My annual Trans Canada Hiway rant

[Sylvanfan]

Well it's summer, and I had to drive the Trans Canada to Kamloops to visit my folks and than on to the lower Mainland to see the wife's grandma. Every time I hit that patch where the 4 lane ends in the park to outside of Kamloops where the freeway starts up again, I become the most miserable tourettes case you ever heard. It is the one thing guaranteed to rile me up and make me miserable. Probably more so than a game 7 SCF loss to Tampa Bay.

Now I always thought Canada a G8 country was pretty wealthy, and had a nice educated work force. Yet we have a third world hi-way connecting our nations largest port city, and as the only hi-way linking the countries number 3 and 5 cities. That stretch around Golden is an absolute disaster as any day of the week you're going to drive 40 going in and out of Golden for at least 20 km. It is the worst stretch of hi-way in the civilized world if you ask me. Hell Brazil has better hi-ways for crying out loud.

I heard that it was costing approximately 1 million dollars per kilometer of road to twin hi-way 11 from Red Deer to Sylvan Lake. Now that’s an easy job that can be done on the surface even though a fair bit of cut and fill was required for some portions. The Liberal government basically p*ssed away 2 billion dollars on a gun registry that has accomplished nothing to this day. There is 400km of road that MUST BE IMPROVED between Banff and Kamloops. That allows 5 million per kilometer for improvements. Now I'll admit that it's going to be a challenge in some of those mountains. There is also the whole national park issue, but really building a better hi-way through the parks or even around the parks would have a positive long term effect I think. I was on a stretch of hi-way in Europe running through the Dolomites in Austria into Northern Italy that was basically an entire stretch of Bridges and Tunnels. If you've ever been to the Island of Oahu in Hawaii the H3 is the same thing allowing people to get to the North side of the Island in 20 minutes from Honolulu.

It's time to fess up and realize the traffic demands on that hi-way demand 4 lanes, and that the way to accomplish it is to look at elevating a good portion of the hi-way, and tunneling long stretches in places. It's even worth visiting the idea of alternate routes around some of those stretches. I imagine it was purposefully built to follow along the path of the CPR, which was based on an 1800’s trail. Since than we have developed something I think you’ve all heard of called an aircraft which allows us to pick out and survey an easier path to build a major road way. But on the flip side there are other stretches where a lot less work would be required and 1.5 per kilometer should be more than adequate to improve the road. The need is there now, and it's only going to grow in the future. The cost of building the hi-way now will pale to what it will cost to do it 20 years from now. If they can build a bride to connect PEI and it's 25000 people to the mainland, why the hell can't they build a hi-way intended to serve as the major route connecting the entire country to the West coast?

Anyways that concludes this years version of my why does the Trans Canada still suck rant. I'm ashamed as a Canadian tax payer at how much of my money is wasted on ad scam, or the Gun Registry, or Ralph Klein jetting around when he should drive, and countless other crap by both Federal and Provincial Governments in every region of our country when it seems pretty obvious to me that our one major national hi-way is in complete shambles. I apologize for the length of the post, but it doesn't even begin to descrive how enraged I get every time I'm on that stretch of disgracefull road.

[Clarkey]

I would fully agree. The number of people that have been killed around that Golden stretch is too high. I'm not sure what is stopping them from adding another 2 lanes but cost and reserved park land are not good enough excuses if you ask me.

Maybe the only way to do this is to reroute the high way away from Golden and there is some town lobby stopping this for fear of it hurting the towns economy.

[Resolute 14]

Too bad that stretch of highway isnt in Ontario. The feds would be all over saving the lives of Ontarians... :unsure:

Seriously though, the BC government is planning on twinning the Caribou Highway between Cache Creek and Prince George, but not the TransCanada. Good call BC...

[Sylvanfan]

Originally posted by Snakeeye@Jul 17 2005, 03:27 PM
Too bad that stretch of highway isnt in Ontario. The feds would be all over saving the lives of Ontarians... :unsure:

Seriously though, the BC government is planning on twinning the Caribou Highway between Cache Creek and Prince George, but not the TransCanada. Good call BC...

Well they have been working on the TransCanada, but like I say they're not going about it the right way. I would think the TransCanada should qualify for federal money as it is the countries national hi-way. That stretch from Cache Creek to Prince George is some very easy landscape to build hi-way on, at least as far as B.C. is concerned. So I imagine because it's cheap to build thats why they're doing it. Of course like I say the need is there for both these roads to be 4 lanes now, and it's not gonig to be cheaper to do it 5 years from now. Of course had people had any imagination they would have just built 4 lane hi-ways in the 50's and spent the extra 20% that it would have cost them.

[FireFly]

Originally posted by Sylvanfan+Jul 17 2005, 09:43 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Sylvanfan @ Jul 17 2005, 09:43 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Snakeeye@Jul 17 2005, 03:27 PM
Too bad that stretch of highway isnt in Ontario. The feds would be all over saving the lives of Ontarians... :unsure:

Seriously though, the BC government is planning on twinning the Caribou Highway between Cache Creek and Prince George, but not the TransCanada. Good call BC...

Well they have been working on the TransCanada, but like I say they're not going about it the right way. I would think the TransCanada should qualify for federal money as it is the countries national hi-way. That stretch from Cache Creek to Prince George is some very easy landscape to build hi-way on, at least as far as B.C. is concerned. So I imagine because it's cheap to build thats why they're doing it. Of course like I say the need is there for both these roads to be 4 lanes now, and it's not gonig to be cheaper to do it 5 years from now. Of course had people had any imagination they would have just built 4 lane hi-ways in the 50's and spent the extra 20% that it would have cost them. [/b][/quote]
It does qualify for federal money, and the feds are putting money towards it's upgrade... they're just starting in Saskatchewan first.....

[Claeren]

I remember reading a VERY old series of Calgary Herald's in the archives and the Alps-hardened Swiss engineers that were brought in to build/consult on the highway were all complaining day after day that our methods were primitive and that they could not fathom not spending a little more money to do it right the first time instead of having to rebuild it in 20 years.

Looks like they were right. The only thing they they got wrong was our tolarance for substandard planning. Looks we merely *should* have rebuilt it 20 years ago, as oppsed to *have* to have rebuilt it.


Claeren.

[browna]

Hindsight would solve a lot of problems.
Deerfoot would've been like the new stretch from just past the Okotoks. 3 lanes wide.
At this point, that stretch between Lake Louise (Banff to LL is ok) and Kamloops needs to be done, but it will take a lot of cash, and, of course, a lot of that cash will be through the constant legal fights and cutting the chains off the people attaching themselves to trees when the buldozers come rolling in.

It took over a year to recontruct that bridge on that steep hill outside of Golden, and can only imagine the cost. Times that project by about 30x, and that will be the scope of project.

[Vulcan]

I admit they have to upgrade but 4 lane divided highways are boring. The white nuckler prairie drivers are kind of amusing in the mountains if they weren't so frustrating to follow.

[Looger]

Originally posted by Snakeeye@Jul 17 2005, 03:27 PM
Too bad that stretch of highway isnt in Ontario. The feds would be all over saving the lives of Ontarians... :unsure:

Seriously though, the BC government is planning on twinning the Caribou Highway between Cache Creek and Prince George, but not the TransCanada. Good call BC...

the highway one is bad, yes, but the infamous roger's pass near golden isn't exactly prairie.

there's sections there that are simply impossible to 'add' to, without significant mountain carving. it's really that simple.

and for the record the 97 is a MAJOR priority for other serious reasons as well, not the least of which is the port facilities planned for prince rupert, the rail cargo terminal in prince george, and the closure of edmonton's municipal airport - lufthansa (sp?) is putting in a cargo terminal at the airport and it's going international - all the northern air transfers will be out of here now.

there are non-stop convoys of motorhomes on the 97 every summer, and traffic is bad enough without them.

BC has issues, let me tell you.

but the plan on the cariboo highway is something that HAS to happen.

[BlackRedGold25]

Originally posted by Snakeeye@Jul 17 2005, 03:27 PM
Too bad that stretch of highway isnt in Ontario. The feds would be all over saving the lives of Ontarians... :unsure:

For the most part, the Trans Canada Highway is only two lanes in Ontario.

[Resolute 14]

It also isnt very mountainous, and likely there is not a stretch that kills as many people as the rogers pass stretch does.

[BlackRedGold25]

Originally posted by Snakeeye@Jul 18 2005, 01:16 AM
It also isnt very mountainous, and likely there is not a stretch that kills as many people as the rogers pass stretch does.

Neither is New Brunswick's portion and they're well on their way to four lanes.

[Displaced Flames fan]

Well, I had the pleasure of driving both the Trans Canada from Golden to Kamloops and the 97 North from Kamloops to 100 Mile a few weeks ago. Not sure what all the complaints are about actually. The intermountain roads in the States aren't any better. In fact, I found the Rogers Pass area to be just as good as Vail and Loveland passes on I-70 in Colorado.

I agree about the 97 though, it could use another couple of lanes.

The scenery offsets any driving anxieties for me.

[Reaper]

I love how people are claiming that the road through Roger's Pass and Crowsnest Pass kills people when the majority of accidents in those areas are caused by driving too fast for road conditions.

The road didn't kill the people; the people killed themselves by driving too fast, following too close or not paying due attention.

[habernac]

The Trans Canada is fine over there in BC, I just drove it to Regina on the weekend and was embarassed that this was our national highway. What a sorry excuse for a cow trail. It was like riding a roller coaster. Holes everywhere, dips, dives, etc. What a piece of crap.

[Buzzard]

I've driven most of the major highways in BC many times and feel safe, although I believe change is needed on #1. It's true, the majority of accidents are caused by careless driving. But I believe a lot of the carelessness is a result of impatient drivers. It's not unusual at all to be stuck behind a vehicle moving 60 kmh for many miles because of a lack of passing opportunity. It's then when people make dangerous driving decisions. I've seen it dozens of times, and a lot of very close calls. Although not bothered by it, the highway really should be twinned from Kamloops east for the amount of trucks and tourists that use it. It is a major commercial route, not just a scenic goat trail anymore, and should really be upgraded as such. Short stretches at a time, if that's only what economics allow, but it needs to be started sooner than later.

Although the Coquihalla for the most part was built as a brand new highway, it is a great example of what a mountain highway can be, without looking to European models. It's a dream to drive on in spite of the obstacles encountered during it's construction.

Although the Cariboo needs a makeover as well, it's fairly obvious it was a politically motivated decision to do that work first.

As far as dangerous highways go in BC, I'd say between Prince George and Prince Rupert takes the cake. One 60 mile stretch in particular between PG and Vanderhoof especially. For the amount of traffic, there has got to be at least as many, if not more fatalities there than anywhere in the province. Ironically, it's a relatively flat (rolling) section of road. Deadly combination of moose, drunks, weather, and poor drivers seem to be the problem.

[Clarkey]

Originally posted by Reaper@Jul 18 2005, 02:47 AM
I love how people are claiming that the road through Roger's Pass and Crowsnest Pass kills people when the majority of accidents in those areas are caused by driving too fast for road conditions.

The road didn't kill the people; the people killed themselves by driving too fast, following too close or not paying due attention.

Well obviously, but if it was divided you wouldn't have as many head on collisions. I don't want to have to worry about some bad driver going too fast on a windy mountain road hitting me head on.

[Looger]

Originally posted by Buzzard@Jul 18 2005, 03:55 AM
As far as dangerous highways go in BC, I'd say between Prince George and Prince Rupert takes the cake. One 60 mile stretch in particular between PG and Vanderhoof especially. For the amount of traffic, there has got to be at least as many, if not more fatalities there than anywhere in the province. Ironically, it's a relatively flat (rolling) section of road. Deadly combination of moose, drunks, weather, and poor drivers seem to be the problem.

i hear that.

actually 97 north isn't super-safe either, in the winter it is positively deadly.

the 16 from PG-east is worse for moose, but has less traffic during the summer, than 16 west.

a couple of aprils ago i lost count at 60 moose, many of them on the road. yikes!

and the farther north you go, the more drunks you get.

[Sylvanfan]

The point of this rant is that the TransCanada is Canada's major highway and our major land shipping route that links the West Coast to the rest of Canada. If I'm not mistaken Vancouver is Canada's third largest city, and Calgary is the 5th. The traffic volumn is such that it demands a 4 lane highway to get to Canada's West coast. Be it commercial traffic, or the countless number of tourist that take to that road every summer. Sure a lot of the accidents are a result of peolple driving poorly, but by making it a 4 lane hiway thats divided it does eliminate a lot of the need for people to take the crazy risks that are a result of having drove 60 for a 20km stretch. No hi-way will ever have a perfect safety record because people will always make bad driving descisions, but at least a decent divided 4 lane road should cut down on the number of accidents, and the downtime shouldn't be as severe when an accident happens in a divided 4 lane road. If cost is that much of an issue than make it a toll hiway like the Coquihalla is. I don't remember too many people refusing to drive the Coquihalla because of the toll. Still Canada is not a poor country, and the least we should have is a good transportation infastructure. I mean Brazil can build a 4 lane hiway from Sao Paulo to Curitiba that runs through a mountain pass, why the hell can't our G8 country do the same thing.

[Sylvanfan]

Originally posted by Looger+Jul 18 2005, 02:48 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Looger @ Jul 18 2005, 02:48 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Buzzard@Jul 18 2005, 03:55 AM
As far as dangerous highways go in BC, I'd say between Prince George and Prince Rupert takes the cake. One 60 mile stretch in particular between PG and Vanderhoof especially. For the amount of traffic, there has got to be at least as many, if not more fatalities there than anywhere in the province. Ironically, it's a relatively flat (rolling) section of road. Deadly combination of moose, drunks, weather, and poor drivers seem to be the problem.

i hear that.

actually 97 north isn't super-safe either, in the winter it is positively deadly.

the 16 from PG-east is worse for moose, but has less traffic during the summer, than 16 west.

a couple of aprils ago i lost count at 60 moose, many of them on the road. yikes!

and the farther north you go, the more drunks you get. [/b][/quote]
Yeah Northern B.C. isn't a lot of fun to drive in either, with a lot of Logging Trucks and other people bombing around who probably shouldn't be on the road too. Than throw in the Wild Life and some bad weather and it can be quite an experience. I know I've had to make the drive from Sylvan to Prince Rupert a couple times, and I used to live in P.G. for 5 years before I relocated to Alberta. A tree saved my life by goat creek just outside of McBride one night when I hit some black ice on a bridge deck and launched myself off the road. The Pine pass is probably the most dangerous stretch when traffic volume is considered. Still the population centres and the amount of traffic up there is much less than what there is on the number one. But than again you could flash back 40 years and wonder why they had no vision and built two lane goat trails when they built these roads the first time.