What is there to do about Special Teams

[polak]

Surprised we don't have a thread about this already but what should the team do about the special teams? We have the worst special teams in the league and according to a stat a guy on HF saw during a broadcast (don't shoot the messenger), the worst combined special teams of any team, ever. That's right. The worst special teams in NHL history.

So what should the Treliving and the Flames do? I personally don't know how the special teams coach responsible for the worst special teams in the league more than a third of the way into the season still has a job but I know firing a beloved alumni is a big deal to some of you. Even if he is awful at his job...

Do we ride it out? Is this a systems issue? Do the players simply forget how to play without a nice even 10 skaters on the ice?

[heep223]

I agree that this is an underrated topic.

Think of Johnny's point totals if the PP was clicking! He has the least number of PPP out of the top 30 NHL scorers. Monahan too would probably be PPG if the PP was clicking. If they're still not seeing success by Christmas, they should change the entire powerplay system.

Less worried about the PK. I think the failure on the PK is largely to do with goaltending and sluggish D for the first part of the season. Getting Bouma back will help also.

[Bandwagon In Flames]

Fire Martin Gelinas. The personnel on ice and the special team systems are atrocious.

[codynw]

During a powerplay, they should bench somebody just so they can play 4 on 4 instead.

[Enoch Root]

re PK: get a goalie

PP: they need better zone entry - having 4 guys standing still on the blueline is beyond painful to watch

[D as in David]

I don't recall the PK being as passive last year as it is this year. Maybe my memory is faulty or, if its true that the Flames aren't attacking the puck as much, is it a change in the system or personnel? Byron and Bouma were key parts of last year's PK, IIRC. Jooris, as well, but he seems to have lost some of his mojo this year.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Bandwagon In Flames

Fire Martin Gelinas. The personnel on ice and the special team systems are atrocious.

The "special teams coach" is more a figure head than the guy responsible. Hartley had said a few times that the whole staff comes up with the schemes and has input on player selection. Firing Gelinas changes nothing

[D as in David]

Originally Posted by codynw

During a powerplay, they should bench somebody just so they can play 4 on 4 instead.

Ha! This may not be such a bad strategy. Keep a player on the bench but have someone ready to jump on the ice at an opportune time; lull the opposition into thinking it really is a 4 on 4 but then have that player jump on the ice in behind the opposition's D. Stretch pass and Bob's your uncle.

[zukes]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

The "special teams coach" is more a figure head than the guy responsible. Hartley had said a few times that the whole staff comes up with the schemes and has input on player selection. Firing Gelinas changes nothing

This! No way firing Gelinas changes anything and with how important the PP is these days, if there was a coach available that was some kind of PP guru, he would have been hired.

[mdubz]

In my viewings, there are 2 big issues.

#1 - Zone entry. There are only a couple of players who can gain the zone on a PP by skating it in. Gaudreau, Colborne and Brodie.

#2 - Making point shots the main focus and the defense not being able to get pucks through. Instant loss of possession, with no shot on goal and then we're back to #1.

[stone hands]

They dont move on the PP. they just lackadaisically give it to johnny or brodie at the flames' ringette line to slowly skate it in against 4 opposing players. If those 2 dont have the puck they lackadaisically dump it in and dont chase, letting the opponents easily scoop it up and dump it down the other end

When they do have it they just pass it between johnny on the half boards and whatever dman is closest to him, then to the other point, then back to the original dman, then back to johnny, and so on and so forth. they dont create any extra space, so after about 25 seconds of this non-threatening perimeter positioning, one of the D will take a shot into traffic, have it get blocked by the forward closest to them, and out it goes

it's so insanely frustrating to watch this 5+ times a game sometimes

[polak]

Originally Posted by zukes

This! No way firing Gelinas changes anything and with how important the PP is these days, if there was a coach available that was some kind of PP guru, he would have been hired.

Surely there is someone that can fix this:

-The worst goal differential
-The worst goaltending
-The most goals allowed
-The 2nd worst away record
-The worst PP
-The worst PK

[GioforPM]

The topic is OK, but I suspect this is a passive-aggressive "fire Hartley" thread, based on the originator's history.

To be better on the PP they need better faceoffs and puck retrieval. That's on the players IMO. Once they set up they aren't as bad as all that, but they lose 15 seconds for every lost faceoff and every time the opposition wins the puck in the corner.

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by polak

Surely there is someone that can fix this:

-The worst goal differential
-The worst goaltending
-The most goals allowed
-The 2nd worst away record
-The worst PP
-The worst PK

If only we could get our hands on a Stanley Cup winning, Jack Adams coach. Preferably the most recent Jack Adam's winner, not someone who won it like 25 years ago. Hmmm.

[polak]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

The topic is OK, but I suspect this is a passive-aggressive "fire Hartley" thread, based on the originator's history.

To be better on the PP they need better faceoffs and puck retrieval. That's on the players IMO. Once they set up they aren't as bad as all that, but they lose 15 seconds for every lost faceoff and every time the opposition wins the puck in the corner.

It's not passive aggressive. I hate this coaching staff. Fire Hartley.

This is just the biggest problem with their performance and certainly a topic worthy of discussion.

[Huntingwhale]

Having an average goaltender would solve a lot of these issues. Sad to say, but goaltending is by far the #1 issue for goals against.

As for the PP, Wideman is no longer performing like a PPQB. Johnny seems to have taken that role, but when was the last time we saw Wideman shooting bombs from the point? His shots that used to be so deceptive and sneaky that they would squeeze through the screen are no longer going through. Same with Gio's. Brodie has never been a big shooter. Hamilton has a good wrist shot, but haven't seen any one-timers from him. A ton of shots just plain missing the net when up close, or the players opt for the pass that gets broken up.

[canflip_101]

just wondering which coach is running the flames special teams?

[mikephoen]

Originally Posted by D as in David

Ha! This may not be such a bad strategy. Keep a player on the bench but have someone ready to jump on the ice at an opportune time; lull the opposition into thinking it really is a 4 on 4 but then have that player jump on the ice in behind the opposition's D. Stretch pass and Bob's your uncle.

I like it!

Another option is to have the 5th guy hang back near the circles in the Flames end. If the opposition clears it, that guy can fire the puck back up quickly so the PKers can't change, or get caught on a bad change.

Probably should watch all the Mighy Ducks movies. I'm sure there was a brilliant strategy in that movie they could steal.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Huntingwhale

Having an average goaltender would solve a lot of these issues. Sad to say, but goaltending is by far the #1 issue for goals against.

As for the PP, Wideman is no longer performing like a PPQB. Johnny seems to have taken that role, but when was the last time we saw Wideman shooting bombs from the point? His shots that used to be so deceptive and sneaky that they would squeeze through the screen are no longer going through. Same with Gio's. Brodie has never been a big shooter. Hamilton has a good wrist shot, but haven't seen any one-timers from him. A ton of shots just plain missing the net when up close, or the players opt for the pass that gets broken up.

They have indeed put the puck out of the offensive zone themselves by missing the point shot. That one is a Russell speciality, sometimes Gio as well. Wideman is hitting a lot more bodies than last year. That can be from teams catching on to the Johnny to Wideman play that worked so well last year.

I think Hamilton is going to be better and better though. His wrister is as hard as Brodie's slapper.

[PeteMoss]

PK Save percentages:
Hiller .735
Ramo .833
Ortio .800

Average from what I can see is .875.