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Old 10-30-2006, 05:59 AM   #1
Lanny_MacDonald
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A very interesting development that has flown completely under radar with the media. First the suspension of Habeus Corpus (the right to challenge the charges level against a defendant) amd now this little beauty that nullifies the Insurrection and Posse Comitatus Acts (10 U.S.C.331 -335 and 18 U.S.C.1385 respectfully). This was buried in a bill which was to outline new approved spending for the military.

John Warner National Defense Authorization Act

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill...bill=h109-5122

SEC. 1076. USE OF THE ARMED FORCES IN MAJOR PUBLIC EMER-
GENCIES.
(a) USE OF THE ARMED FORCES AUTHORIZED.--
(1) IN GENERAL.--Section 333 of title 10, United States
Code, is amended to read as follows:
`` 333. Major public emergencies; interference with State and
Federal law
``(a) USE OF ARMED FORCES IN MAJOR PUBLIC EMERGENCIES.--
(1) The President may employ the armed forces, including the
National Guard in Federal service, to--
``(A) restore public order and enforce the laws of the United
States when, as a result of a natural disaster, epidemic, or
other serious public health emergency, terrorist attack or
incident, or other condition in any State or possession of the
United States, the President determines that--
``(i) domestic violence has occurred to such an extent
that the constituted authorities of the State or possession
are incapable of maintaining public order; and
``(ii) such violence results in a condition described in
paragraph (2); or
``(B) suppress, in a State, any insurrection, domestic
violence, unlawful combination, or conspiracy if such insurrec-
tion, violation, combination, or conspiracy results in a condition
described in paragraph (2).
``(2) A condition described in this paragraph is a condition
that-- ``(A) so hinders the execution of the laws of a State or
possession, as applicable, and of the United States within that
State or possession, that any part or class of its people is
deprived of a right, privilege, immunity, or protection named
in the Constitution and secured by law, and the constituted
authorities of that State or possession are unable, fail, or refuse
to protect that right, privilege, or immunity, or to give that
protection; or
H. R. 5122--323

``(B) opposes or obstructs the execution of the laws of the
United States or impedes the course of justice under those
laws.
``(3) In any situation covered by paragraph (1)(B), the State
shall be considered to have denied the equal protection of the
laws secured by the Constitution.
``(b) NOTICE TO CONGRESS.--The President shall notify Congress
of the determination to exercise the authority in subsection (a)(1)(A)
as soon as practicable after the determination and every 14 days
thereafter during the duration of the exercise of that authority.''.
(2) PROCLAMATION TO DISPERSE.--Section 334 of such title
is amended by inserting ``or those obstructing the enforcement
of the laws'' after ``insurgents''.
(3) HEADING AMENDMENT.--The heading of chapter 15 of
such title is amended to read as follows:
``CHAPTER 15--ENFORCEMENT OF THE LAWS TO
RESTORE PUBLIC ORDER''.
(4) CLERICAL AMENDMENTS.--(A) The tables of chapters
at the beginning of subtitle A of title 10, United States Code,
and at the beginning of part I of such subtitle, are each
amended by striking the item relating to chapter 15 and
inserting the following new item:
``15 Enforcement of the Laws to Restore Public Order ....................................... 331''.
(B) The table of sections at the beginning of chapter 15
of such title is amended by striking the item relating to sections
333 and inserting the following new item:
``333. Major public emergencies; interference with State and Federal law.''.
(b) PROVISION OF SUPPLIES, SERVICES, AND EQUIPMENT.--
(1) IN GENERAL.--Chapter 152 of such title is amended
by adding at the end the following new section:
`` 2567. Supplies, services, and equipment: provision in major
public emergencies
``(a) PROVISION AUTHORIZED.--In any situation in which the
President determines to exercise the authority in section
333(a)(1)(A) of this title, the President may direct the Secretary
of Defense to provide supplies, services, and equipment to persons
affected by the situation.
``(b) COVERED SUPPLIES, SERVICES, AND EQUIPMENT.--The sup-
plies, services, and equipment provided under this section may
include food, water, utilities, bedding, transportation, tentage,
search and rescue, medical care, minor repairs, the removal of
debris, and other assistance necessary for the immediate preserva-
tion of life and property.
``(c) LIMITATIONS.--(1) Supplies, services, and equipment may
be provided under this section--
``(A) only to the extent that the constituted authorities
of the State or possession concerned are unable to provide
such supplies, services, and equipment, as the case may be;
and ``(B) only until such authorities, or other departments or
agencies of the United States charged with the provision of
such supplies, services, and equipment, are able to provide
such supplies, services, and equipment.
H. R. 5122--324

``(2) The Secretary may provide supplies, services, and equip-
ment under this section only to the extent that the Secretary
determines that doing so will not interfere with military prepared-
ness or ongoing military operations or functions.
``(d) INAPPLICABILITY OF CERTAIN AUTHORITIES.--The provision
of supplies, services, or equipment under this section shall not
be subject to the provisions of section 403(c) of the Robert T.
Stafford Disaster Relief and Emergency Assistance Act (42 U.S.C.
5170b(c)).''.
(2) CLERICAL AMENDMENT.--The table of sections at the
beginning of such chapter is amended by adding at the end
the following new item:
``2567. Supplies, services, and equipment: provision in major public emergencies''.
(c) CONFORMING AMENDMENT.--Section 12304(c)(1) of such title
is amended by striking ``No unit'' and all that follows through
``subsection (b),'' and inserting ``Except to perform any of the func-
tions authorized by chapter 15 or section 12406 of this title or
by subsection (b), no unit or member of a reserve component may
be ordered to active duty under this section''.

First the suspension of Habeus Corpus and now the ability to institute marshall law. I wonder how long before the next "al Qaeda attack" that requires the government to assume control over the streets of America? The pieces are falling into place for a legalized totalitarian regime.

I'm not sure what is more outrageous? The fact that these guarantees of our freedom are being stripped away, or the fact that they are done by being buried in other legislation (a brutally dishonest practice in American politics) or the fact that the media is not catching this stuff and keeping the electorate informed.

Discuss!
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Old 10-30-2006, 08:19 AM   #2
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Good lord you are dramatic.

You want ONE example of why the laws needed to change?

How about New Orleans? A major disaster that the Federal Government could not do anything about until requested by state and/or local authorities.

You are a true conspiracy theorist of the highest order, congrats.


Quote:
The pieces are falling into place for a legalized totalitarian regime.
That cant ever be re-elected again.

Good one....
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Old 10-30-2006, 08:32 AM   #3
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Lanny do you live in the United States? Just curious because of your title of the thread, "They hate us for our freedoms...". Because the article seems to be about America...

Still not surpising that is a) not talked about in mainstream media. b) snuck by in another bill.
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Old 10-30-2006, 08:53 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burninator View Post
Lanny do you live in the United States? Just curious because of your title of the thread, "They hate us for our freedoms...". Because the article seems to be about America...

Still not surpising that is a) not talked about in mainstream media. b) snuck by in another bill.
He does live in the US. I think he's quoting a commonly held belief that terrorists in the Middle East attack America because 'they hate our freedom'. Bush said it several times in speeches.

Sneaking in unrelated attachments to bills is a really strange practise in the US, its one of the best ways to pork barrel.
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Old 10-30-2006, 09:34 AM   #5
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I wouldn't say this stuff has been out of the media; I seem to know about it and I don't have my finger on the pulse of US law or anything.

As a bystander though I must admit it does seem a bit concerning. Not V for Vendetta scary, but still.
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Old 10-30-2006, 09:36 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Agamemnon View Post

Sneaking in unrelated attachments to bills is a really strange practise in the US, its one of the best ways to pork barrel.

Agreed fully....been doing things that way for a long time.

Horrible politics IMO.
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Old 10-30-2006, 09:39 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by transplant99 View Post
Agreed fully....been doing things that way for a long time.

Horrible politics IMO.
Is McCain against this? I know he crusades against a lot of 'corrupt' politics, is this issue something he wants to reform?

McCain for (if the Republicans win...) President!
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Old 10-30-2006, 09:53 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Agamemnon View Post
Sneaking in unrelated attachments to bills is a really strange practise in the US, its one of the best ways to pork barrel.
They usually put these unrealated attchments onto bills that willl typically pass without a problem. Right now those bills seem to be military spending bills, very underhanded.
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Old 10-30-2006, 10:13 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by transplant99 View Post
Good lord you are dramatic.

You want ONE example of why the laws needed to change?

How about New Orleans? A major disaster that the Federal Government could not do anything about until requested by state and/or local authorities.

You are a true conspiracy theorist of the highest order, congrats.




That cant ever be re-elected again.

Good one....
Sure thing Tranny. Say, where are those weapons of mass destruction? Speaking of conspiracy theories.

BTW, care to outline who in the Bush administration is "elected"? That's right, only Bush. The other creatures are unelected officials, which means they can knock around Washington for decades (a la Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, Cheney, etc.) and not be accountable to the voters.

You know what is the scariest thing about all of this? People that are too stupid to connect the dots. The constitution, the bill of rights, and the law is under attack and no one does anything to prevent it. All of those "freedoms" continue to be erroded to the point they no longer exist. Nothing to be afraid of though, the "government" is just trying to protect us.
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Old 10-30-2006, 10:34 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Agamemnon View Post
Sneaking in unrelated attachments to bills is a really strange practise in the US, its one of the best ways to pork barrel.
Kent: With our utter annihilation imminent, our federal government has snapped into action. We go live now via satellite to the floor of the United States congress.
Speaker: Then it is unanimous, we are going to approve the bill to evacuate the town of Springfield in the great state of --
Congressman: Wait a minute, I want to tack on a rider to that bill: $30 million of taxpayer money to support the perverted arts.
Speaker: All in favor of the amended Springfield-slash-pervert bill?[everyone boos]
Speaker: Bill defeated. [bangs gavel]
Kent: I've said it before and I'll say it again: democracy simply doesn't work.
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Old 10-30-2006, 10:36 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lanny_MacDonald View Post
All of those "freedoms" continue to be erroded to the point they no longer exist. Nothing to be afraid of though, the "government" is just trying to protect us.
Yeah, but there's been no more terrorist attacks in the USA.
So taking away those freedoms must be working.
I also have a rock that keeps tigers away to sell them.

Homer: Ah, not a bear in sight. The Bear Patrol must be working like a charm!
Lisa: That's specious reasoning, Dad.
Homer: Thank you, honey.
Lisa: By your logic, I could claim that this rock keeps tigers away!
Homer: Uh-huh, and how does it work?
Lisa: It doesn't work.
Homer: Uh-huh.
Lisa: It's just a stupid rock.
Homer: Uh-huh.
Lisa: But I don't see any tigers around here, do you?
Homer: (Looks around) Lisa, I'd like to buy your rock.

And to imagine, our government in Canada would like to put the
same types of "initiatives" into place. Thankfully our courts are putting
a stop to it in the early phases.

ers

Edit: Shazam beat me to a Simpson's quote! Is it just me, or does it seem like
The Simpsons have a quote for everything?

Last edited by ericschand; 10-30-2006 at 10:38 AM.
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Old 10-30-2006, 10:45 AM   #12
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i hate to see erosion of freedoms more than anyone else, but i think the suspension of habeas corpus only applies to noncitizen enemy combatants. is this why you are worried?

maybe they will pull the troops out of iraq to control our own streets? finally they have an exit strategy.
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Old 10-30-2006, 10:47 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by badnarik View Post
i hate to see erosion of freedoms more than anyone else, but i think the suspension of habeas corpus only applies to noncitizen enemy combatants. is this why you are worried?

maybe they will pull the troops out of iraq to control our own streets? finally they have an exit strategy.
The suspension of habeas corpus applies to US citizens as well.

I'm worried because I forsee it coming to Canada, after all, if it's good
enough for the US, why shouldn't we do it too?

ers
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Old 10-30-2006, 10:51 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by badnarik View Post
i hate to see erosion of freedoms more than anyone else, but i think the suspension of habeas corpus only applies to noncitizen enemy combatants. is this why you are worried?
try and prove you're a citizen when you're grabbed and denied the ability to do so.
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maybe they will pull the troops out of iraq to control our own streets? finally they have an exit strategy.
some of the green troops blooded with saddam's sickos undoubtedly will be back in the US for homeland security, though katrina proved that mexican troops and mercenaries will also do the same thing. mercs that work for companies owned by neo-cons are a little fuzzier on the rights of the citizens they grab.
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Old 10-30-2006, 10:56 AM   #15
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Because I saw it on BoingBoing and thought it kind of fit in this thread:

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Old 10-30-2006, 11:37 AM   #16
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Quote:
You know what is the scariest thing about all of this? People that are too stupid to connect the dots
Since I'm "too stupid", I wont bother replying any longer.
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Old 10-30-2006, 11:51 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by transplant99 View Post
Since I'm "too stupid", I wont bother replying any longer.
Did I say you were stupid? Nope, you grabbed that mantle all by yourself.
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Old 10-30-2006, 12:52 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by transplant99 View Post
Since I'm "too stupid", I wont bother replying any longer.
Thats how these folk work. They can never provide hard evidence and when called to task they say things like this:

Did I say you were stupid? Nope, you grabbed that mantle all by yourself

When he said this:

People that are too stupid to connect the dots.

After quoting your post. You don't have to be a rocket scientist to know that he was calling you stupid, but he won't admit that.


P.S.

I don't agree with taking away any rights like this bill proposes. Removing the judical process from the checks and balances is definately very dangerous for all.
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Old 10-30-2006, 01:00 PM   #19
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Thats how these folk work. They can never provide hard evidence
Interesting... Lanny's the only one in this thread who's done anything other than provide pure opinion, he's posted facts and commented (albeit slanted towards his political bias). Pretty lame statement here though, considering you haven't posted any 'hard evidence' to counter what he's saying. I guess thats how 'you folk work'.
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Old 10-30-2006, 01:16 PM   #20
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Quote:
After quoting your post. You don't have to be a rocket scientist to know that he was calling you stupid, but he won't admit that.
How about you take people at their word instead?
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