Need Tenant advice please.....(tragic event) - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Leapfrog · 02-19-2016, 08:03 AM

Hello...

I have a rental property in downtown Calgary. I received a call from my tenants father yesterday telling me that his daughter (my tenant) passed away on Wednesday, being found in her bed.

I do not know any more details surrounding her death.

She was young (26) and healthy. This is truly shocking and tragic thing to have happen, and I cannot imagine what her family and friends are going through. I have assured her father that I will do whatever I can to make things proceed as smoothly as possible.

From a legal standpoint, what should I do as a landlord? Can anyone offer any guidance for me? What happens to her lease? Her belongings?

What should I be doing to protect all parties involved?

Thank you for all suggestions!!

OMG!WTF! · 02-19-2016, 08:23 AM

Sad. I think legally the lease is terminated thirty days after the date of her death. You would have to let the family in during that time to get stuff. After the thirty days you can move stuff out and either store it at the expense of the estate or I think sell it if no claims are made. But the estate could claim the stuff for I think six months....so if you sold it you would have to give them the money. Obviously you want to deal with the survivors kindly and with tact but you also need to keep the place rented. So thirty days you should plan for a clean vacant property.

loob job · 02-19-2016, 08:29 AM

http://www.cleo.on.ca/en/publication...if-tenant-dies
Here is the law for Ontario, assume it is very similar in Alberta. Good luck.

calgarygeologist · 02-19-2016, 08:31 AM

Basically, you don't have a lease any more because your tenant is deceased. If you were to try to recoup any money for lost rent you would have to make a claim against the estate.

Personally, in this situation I would provide them with the rest of Feb and March to clean out the rental unit and try to get a new tenant in there for April. You can also look into the specific details regarding the security deposit and keeping that can offset some of the lost rent.

When my dad passed away he was renting a condo and we provided a letter indicating the situation and that we will cover one more months rent. They did return the security deposit after we cleaned things out and returned the keys.

Dan02 · 02-19-2016, 08:34 AM

Seeing as you have contact with the next of kin, the first step should be talking to them and seeing if you can figure something out that works as best as possible for both partys.

Weitz · 02-19-2016, 08:44 AM

All I can say is try and be reasonable and manageable.

When my grandma passed away the landlord she was renting from couldn't have been a bigger ####### and it caused my mom a lot of unneeded stress.

Leapfrog · 02-19-2016, 09:32 AM

My goal is to make this part of the process as painless as possible for the family. They live out of province, and I believe they are planning on coming to Calgary over the weekend (or possibly Monday). I have no idea what their plans are for her belongings. I wanted to ask... but felt it was not the right time when I spoke with him over the phone.

I want to be as fair and as considerate as possible, while doing whatever I need to do legally.

Hockeyguy15 · 02-19-2016, 09:35 AM

I would set up a time for you to meet them at the property, so they have easy access and you can do a quick walkthrough and see if there are any issues you will need to worry about.

My wife's Uncle had his tenant commit suicide at his rental, and did a bunch of damage in the process.

FlamesAddiction · 02-19-2016, 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weitz

All I can say is try and be reasonable and manageable.

When my grandma passed away the landlord she was renting from couldn't have been a bigger ####### and it caused my mom a lot of unneeded stress.

Same. When my dad died, the landlord called us and gave us a date to get everything out. He was a real jerk about it too.

It sounds like the OP is handling it with class, but I would say that if there is ever a time in life to be generous and patient to strangers, it is in time of tragedy.

DoubleF · 02-19-2016, 12:04 PM

Just talk to them and be honest. You have no experience dealing with something like this. You want to help make the transition easier on the family, but you have to cover yourself financially as well.

You could even put together some information that would be helpful to the family for this situation such as phone numbers, locations, directions etc.

- Moving company
- or... Uhaul
- Storage company
- Garbage disposal company (Let's be honest, that bed for sure is gone, there might be a few other things to go too, I'm not saying junk everything she owns)
- Cleaning company
- Fast food delivery
- Map with nearest grocery store/hardware store etc. (You mentioned they're from out of town)

Etc.
It's easy enough to do, but something you don't want to do when dealing with the grief of a death.

annasuave · 02-19-2016, 12:09 PM

When my dad died, the landlord was pretty decent about it. He gave keys to both my sister and me, set up a parking space for us to use, and offered to help us move out the heavy stuff. Rent was paid up until the end of the month, but he said we could have an extra week or two if we needed it. We didn't.

My dad's death was completely unexpected. Having a decent guy as the landlord was really appreciated. We left the place in tip-top, rent-ready shape when we were finished.

I don't know what the legal requirements are. Of course you'll be wanting to rent the property out again as soon as possible. If you're in a position to extend a few days or weeks grace to family to get everything done, I'm sure that would be remembered as a kindness to the family.

Good luck, sorry this landed on your plate.

RedHot25 · 02-20-2016, 08:26 AM

I know you are looking for a bit more specific advice, but I think you generally seem to be on the right track. As others have said, you seem to be dealing with this in a classy and fair way, at least coming across on a couple of posts. If that is how you are coming across to them in "real life", kudos to you.

That said a couple of things:

1) I really like the above suggestion of just putting a 2-second list together of services, like cleaning companies, moving, close restaurants, grocery stories, etc etc. Especially if they are coming from out of town, that would likely be a huge help. You don't have to do it, but it would be very considerate of you.

2) Have you called Landlord-Tenant;s? You likely already have, but why not call Service Alberta and give the 2 second overview and see what advice they would have? Would give you more of the technicalities etc, or be able to direct you to resources that could:

http://www.servicealberta.gov.ab.ca/...-utilities.cfm

For further assistance with any of these topics, please contact the Consumer Contact Centre at 780-427-4088 (Edmonton and area) or 1-877-427-4088 (toll-free in Alberta).

Leapfrog · 02-22-2016, 10:24 AM

I just wanted to provide a brief update.

Firstly... Thank you very much for all of the great suggestions. This has been a learning process for me, certainly. The suggestion of a creating a sheet of helpful hints was particularly helpful and thoughtful (and was much appreciated by the family).

The family is in town now, clearing the belongings from the suite. I met with them last night for the first time. Obviously, this is an extremely difficult time for them, but they seem to be handling things as well as one would expect.

Their goal is to have the suite empty and cleaned by the end of the week.

I have been in contact Service Alberta and have been told that I do have a fixed term lease. As such, the estate is responsible for the term of the lease, until I am able to find a suitable tenant. It will be unlikely that I will be able to find a tenant before March 1st. Assuming I find one for April 1st, I would lose one month's rent. (there is substantial damage to the suite that the damage deposit - i am hoping - will fully cover). Legally... the estate is responsible for rent for the month of March. That seems like a VERY difficult conversation to have with the grieving family.

My heart says just let the family clean out the suite and try and move forward. The business side of me feels that a one month's loss of revenue is a big hit, and one that I am not legally obligated to absorb.

Basically... I am juggling emotions of being a sympathetic guy or a business man. Losing one month's revenue for me personally would be a tough thing to swallow after being caught in layoffs recently.

Thoughts?

Otto-matic · 02-22-2016, 10:32 AM

Personally, I'd lose a months rent over this. You'll be helping them out a ton during this time.

calgarygeologist · 02-22-2016, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leapfrog

Legally... the estate is responsible for rent for the month of March. That seems like a VERY difficult conversation to have with the grieving family.

My heart says just let the family clean out the suite and try and move forward. The business side of me feels that a one month's loss of revenue is a big hit, and one that I am not legally obligated to absorb.

Basically... I am juggling emotions of being a sympathetic guy or a business man. Losing one month's revenue for me personally would be a tough thing to swallow after being caught in layoffs recently.

Thoughts?

You have to keep in mind that there may not even be a lot of funds in the estate to cover expenses. She was 26 and it is likely that she did not have life insurance. If there is a significant estate (ie. savings and investments, assets and life insurance) you can certainly put in a claim but if there is little to no funds you will just get put on a list of creditors and you will likely see no funds coming your way.

Leapfrog · 02-22-2016, 11:03 AM

My instinct (as I have done throughout this entire process) is to do everything I can to help this poor family. This would then include just letting them off the hook for any outstanding rental amounts.

Maritime Q-Scout · 02-22-2016, 11:09 AM

I realize that Leapfrog is asking about what he's legally bound to do, which is smart. However by all accounts (and the last post I'm reading) he's willing to do so much more.

I can't imagine the stress the family is going through, nor the utter confusion and trauma that Leapfrog would also be feeling.

If I were in Leapfrog's shoes, I would make myself available to help the family however they need. Whether that's helping them pack, giving them a list of restaurants in the area, perhaps a list of people they could talk to (social workers, grief, counselors etc). Perhaps even bring them a home cooked meal?

Under no circumstances are any of the above obligations under the law (I wouldn't assume they'd be anyway).

Strictly speaking, death I would assume would fall under an "act of God" clause rendering the contract unenforceable.

Does Alberta have a Tenancy Rights Board or telephone number? You could call them and they'd be able to advice I would think.

Weitz · 02-22-2016, 11:14 AM

I'd also throw the unit up on Rentfaster or whatever you use ASAP and see if you can fill it.

DoubleF · 02-22-2016, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leapfrog

My instinct (as I have done throughout this entire process) is to do everything I can to help this poor family. This would then include just letting them off the hook for any outstanding rental amounts.

Why not both humanity and business?

Draft up an invoice for the rent and repair cost outstanding. You can chat with them and gauge the finances. If it seems like they won't be able to afford paying the rent/repairs or it will not be worth your time to pursue, then trade in the loss for good will. It saves you additional resources from trying to wring water from a rock. If you might be easily able to collect, then do that. You don't have to commit to the decision right now.

The family should understand.

Either way, communicate it outright. There's a big difference between something completely settled and done vs a situation that you're not sure if you might still get an invoice or not confusion in the event of a death.

ken0042 · 02-22-2016, 12:23 PM

I like DoubleF's post. One good way of wording it is to tell them that you will do everything possible to minimize the expenses, and then ask if they are in a position to be able to have the estate take care of the obligations. For all you know, the family might be in a position where they can pay.