CSEC caught spying on Canadians

[rubecube]

Looks like we're not that much better than our neighbours to the South.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/csec...ents-1.2517881

A top secret document retrieved by U.S. whistleblower Edward Snowden and obtained by CBC News shows that Canada's electronic spy agency used information from the free internet service at a major Canadian airport to track the wireless devices of thousands of ordinary airline passengers for days after they left the terminal.

After reviewing the document, one of Canada's foremost authorities on cyber-security says the clandestine operation by the Communications Security Establishment Canada ( CSEC) was almost certainly illegal.

Ronald Deibert told CBC News: "I can't see any circumstance in which this would not be unlawful, under current Canadian law, under our Charter, under CSEC's mandates."

The spy agency is supposed to be collecting primarily foreign intelligence by intercepting overseas phone and internet traffic, and is prohibited by law from targeting Canadians or anyone in Canada without a judicial warrant.

As CSEC chief John Forster recently stated: "I can tell you that we do not target Canadians at home or abroad in our foreign intelligence activities, nor do we target anyone in Canada.

Also sounds like the defense minister and the PMO may have known about it. We may need an "Ongoing Stephen Harper Transgressions" thread.

[malcolmk14]

I've always just assumed that with smartphone technology that my movements and locations can be traced back a certain amount...

[AcGold]

yeah I just assume pretty much everything is tracked and recorded now, too much to even sift through so it's stored until needed. Why wouldn't they, everything you put on a computer or smartphone has the click to agree to terms and conditions which nobody reads. The general population just has to protect each other from being extorted with it. Windows has so many backdoors and security holes that it's a little bit naive to think any digital information is secure.

[drewboy12]

Originally Posted by malcolmk14

I've always just assumed that with smartphone technology that my movements and locations can be traced back a certain amount...

That is the sad/scary thing about government spying though. So much of the population just assumes its happening and doesn't care. Including myself. I have nothing to hide. But besides the fact, its insane that we allow everything we do be tracked. It is pretty messed up... Canada and America has always been so proud of "freedom", yet our freedom seems to be a smoke screen.

[CaptainCrunch]

Freedom has always been a smoke screen, I don't know why anyone thinks any differently. Freedom. Freedom is pretty much granted in small bundles and taken away in large packages in the name of security.

Is there a definable balance? probably not it depends on outside and internal events, but there's no such thing as freedom.

I think in 1984 they defined freedom as whatever the government deemed it to be.

[jammies]

This is why I do all my illegal surfing under the nom de internets Rubecube.

[Northendzone]

omg, the government can tell i go to dairy queen and chicken on the way (the mackenzie towne location - so no basement action) a few times per week.......

i wonder if they can lock onto springs1 signal and give the wait staff of any restuarant she walks into a heads up?

[AcGold]

Originally Posted by drewboy12

That is the sad/scary thing about government spying though. So much of the population just assumes its happening and doesn't care. Including myself. I have nothing to hide. But besides the fact, its insane that we allow everything we do be tracked. It is pretty messed up... Canada and America has always been so proud of "freedom", yet our freedom seems to be a smoke screen.

I think it's more complex than that. I care, everyone I know cares about the invasion of privacy and removal of freedom. However, the personal benefit of having a small device that can be a flashlight, calculator, phone, computer, handheld gaming device, alarm clock, music player, document browser, gps device, video and photo camera outweigh the possible downsides to the individual.

I tried going with a piece of crap burner for years and it's lifechanging having a smartphone, it's just so beneficial to have one of these things it's tough to rationalize not having one if you aren't a criminal and even more so if you are involved in the white collar side of business. The time saved having all my messages, emails, updates displayed immediately and simultaneously when I wake up is drastic. I used to have to log on to my computer, wait for it to start and then go through all my emails, check my phone and then turn off the computer and monitor; now it's a click and a swipe and I can see it all in 10 seconds. I can check my investments and talk to my parents in Hawaii as I walk down the hallway, that's so beneficial that it's worth the potential loss of privacy even if it shouldn't be.

[photon]

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/201...porn-spy.shtml

[jammies]

Originally Posted by photon

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/201...porn-spy.shtml

Porn spy? I think my resume speaks for itself - when can I start?

[19Yzerman19]

Am I the only one nerdy enough to read "C-Sec" and immediately assume this was in reference to Mass Effect?

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by photon

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/201...porn-spy.shtml

Ah, yes, the age old moral outrage head fake.

Pretty effective tool at distorting the message.

[opendoor]

Originally Posted by Northendzone

omg, the government can tell i go to dairy queen and chicken on the way (the mackenzie towne location - so no basement action) a few times per week.......

i wonder if they can lock onto springs1 signal and give the wait staff of any restuarant she walks into a heads up?

Would you care if the government went through your house while you were at work as long as you didn't notice? I mean, as long as they put everything back where it was Stasi style, what does it matter? You've got nothing to hide, right?

Obviously anyone using a connected device should understand that nothing they do on it is necessarily private, but I'd prefer my own government didn't conduct illegal surveillance on its citizens.

[ken0042]

Originally Posted by opendoor

Would you care if the government went through your house while you were at work as long as you didn't notice? I mean, as long as they put everything back where it was Stasi style, what does it matter? You've got nothing to hide, right?

I guess a major difference is what you are doing in public as opposed to in the privacy of your own home. Taking the technology out of this; let's say somebody from the gov't was checking out what books, magazines, and newspapers people were reading in the airport. Would you expect to have privacy in that respect? At an airport- no. However I would expect to have privacy about what I am reading at home.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by opendoor

but I'd prefer my own government didn't conduct illegal surveillance on its citizens.

For my education, can you please expand on why this is illegal.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by ken0042

I guess a major difference is what you are doing in public as opposed to in the privacy of your own home. Taking the technology out of this; let's say somebody from the gov't was checking out what books, magazines, and newspapers people were reading in the airport. Would you expect to have privacy in that respect? At an airport- no. However I would expect to have privacy about what I am reading at home.

What about writing in a diary. What you write in it at home is private, but what you write in it at the airport (or publically) is not?

[opendoor]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

For my education, can you please expand on why this is illegal.

As far as I know, the CSEC isn't really authorized to do this kind of surveillance within Canada.

[opendoor]

Originally Posted by ken0042

I guess a major difference is what you are doing in public as opposed to in the privacy of your own home. Taking the technology out of this; let's say somebody from the gov't was checking out what books, magazines, and newspapers people were reading in the airport. Would you expect to have privacy in that respect? At an airport- no. However I would expect to have privacy about what I am reading at home.

Unless I'm misunderstanding what happened, the CSEC used info gathered at airports to track users' movement and whatnot once they left the airport.

Granted, this particular instance isn't as bad as some of what we've seen in the US, but it sounds like this was a bit of a trial run for a larger system. And with what we've seen from the NSA in the US, I have little doubt they'd simply stop there.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by opendoor

As far as I know, the CSEC isn't really authorized to do this kind of surveillance within Canada.

Thanks for the response, and this is not a slight to you, but are any other posters able to comment/provide link?

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by opendoor

As far as I know, the CSEC isn't really authorized to do this kind of surveillance within Canada.

I don't believe that's correct, if I remember CSEC has a pretty broad mandate. Their signal gathering is intended to provide key information concerning the national security of Canda so defense and the government can make the best decisions possible.

Unlike something like the CIA that is not allowed to operate domestically there is no such block for CSEC. They can gather electronic intelligence anywhere that they want.