seen of them. Maybe I am missing something with them.

My PVR has revolutionized the way I watch TV. Want to watch your favorite show? Tell your TV so, and it will record every episode of that show.

You begin to watch TV when you have time, and not just regular TV, but the TV you want to see.

Its hard to explain, but I could never go back to not having a PVR. Its extremely handy, and ingenious.

[moon]

Originally Posted by Tyler

My PVR has revolutionized the way I watch TV. Want to watch your favorite show? Tell your TV so, and it will record every episode of that show.

You begin to watch TV when you have time, and not just regular TV, but the TV you want to see.

Its hard to explain, but I could never go back to not having a PVR. Its extremely handy, and ingenious.

But other than me knowing when my favorite shows are on how is that different than my VCR?

I am not saying it isn't handy for people. I just want to know how other than "knowing" to tape my favorite shows it is different than a VCR.

I currently watch TV when I want to by taping my shows and watching them later if I want/need to.

Just trying to figure out how it is different than a VCR.

[ken0042]

Moon- let's say you have a 6 hour tape. You want to watch what is at the begining of the tape. You forget, and tape over something else. Or you have to keep going back and forth; whereas the PVR is random access. I can pull out something I recorded a month ago.

Or you set the VCR to record Law & Order at 8:00. You get home at 8:07. What do you do? Wait until 9:00, or watch the end first?

I use it in the morning. I set it for Global news at 6:00 (auto tune.) I get up at 6:10. rewind it to the begining and watch the main news in the 15 minutes I spend getting ready.

Or the phone rings unexpectedly. Press pause on the same remote you use to flip channels.

Or you go out to turn off the sprinkler during a comercial and get chatting with the neighbour. You can come back and rewind to where you left off.

I have all sorts of auto tuners fire all throughout the day. Whenever I come home I can just hit rewind and get back to the begining of the show; no matter what time I get home. Instead of using a new tape every day I can be sure to come home and catch a show; no matter what time I get home. The receiver buffers 1 hour as you watch, so you can go back.

Or the wife says "what did he say?" You can go back. Or you see a good website and you want to write it down.

That's it off the top of my head. I sure I missed some of the differences of a PVR and a VCR.

[moon]

For me I haven't had much of a problem with those things but I could see how it could be handy to have. Basically it is generally the things that I assumed was involved with the PVR.

I can see how it is handy if you didn't have a VCR before hand or had trouble using it for whatever reason. Still don't think it sounds that much better and not really worth the money for me, but everyone that has it seems to rave about it so I guess it works for most people.

Thanks for the info.

[Fire]

If you want to record shows in high quality than the PVR is the way to go. The VCR will be dead in a few years. Some people will hang onto to them but eventually everyone will move to a PVR/DVD recorder.

[trew]

I did a lot of research into both Shaw and Bell, and ended up going with Shaw. Here's why:

- Analog is actually a reason to go with Shaw, the digital channels are compressed and this makes sports, particularly hockey, look pretty bad. Hockey doesn't compress well, the cameras move around constantly and the image quality has to be compromized in order to compress the signal. A big screen TV makes the problem worse, because you can really notice the blocky artifacts from the digital compression process. (Actually resembles crappy video on the internet). Analog cannot be compressed in the same way and this tends to provide a much better image for watching standard definition sports programming. Shaw offers both CBC and Sportsnet on their analog tiers, so as a Flames fan, this means that most of the hockey broadcasts offered will be offered in analog on Shaw.

- I found the pricing to be better on Shaw, especially since they offer a $10/month discount if you also have high speed internet through them. I opted for one of their bundles that gives me the movie channels, and movie central HD. To get the equivalent on Bell costs $20+ more a month.

- I didn't want to sign a two year contract with Bell, and I didn't like leasing the hardware. They do offer purchase and non long term contracts, but the price is pretty crazy. Shaw makes you buy the settop boxes, but I figure they are pretty easy to sell second hand if you decide to switch to something else. Even if you get half the price, you still come out ahead compared to the lease price.

With that said, Bell does have Center Ice, and that was the only reason I even had to debate between the two.

PVR's are better than VCR's because they offer the only reliable and simple way to record HD content. I haven't rented a single movie since I got mine. I just scan Movie Central HD for the next couple weeks and record anything that looks good. I usually have four movies queued up to watch whenever I get around to it. The incremental price to go from a HD box to a HD+PVR box is well worth spending.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Center Ice is one of the best ideas man ever came up with.

Bell is far better for myself, for CI alone.

[Draug]

Originally Posted by moon

Out of curiosity why is the PVR worth it no doubt?

Doesn't seem to be any better than a VCR form what I have seen of them. Maybe I am missing something with them.

The biggest difference is simply the quality.

With your HDTV plasma, regular Standard Definition (SD) will look awful. It will look grainy, blocky, blurry, and generally pathetic. Think of a cheap VHS tape recorded on over and over, say 500 times, and then played back in a VCR with a dirty head. SD will look about that bad!

You will find that all you watch is HD programming. In order to record that, you would need a HD VCR, which are rare, and where/are very expensive. A regular VCR cannot record HD. So, you need the HD-PVR in order to record your HD programming.

I'm telling you that you need a PVR just to replace the functionality you'll lose from removing your VCR. In addition, you get a lot of convienent features (already pointed out). The only catch? The small Hard Drives they put in the latest PVR's (on Bell and Shaw) only hold 25 hours of HD programming.

[ken0042]

Originally Posted by trew

I did a lot of research into both Shaw and Bell, and ended up going with Shaw. Here's why:

- Analog is actually a reason to go with Shaw, the digital channels are compressed and this makes sports, particularly hockey, look pretty bad. Hockey doesn't compress well, the cameras move around constantly and the image quality has to be compromized in order to compress the signal. A big screen TV makes the problem worse, because you can really notice the blocky artifacts from the digital compression process. (Actually resembles crappy video on the internet). Analog cannot be compressed in the same way and this tends to provide a much better image for watching standard definition sports programming. Shaw offers both CBC and Sportsnet on their analog tiers, so as a Flames fan, this means that most of the hockey broadcasts offered will be offered in analog on Shaw.

While you are currently 100% correct, I'm not sure if you will be by this time next month. Bell is almost done doing it's satellite shuffle- they bought one from DirecTV and have been in the process of juggling them around for the past few months. Because of the nature of their orbits they can only move at a relative speed of a few km/h so it takes months to move them a few thousand kilometres.

The end result will be 2 satellites in each of Bell's orbital slots. Although these birds will be a couple of kilometres apart; for us on Earth looking at 2 objects 25,000 km away that are 2 km apart; they appear to be right on top of each other. Which means Bell can start to relax their aggressive compression.

Currently with 3 of the satellites in their correct places I've already noticed a lot fewer compression artifacts; and that is also since getting a true HDTV.

[Regulator75]

Little off topic here....

I could never attach an ugly piece of plastic to my home. The front of my house faces South, a dish would look tacky.

If it's out of sight, then fine.
A couple neighbours have it, it's such an eyesore.

[MattyK]

Not even if you painted it black and put a Flames logo on it?

[Regulator75]

Originally Posted by MattyK

Not even if you painted it black and put a Flames logo on it?

Great point!

[Red]

The amount of content between Shaw and Bell is up for debates as well.

Having major networks from Detroit and Rochester/Buffalo seems redundant. Twice as many channels, but same content. This is why Bell has so many HD channels, they pick up major network feeds from the same time zones. It looks great on TV Guide, but it does nothing for consumers.


PVR vs. VCR? No contest. Once you use it you won't be able to live without it.