Returning Users

[ken0042]

There has been a lot of discussion about previously banned members returning. Going forward if you suspect somebody is a returning banned user, please do one of the following:

- Report the post, detailing why you think it is that person.
- PM a mod, and let us look into it.

Do not discuss it in a thread. As we see time and again that only serves to derail the thread. We also run into issues where we may also "be onto" somebody, and an open thread affects our ability to act. In some cases we have allowed users back under a new identity and strict probation. In those cases making their identity public makes it harder for them to change their ways.

When we say not to discuss it in a thread, some things we do not want to see are:
- Asking if the user is that banned user.
- Making references accusing them of being somebody. For example asking if they drive a purple Mustang, or know how to navigate a 4 way stop.
- Using their previous username as a play on words. (An example- telling that suspected user not to FLIP out.)
- Saying hi to them.

The above list is obviously not inclusive, but you get the idea.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Can we discuss it in this thread, ken?

[ken0042]

Can we discuss generalities? Sure. Like if you guys have suggestions on something we can do to keep track of the returnees.

I just don't want this thread to be about why we think person X is a returning banned member.

[CaramonLS]

Originally Posted by ken0042

Can we discuss generalities? Sure. Like if you guys have suggestions on something we can do to keep track of the returnees.

I just don't want this thread to be about why we think person X is a returning banned member.

How come? IMO, regular posters have been more efficient than mods at finding out who returning posters are.

While I get wanting to end some of the piling on, I would hope that you want the trash to stay where you put it.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Having an open discussion about who is a possible returnee is a good idea. Maybe less "fun" then the last one was, but that thread as a great way to contain the discussion and do some sorting out that 2-3 moderators can't do.

The moderators using that thread to as a two-way street to communicate would be beneficial as well. If the group is onto somebody and the moderators are already aware then can give us the heads up, similar to how KevanGuy dropped the "ok ok, I get it" for undercoverbrother.

The board is a community and what you're suggesting, is just a little too naive. Yes, it's an online community but that doesn't mean someone should be a total loser, get banned, put on a disguise and join in again right away. Users being able to vent and discuss returnees is good for the board, letting off some steam.

Your last sentence is exactly what the board needs a little of. Your moderating style and decisions are making the board a little too vanilla, Ken.

[ken0042]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

How come? IMO, regular posters have been more efficient than mods at finding out who returning posters are.

Yes, and we do value the input. Which is why we ask that it be reported or done via PM. The fact that our trash is out in the open is not something for us to be proud of; and is often better handled discretely.

[Trumbull]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

How come? IMO, regular posters have been more efficient than mods at finding out who returning posters are.

While I get wanting to end some of the piling on, I would hope that you want the trash to stay where you put it.

Hate to break it to you but every single person that's insinuated I'm Poster X or Poster Y or Poster Z has been wrong. I'm not a returning member.

I've noticed in this short period of time that there aren't many newly registered users. If older members are as hostile to all of those as they are in this case, especially users who produce a strongly held opinion about one or two subjects, it would be no surprise that newer members are hostile as well, and perhaps get themselves banned as a result, due to the below.

Clearly there's quite a disparity that exists with the powers that be here where people can virtually get away with murder provided they're an older member (telling people to leave the forums, harassing them in PM, following them around a forum accusing them of being someone else), but newer members so much as breathe a pixel word of something others don't like and they're warned or worse.

Doesn't exactly give the impression of a welcoming community.

[Dion]

What kind of example are we setting when a new member starts posting and everyone starts disecting/discussing thier posts and join dates in an attempt to find out what former banned poster they are. If we're wrong, doesn't it make this site look not so inviting for future members who might be just lurking?

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Trumbull

Hate to break it to you but every single person that's insinuated I'm Poster X or Poster Y or Poster Z has been wrong. I'm not a returning member.

I've noticed in this short period of time that there aren't many newly registered users. If older members are as hostile to all of those as they are in this case, especially users who produce a strongly held opinion about one or two subjects, it would be no surprise that newer members are hostile as well, and perhaps get themselves banned as a result, due to the below.

Clearly there's quite a disparity that exists with the powers that be here where people can virtually get away with murder provided they're an older member, but newer members so much as breathe a pixel word of something others don't like and they're warned or worse.

Doesn't exactly give the impression of a welcoming community.

An older member will often get the benefit of doubt based on their posting history but that doesn't mean they get away with murder. In fact many of us here have infractions on our records that no one else can see except for the moderators.

Newbies on the other hand have to be careful until they've estblished a posting history.

[CaramonLS]

Originally Posted by Trumbull

Hate to break it to you but every single person that's insinuated I'm Poster X or Poster Y or Poster Z has been wrong. I'm not a returning member.

I've noticed in this short period of time that there aren't many newly registered users. If older members are as hostile to all of those as they are in this case, especially users who produce a strongly held opinion about one or two subjects, it would be no surprise that newer members are hostile as well, and perhaps get themselves banned as a result, due to the below.

Clearly there's quite a disparity that exists with the powers that be here where people can virtually get away with murder provided they're an older member (telling people to leave the forums, harassing them in PM, following them around a forum accusing them of being someone else), but newer members so much as breathe a pixel word of something others don't like and they're warned or worse.

Doesn't exactly give the impression of a welcoming community.

Well, I wouldn't exactly portray yourself as innocent here. You haven't exactly conducted yourself in the most polite and respectful manner.

It isn't the most welcoming community and it won't be if you don't take some time to learn how things are here, just like on any forum. When arguing with someone in the OT forum, and you start saying things like "according to XXX, I'm right", then citing no sources, you're going to be called out for it. That might fly other places, but it doesn't work here.

[rubecube]

I kind of don't buy the second chances thing when a lot of these guys have been repeatedly sin binned before being permabanned. It's not like guys like moon and puckluck and moon weren't warned repeatedly, and even when they weren't banned they were constantly skirting the line and deliberately ruining threads with the majority of their posts. So when they return and start pulling the same crap again, it rightly pisses people off who are trying to not have their threads destroyed with the same garbage, and, quite frankly, it makes a joke out of the original banning.

[CaramonLS]

Originally Posted by Dion

What kind of example are we setting when a new member starts posting and everyone starts disecting/discussing thier posts and join dates in an attempt to find out what former banned poster they are. If we're wrong, doesn't it make this site look not so inviting for future members who might be just lurking?

In fairness, it is usually the ones with the motor mouths who have that happen to them.

[Trumbull]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

Well, I wouldn't exactly portray yourself as innocent here. You haven't exactly conducted yourself in the most polite and respectful manner.

It isn't the most welcoming community and it won't be if you don't take some time to learn how things are here, just like on any forum. When arguing with someone in the OT forum, and you start saying things like "according to XXX, I'm right", then citing no sources, you're going to be called out for it. That might fly other places, but it doesn't work here.

Let's put things into appropriate context:



These were my first posts in OT, the two highlighted posts (posts #2 and #3 of that section ever) were, quite harmless. Yet, after the second one, I was completely barraged from that point and on by members accusing me of being other posters, going to other topics to call me this members, sending me PM's of "welcome back Poster X/Y/Z".

I see no justification for these sort of actions. They are incredibly immature and speak more of cyber bullies than people who are simply reluctant to allow "mouthy" outsiders into their club.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Ken basically created this thread and these rules because of your uproar, Trumbull. Time to stop playing the victim and get over it.

[Trumbull]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

Ken basically created this thread and these rules because of your uproar, Trumbull. Time to stop playing the victim and get over it.

There are two sides to every story, it would be polite to allow others to speak too. Thanks.

[CaramonLS]

You took a broad swipe at posters in the thread and you didn't except it to turn toxic?

[Trumbull]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

You took a broad swipe at posters in the thread and you didn't except it to turn toxic?

That was a broad swipe at society in general (especially in the US where those examples took place), which is why I didn't single out any poster(s). Which is why it's good to hear two sides of a story before going flip-out bananas.

It wouldn't be a problem if people weren't so quick to jump down new member's throat.

I fully get, especially after the PM from ken, why some people are overly sensitive to new members posting, but I don't see why that justifies the kind of harassment and bullying I had to endure over those harmless posts.

I think we can all agree that acting in a more civil manner is a far better idea for all parties going forward.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

In fairness, it is usually the ones with the motor mouths who have that happen to them.

Why engage the motor mouths by egging them on? From what i've seen, topics/threads get derialied with the back and forth. Both sides are responsible and need to reel it in IMO.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Trumbull

There are two sides to every story, it would be polite to allow others to speak too. Thanks.

In fairness, MMF has a point. You actively engaged those you thought were bullying you and helped create the mess in that thread. Don't respond to posts you feel unfairly attack you. Report them if you feel they are that bad and let the moderators deal with it. Take responsibility for your own actions, learn from it, and move on.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

Ken basically created this thread and these rules because of your uproar, Trumbull. Time to stop playing the victim and get over it.

I told you ken0042 was my favourite........