What are the gaps we must fill by 5th year of rebuild?

[Flamescuprun2018]

Three glaring gaps to fill:

2 Top 6 wingers (X, Y)
One starting goalie (Z)

2015-16 now

Gaudreau-Monahan-Hudler
Bennett-Backlund-Frolik
Colborne-Stajan-Jones
Ferland-Jooris/Granlund- Bollig

Giordano-Brodie
Hamilton-Russell
Engelland/Smid-Wideman

Ramo-Hiller


2016 Trade Deadline

Trade: Hudler/Russell/Jones at or before deadline for picks/A prospect
Trade: Hiller/Ramo, Raymond, Wideman+salary, Bollig if any takers...

2015-16 post trade deadline

Gaudreau-Monahan-Frolik/Jooris
Ferland-Bennett-Jooris/Frolik/Granlund
Colborne-Stajan-Jooris/Granlund
Bollig/Raymond-Backlund-Poirier/other Stockton winger

Giordano-Brodie
Hamilton-Engelland
Nakladal-Morrisson/Smid

Ramo-Hiller


2016 Offseason
Y winger with top 5 pick we are likely to get, Colborne/Ferland fill in 2LW if not ready
X winger by UFA (short term deal) or RFA (Hamiltonesque deal for multiple picks+Backlund/Granlund/B level prospects)
Z UFA goalie (2 year deal)
Sign Gaudreau/Monahan 6/6 max to cash freed up by UFAs
Do not resign Hiller or Ramo

2016-2017 opener

Gaudreau-Monahan-X
Y-Bennett-Frolik
Colborne/Ferland - Stajan/Backlund- Jooris/Granlund
Ferland/Colborne- Jankowski/Arnold/Shore- Poirier/other Stockton winger

Brodie-Hamilton
Giordano-Wideman/Engelland
Kulak/Culkin-Nakladal/Morrisson

Z-Ortio


At 2017 trade deadline move Wideman/Smid/Engelland/Bollig/Raymond for picks (Still seller at deadline)

2017 Offseason
Sign Bennett 6/6 max with cash freed up by UFAs
Probably no room in cap for a significant UFA
Trade Backlund or Stajan
Bollig/Raymond not resigned


2017-2018 opener

Gaudreau-Bennett-X
Y-Monahan-Frolik
Colborne/Ferland - Jankowski/Stajan- Jooris/Granlund
Ferland/Colborne- Jankowski/Arnold/Shore/Grant- Poirier/Klimchuk

Brodie-Hamilton
Giordano-Nakladal/Morrison
Kulak/Culkin/Kylington-Andersson

Z-Ortio/Gillies

[Da_Chief]

You're looking waaay to far ahead.

Needs are many.
-2 top 6 wingers (Have Gaudreau and Bennett in place)
-1 2nd line center (Monahan in place)
-Faceoff winning 3rd line center

- 2 Top 4 Dman (Brodie and Hamilton in place [I've lost confidence in Gio])

-Starting goalie
-Backup goalie

Chips to trade:
Hudler
Backlund
Jones
Stajan*

Giordano
Wideman*
Russell
Engelland*
Smid*

Ramo^
Hiller^
Ortio^

* Probably guys with negative value
^ They come off the books this year and I doubt anyone would give anything for them

Right now we have:

Gaudreau-Monahan-?
Bennett-?-?
Colborne-?-Frolik
Bouma-?-Ferland

Brodie-Hamilton
?-?
?-?

?
?

Lotsa question marks. Time to show what you can do BT.

[Flamescuprun2018]

Originally Posted by Da_Chief

You're looking waaay to far ahead.

Needs are many.
-2 top 6 wingers (Have Gaudreau and Bennett in place)
-1 2nd line center (Monahan in place)
-Faceoff winning 3rd line center

- 2 Top 4 Dman (Brodie and Hamilton in place [I've lost confidence in Gio])

-Starting goalie
-Backup goalie

Chips to trade:
Hudler
Backlund
Jones
Stajan*

Giordano
Wideman*
Russell
Engelland*
Smid*

Ramo^
Hiller^
Ortio^

* Probably guys with negative value
^ They come off the books this year and I doubt anyone would give anything for them

Right now we have:

Gaudreau-Monahan-?
Bennett-?-?
Colborne-?-Frolik
Bouma-?-Ferland

Brodie-Hamilton
?-?
?-?

?
?

Lotsa question marks. Time to show what you can do BT.

Two-three years out has to be the focus. Otherwise BT will make mistakes.

Bennett is a 1C, no way he stays on wing long term. Monahan 2C. Hopeful Jankowski is 3C but agree who knows. Someone does need to emerge as a reliable FO guy. One of Stajan and Backlund is here until 2018 because of contracts.

Giordano is going nowhere for 4-5 years. That contract is not tradable. I am hopeful once he can sustain 3D/4D role long term. But am nervous as you about it. He wont be first pairing beyond next couple years. Gio contract is starting to look very concerning to cap situation down the line.

[GranteedEV]

Well it's a long ways away but a contending Flames team will probably be structured as:

#1 Center (we don't have one right now, hopefully Sam Bennett. He needs to learn and play center)
#1B Center (we don't have one right now, maybe Monahan or Jankowski, but who knows. Possible that a trade is needed or it's Auston Matthews.)
#2B Checking center (Backlund? Monahan? Jankowski? Not too worried about this one.)

Elite playmaking winger (Gaudreau)
Elite two-way Winger with some size (we don't have one right now. Can Poirier become that? Or maybe we draft Puljujarvi or Laine this year?)
Skilled two-way winger (Frolik)
Skilled #2 Winger (Granlund/Klimchuk/Poirier/Mangiapane would be the four possibilities as it stands now. Also keeping Hudler if he's cheap enough makes sense.)

#1 Defenseman (Brodie)
#2A Defenseman (Giordano)
#2B Defenseman (Hamilton)
#4 Defenseman (Maybe Kulak or Sieloff? Hartley sure needs to start giving guys an opportunity to roll with... even give Wotherspoon a shot. )
#5 PP Specialist defenseman (Andersson?)

[hockey.modern]

For this year, I hope we can have at they very most:

- Grade A RFA wing Player (Similar to what BT did with Hamilton but top 6 forward) [X]

- Top 3 Draft Pick [Y]

If things go to plan, that leaves the 2016-17 top 6 forward line as:

Gaudreau-Bennett-X
Y-Monahan- Frolik

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by hockey.modern

For this year, I hope we can have at they very most:

- Grade A RFA wing Player (Similar to what BT did with Hamilton but top 6 forward) [X]

- Top 3 Draft Pick [Y]

If things go to plan, that leaves the 2016-17 top 6 forward line as:

Gaudreau-Bennett-X
Y-Monahan- Frolik

Can you get X without using Y? I don't think the flames have the assets to get X without using Y.

[dissentowner]

If Frolik is in our top 6 by that time we are in trouble. He is an ideal 3rd line winger, not a top 6 forward.

[playmaker]

There are IMO two major gaps in the Flames system:

1) Sniper
2) Big, physical, defensive-minded 2nd pairing dman to play with Hamilton

[JJ1532]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

If Frolik is in our top 6 by that time we are in trouble. He is an ideal 3rd line winger, not a top 6 forward.

Really? He's a 40 point winger on course for another 40 ish points. As a 1st line winger, I'd agree he won't get it done. But as a 2nd line winger, he'd be fine. Unless you are expecting 50+ point returns from every player in our top 6?

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by JJ1532

Really? He's a 40 point winger on course for another 40 ish points. As a 1st line winger, I'd agree he won't get it done. But as a 2nd line winger, he'd be fine. Unless you are expecting 50+ point returns from every player in our top 6?

If we are gunning for a cup? Yes, I am.

[N-E-B]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

If we are gunning for a cup? Yes, I am.

That's just unrealistic though. Not even the Blackhawks had 6 50+point guys.

Hell, the 2014 LA Kings only had two 50+ point players and they won a cup. They only had three when they won in 2012.

[Flamescuprun2018]

Originally Posted by playmaker

There are IMO two major gaps in the Flames system:

1) Sniper
2) Big, physical, defensive-minded 2nd pairing dman to play with Hamilton

If 2) important we haven't drafting 2) thus far. Kanzig won't get there. Far more likely Hickey, Anderson, Kylington, Morrison or one of Kulak or Culkin make it to top 4. Do we really need a Regehr in today's NHL?

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by N-E-B

That's just unrealistic though. Not even the Blackhawks had 6 50+point guys.

Hell, the 2014 LA Kings only had two 50+ point players and they won a cup. They only had three when they won in 2012.

Yeah, and for me it isn't a question of taking the top six scorers and putting them on our top two lines. There often needs a mucker or a big physical player on a top line to let the other two do their thing.

[Badgers Nose]

Flames need:

1. Mikka Kiprusoff
2. Jarome Iginla
3. Robyn Regehr

No joke. They need those archetypes. Good luck BT.

To get players like that is going to require a tank this year (number 2 and 3 available in ghe first 5 in this years draft), Hamilton style RfA deals and surrendering some vaunted talent. The #### guys we keeping putting in to trade proposals will not get anything.

[Gaskal]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

Yeah, and for me it isn't a question of taking the top six scorers and putting them on our top two lines. There often needs a mucker or a big physical player on a top line to let the other two do their thing.

Has Hartley tried this line yet? If not, why the hell not??

Spoiler!

[Vulcan]

Okay try something like this

Gaudreau - Bennett - Ferland
Granlund - Monahan - Hudler
Frolic - Backlund - Jones
Joe Colborne – Matt Stajan – Jooris

[Dr. Doom]

Surprised nobody has mentioned a coach.

I don't know how he accomplished what he did last season or how this season has been proven to be such a mess...

But I do know the players are absolutely lost this season and there is zero coming out of it without replacing the coach. Maybe then we can tell what we have player wise or what we're missing. But until then you don't mess with the players, sorry Hartley, but you're paid to turn this around and he looks like dear in headlight.

[ricardodw]

players under contract for year 5 of the rebuild (2017-18)

Gio 6.7
Hamilton 5.75
Brodie 4.65
Frolik 4.3
Backlund 3.575
Stajan 3.275
Bouma 2.2

7 for 30.45

Then Bennett, Monahan, Gaudreau 10-18M. Even giving them a Hurbedeau 2 year deal for 6.5 rather than Hamilton-like deal still would be a min of 10M


total: 10 players 3 D and 7 forwards for 40-48 M

Need another 10-12 players for 25-35M including a starting goalie

what we see is what we get. The re-build has to be the huge improvement on the current 10 guys we have signed

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Dr. Doom

Surprised nobody has mentioned a coach.

I don't know how he accomplished what he did last season or how this season has been proven to be such a mess...

But I do know the players are absolutely lost this season and there is zero coming out of it without replacing the coach. Maybe then we can tell what we have player wise or what we're missing. But until then you don't mess with the players, sorry Hartley, but you're paid to turn this around and he looks like dear in headlight.

Sure, that is the solution, lets just can the coach. It sure has worked wonders up North huh.

[Da_Chief]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Sure, that is the solution, lets just can the coach. It sure has worked wonders up North huh.

Worked wonderfully for Ottawa last year. So, I say we do it NOW.