Temporary foreign workers scandal

[rubecube]

Sorry if fata, but didn't see anything when searched. Kind of surprised no one is talking about this. Might be that it's a bigger story here in B.C. than Alberta. Here is sort of a recap of the gist of it:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/britis...####-1.2621151

The government responded by suspending restaurants from using the program:

http://www.ctvnews.ca/business/kenne...gram-1.1790727

Opposition calls for an audit of the program:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/temp...udit-1.2632231

Again, it's probably a bigger deal in places where there are less jobs, but obviously I think a review is in order.

[Flash Walken]

It was sort of being discussed here:

http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showthread.php?t=127036

[FlamesAddiction]

There was this recent story out of Weyburn as well:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskat...emps-1.2619644

There was a thread somewhere that went OT on this topic.

I agree, a review is needed. Some towns really need the program, but it sounds like there is too much abuse in other places.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

It was sort of being discussed here:

http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showthread.php?t=127036

Aye. Well maybe a mod can merge them and change the thread title on the other one.

[Flash Walken]

The program -- originally designed to address shortages of skilled workers, not to recruit low-skilled labour -- has ballooned from about 100,000 people in 2002 to as many as 338,000 now working across the country, according to the C.D. Howe report.

The institute, a non-partisan public policy think-tank, said changes to the program enacted between 2002 and 2013 made it much easier for employers to hire temporary foreign workers. Alberta and B.C. were particular benefactors.

But amid that hiring bonanza, the study concluded, a cumulative 3.9 percentage points was added to the unemployment rates in the two provinces.

"These policy changes occurred even though there was little empirical evidence of shortages in many occupations," wrote the report's author, economist Dominique Gross.
"When controlling for differences across provinces, I find that changes to the TFWP that eased hiring conditions accelerated the rise in unemployment rates in Alberta and British Columbia."

The Conservative government has since tightened the regulations, but there have been a spate of high-profile allegations in recent months about an array of employers -- particularly restaurants -- abusing the program.
The C.D. Howe study, however, said that although the government's 2013 crackdown on the program was a welcome move, it's probably insufficient because of the absence of solid data about the state of Canada's labour market.

That echoes concerns raised by Don Drummond, a respected economist approached by the Tories five years ago to examine Canada's labour market. He gave the government 69 recommendations to improve the quality of the information on the labour market, but says precious few have been implemented.

Gross recommended several reforms to the program, including compiling better data on whether labour shortages actually exist in Canada.

She also called for increasing the cost of a temporary foreign worker permit for companies, and said employers should face tougher rules forcing them to prove they've truly been unable to fill jobs with Canadian workers.

Until then, Gross wrote, a temporary quota should be placed on the number of foreign workers permitted to come to Canada.

http://www.ctvnews.ca/business/kenne...gram-1.1790727

[Ashartus]

Unfortunately all the abuse of the program has made it much more difficult to use it for the intended purpose - hiring skilled workers that you can't find in Canada.

[undercoverbrother]

So what drove the abuse/misuse of the program.

Why was it being used to hire "unskilled" labour?

[Wormius]

I think it depends on the skill. This was, I thought, more for trades-based skills that were in high demand, but not really the kind of skills that would qualify for an TN or H1B visa.

[Cowboy89]

Tough subject.

The TFW program by it's very nature seems to give opportunities for franchise owners to exploit the TFW's like was described in the Tim Horton's situation in Fernie and Crowsnest Pass. Also seems on the surface to be wrong by bringing in unskilled workers when there was no evidence that there were not qualified Canadians who were available.

That said, ignoring nationality, it seems there's some substance to the arguement that TFW's do a better job and are more willing to work graveyard hours and holidays. Afterall, why would McDonald's be willing to pay more than $2/hr more for a TFW than a Canadian employee? That all said, I find it ironic how many deride the inequality of opportunity in Canada and demand a meritocracy-based society domestically, but the second TFW's are involved, meritocracy on a global level and brought into your own backyard, it becomes a 'race to the bottom' and undignified.

[Maccalus]

My biggest problem with the program in it's current form is that there should be a strong path to allow these temporary workers become Canadian citizens and fill these gaps in the labour market. We shouldn't be looking at bringing in people just to roll them out after 2 years for new people.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Cowboy89

That said, ignoring nationality, it seems there's some substance to the arguement that TFW's do a better job and are more willing to work graveyard hours and holidays. Afterall, why would McDonald's be willing to pay more than $2/hr more for a TFW than a Canadian employee?

Might be that foreign workers are more easily manipualted/intimidated into doing this kind of work and maybe not getting compensated appropriately for it.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/britis...630278?cmp=rss

[Bobblehead]

Another problem was what statistics were being used to justify the need for workers.

The Conservatives, until recently, had been using job vacancy information from online classified websites such as Kijiji to help identify labour needs and whether temporary foreign workers were required in certain sectors.

In an examination of Statistics Canada surveys released Tuesday, Auditor General Michael Ferguson said governments and the private sector are regularly unable to access important economic and demographic information on small geographic areas and certain sections of the population.

The end result is that various governments and groups can’t always get an accurate employment picture in certain cities and regions of the country, while some communities may not receive the programs and services they need.

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/na...272/story.html

[Cowboy89]

Originally Posted by rubecube

Might be that foreign workers are more easily manipualted/intimidated into doing this kind of work and maybe not getting compensated appropriately for it.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/britis...630278?cmp=rss

Absolutely I can see this as being the rationale at the Franchisee level. At the corporate level they wouldn't be modeling their labor inputs with a basic underlying assumption that they are exploiting their workers though.

[sfpipes]

As someone connected to a restaurant franchise that has foreign workers, I have many thoughts on the program itself and the recent issues with it. I believe that there are owners and operators who abuse this program. I believe the number of abusers is small. I don't believe that the abuse is limited to the service industry. I think it's is only a matter of time before we hear of more abuses of the program from other sectors. Most owners I know or have heard about were just offered the opportunity to staff their restaurants with foreign workers and took that opportunity in order to operate more efficiently and for longer hours.

This is a trying time for us and our workers. Whatever you think about foreign workers or the program itself, the bottom line is these are people who could have their lives drastically changed in the next little while. I'll leave it at that for now as I need to head back to work. I should also be careful with what information I divulge, but would be glad to share more of our side of the story as I read more posts later.

[Tron_fdc]

For sure this includes nannies. I know a few people that have hired Phillipino nannies and there are horror stories about the pay and treatment some get from "employers".

The 7-11 beside me is staffed with TFW's, and it's awesome. It seems to me that it's a case of the program working, because before they were all there it was in shambles (run by us whiteys). No one wanted the shifts or pay, and the store was a mess.

Too bad there are people out there abusing the program, because I'm sure there are plenty of success stories out there. Does someone audit the employers running within the program? Maybe the franchise head offices should pull the franchise (or fine them) if they find abuses?

[northcrunk]

I am really curious about how many wealthy familes have purchased a fast food franchise just to make it easier to bring familly and friends over to Canada?

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by fotze

Ya, if I'm at some event and someone starts talking about their nanny or friends nannies I will just walk away. The expectations people have for these people for less than minimum wage can be borderline evil. I'd rather just bury my head in sand and not know that an acquaintance is a POS.

We have had families on our kids teams bring their nannies to the rink to dress the kids, while they stood there and chatted.

[GP_Matt]

Originally Posted by fotze

Ya, if I'm at some event and someone starts talking about their nanny or friends nannies I will just walk away. The expectations people have for these people for less than minimum wage can be borderline evil. I'd rather just bury my head in sand and not know that an acquaintance is a POS.

I have heard this a few times now.
Is it possible to hire a nanny through the TFW program and not be borderline slavery or is that a requirement?

[Swift]

After reading the other thread, I figured I should post about my experience.

I first came to Canada on a 1 year working holiday visa. I met my future wife whilst here, but when my visa expired I had to go back home to Ireland. After 6 months and obviously wanting to return to Calgary, I came across a job agency who was hiring TFWs for a food distribution warehouse. I applied, interviewed over the phone, and they paid for my flight over to Canada, which they're obliged to do under the rules. They're also obliged to provide accommodation, but I turned that offer down as obviously, I had a place to stay. To my knowledge, the company owned some properties close to the warehouse, and they housed 4 guys at a time there. I'm not sure if they charged them rent.

This was in 2007, and I guess no Canadians wanted to work in the warehouse. It was night shift (5pm-3:30am) and the pay was pretty decent - $16 an hour to start, it went up to $18 the next year, and by the time I left the next year, I believe I was making close to $20. On top of that, the company paid out productivity bonuses on every payday (based on number of items picked and number of errors made) A lot of guys didn't make those bonuses, but if you did it could be anywhere between $50-$200 extra per pay.

As I said, I'm not sure many Canadians wanted to work there. The staff was made up of Canadian guys who'd been there for years, and then about 30-40 TFWs (mostly Mexican and about 10 Caribbean guys and me) Speaking to the long term guys, I'd hear stories of how before the TFWs came in, guys would have to work 3-4 hours overtime every night to get the pallets on the trucks.

At no point did I hear of any TFWs being mistreated, and not that I ever asked, but I assume we all made the same wage. Pretty much all were hardworking - over time, some were let go due to not being all that great at the job. In my time there (2.5 years) I can only remember two Canadian kids (about 18 years old) joining and lasting more than a month. I got married, got my permanent residency and moved on.

Now, maybe this experience isn't typical of other TFW experiences, but I think that's the point. It's unfair to tar all TFWs and employers with the same brush. In my situation, I think it was a win-win for everyone involved. The company was able to meet their promises to their clients and build business, and the employees got to make money and spend it in Calgary or send it home to their families.

[ken0042]

Just to clarify, the live-in caregiver program is different from the TFW program.

My wife came over to Canada as a nanny. Her first employer did treat her as a servant- made her work long hours with no overtime or even any consideration. However she then went on to work with two other families; both of whom were great. The first one was a temporary placement and they always paid her overtime if they were late. The second family would just give her time off in lieu; and I would say my wife probably got the benefit there. (For example- Boxing week off; and that wasn't part of her 3 weeks vacation.)