[Rumour] CMLC Revealing Masterplan in Jan?

[Otto-matic]

https://renx.ca/new-calgary-flames-a...k-master-plan/

The Calgary Municipal Land Corporation will reveal its master plan in January for the Victoria Park neighbourhood in Calgary, adjacent to the Calgary Stampede, and the plan includes provision for a new arena, RENX has learned.

Michael Brown, president and chief executive of the wholly owned subsidiary of the City of Calgary, says the master plan lays out a blueprint for what the community eventually will look like.

“Right now, we really only have Plan A and that’s with a new arena. If in five, six, seven years from now, there’s been no progress on a new arena then we’re going to have to go back and revisit that one. But, for now we’re focused on that’s where the arena will go.”

“In January, we’ll be rolling out our master plan for the area that we’ve developed with the Stampede and other partners within the area with the idea of getting the community onboard because we think this could be quite a remarkable project,” says Brown, who also spoke briefly about the master plan at the recent Calgary Real Estate Forum.

[Funkhouser]

Originally Posted by Otto-matic

https://renx.ca/new-calgary-flames-a...k-master-plan/

This will be helpful to add further evidence that the CSEC is an amateur organization. Hopefully at some point ownership will see the dumpster fire that manages their assets for the echo chamber they really are and cleans house...

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

I'm confused. If there is no value to the city for this arena, and the only value belongs to the Flames on this facility, why is the city creating plans for such a facility when the only stakeholder that wants and benefits from said facility has said they are done?

Just being nice in case the Flames come back?

[Roughneck]

Brown says it doesn’t make sense for the organization to pursue the office market right now as long as the city grapples with a high downtown vacancy rate that is in the neighbourhood of 25 per cent.

Compare this to how the Flames have been operating, trying to copy Katz and the Oilers deal so much that King would go on and say something stupid like this:

And while the city is suffering an extreme surplus of office space downtown, and a 27.7 per cent vacancy rate, King let slip that he fancies more office space in his future Calgary arena neighbourhood: “By the way I think there probably will be an office tower. I have somebody who wants to build one here,” he told reporters. “But god forbid, we have empty office towers down there, so we’ll exacerbate the problem—I probably slipped in saying that. Wasn’t a planned slip; I can mess up on my own.”

http://www.macleans.ca/news/canada/t...-arena-debate/


CSEC wants a new arena and wants to be the big players in development. But they don't actually want to build the arena themselves and don't know what they're doing when it comes to development. They just look up North and think it can be copy and pasted down here.

[Bingo]

Funny how little time it takes to see all the same politics and rage come in to a new topic, even when it's written as a summary of events without any opinion or real reference to the negotiation itself.

[calf]

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

I'm confused. If there is no value to the city for this arena, and the only value belongs to the Flames on this facility, why is the city creating plans for such a facility when the only stakeholder that wants and benefits from said facility has said they are done?

Just being nice in case the Flames come back?

I think they're operating under the assumption they do come up with a deal that does provide value back to the city (like the City has been saying all along), just not the free money offer the Flames are expecting, which doesn't provide much if any return on the investment back directly to the City.

[Roughneck]

Originally Posted by calf

I think they're operating under the assumption they do come up with a deal that does provide value back to the city (like the City has been saying all along), just not the free money offer the Flames are expecting, which doesn't provide much if any return on the investment back directly to the City.

And that this is the only location the city considers providing necessary value to the city, hopefully driving a dagger into the hopes of people longing for a review of NEXT.

[Geeoff]

This is a negotiation process. It's obvious that a new arena will be built eventually. Makes sense to have a location picked out before they start building right?

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

I'm confused. If there is no value to the city for this arena, and the only value belongs to the Flames on this facility, why is the city creating plans for such a facility when the only stakeholder that wants and benefits from said facility has said they are done?

Just being nice in case the Flames come back?

Seems like prudent, mature planning to me. Build a Plan A leaving footprint for an arena, though no need to put any kind of timeline on it...the space will be useful as parking or event temporary tent space until such a time comes.

Personally, I'd be fine if there's not movement on a new arena for 10-15 years...however long it takes to get a fair deal.

Meanwhile, I'm sure they've also put a little bit of thought into a Plan B for that space in the event that there is a no arena in that location.


The city is doing everything right here to make sure that whatever investment they end up making makes sense.

[powderjunkie]

I'll be interested to see if there are any plans to do anything with the rail lines through there (from Elbow River to Macleod Trail). Am I imagining things, or is the rail bridge over the Elbow River approaching the end of its life cycle?

It would probably be as simple as a pedestrian overpass at 6 St, but the rail lines feel like a substantial barrier to creating any flow/connectivity between Vic Park and EV. It would be cool if they could sink the tracks, but I'd imagine more likely would be elevating them from a new bridge over the river until 4 St.

[Joborule]

Mentioned before, but CSEC is a stakeholder involved with the master plan, along with Stampede and others. So they'll have influence in the draft.

[Locke]

I still think the Flames should play in a Volcano fortress or have a rink on the top of a mountain. Maybe even a decommissioned aircraft carrier in International Waters.

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

I'm confused. If there is no value to the city for this arena, and the only value belongs to the Flames on this facility, why is the city creating plans for such a facility when the only stakeholder that wants and benefits from said facility has said they are done?

Just being nice in case the Flames come back?

Because it would be a huge dick move to release a more detailed master plan in January and have the 12th Ave arena land shown as residential now. There's no reason to exclude it yet.

[Hot_Flatus]

This is the right move to make. Let CSEC know that it's petulance is going to cost in their ability to have a say in the site plans (which they don't deserve). Could force them back to the table and get the ball rolling again.

[Finger Cookin]

This will be the thread that brings the community together into harmony over the new arena. I can feel it.

[Roughneck]

Originally Posted by Joborule

Mentioned before, but CSEC is a stakeholder involved with the master plan, along with Stampede and others. So they'll have influence in the draft.

Only if they 'show up to the table.'

[tkflames]

Originally Posted by Finger Cookin

This will be the thread that brings the community together into harmony over the new arena. I can feel it.

This is where I am at. I think most people want a new arena at the end of the day- obviously not at any cost. No matter the final cost, there will be people excited about the city contribution and others upset about it. If that shakes out at roughly 50% then it's probably in the right place.

From this news story, I am looking forward to seeing the overall community renderings. Both the entertainment district and *hopefully* public space components would be very intriguing.

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by Roughneck

And that this is the only location the city considers providing necessary value to the city, hopefully driving a dagger into the hopes of people longing for a review of NEXT.

To your point, I think the city does feel an arena in this location has value to the city. I'd prefer it if they stopped pretending they think this facility is only important to the Flames ownership group and that the Flames are the only beneficiaries of a facility like this.

They aren't "reserving" land in the precious East Village Rebuild for the Flames just in case they come to their senses or come back to the table with a direct benefit model as the mayor suggested a while back. They are reserving the land because as you point out, they give a crap where this thing is located, they give a crap that it happens, and they've done their own analysis and figured out where the city would get the most benefit from this facility being built.

Obviously it goes with out saying if both sides would just be truthful in their beliefs and needs this would get done a lot quicker, so for the cities part I wish they'd stop telling me this is 100% a Flames thing, while also telling me they have plans for where they'd like to put the rink. If they didn't see value in having the rink in the East Village for the city, they'd be telling the Flames to look elsewhere to build their rink, not releasing re-development plans trying to convince us their plan is best.

[Roughneck]

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

To your point, I think the city does feel an arena in this location has value to the city. I'd prefer it if they stopped pretending they think this facility is only important to the Flames ownership group and that the Flames are the only beneficiaries of a facility like this.

That has literally never been their position. In any way.

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by Roughneck

That has literally never been their position. In any way.

It has been partially in words, and completely in actions.