No Susie, there is no Santa Claus...

[Cheese]

It is a sight to make the average toddler weep with horror: a billboard not only stating categorically that Santa Claus does not exist, but also condemning him as a tool of consumerism.

Santa = Satan?

So where do you stand? Has consumerism gone to far? Do your spend thousands on your kids at Christmas?
Do you think its OK to tell your kids at any age that Santa doesnt exist? Whatabout the Easter Bunny, Calgary Puck and the Tooth Fairy?
I know some families that have done this....doesnt seem to have inadvertently damaged their children.

[4X4]

What a guy... He sounds like a candidate for PETA.

I don't get people that have to be in everyone else's business. Who cares about santa & other fairy tales? This guy has a pickle up his ass over a childhood story aimed to get kids to be good in exchange for toys. Isn't that the first step in learning about the world? You do this, you get that. Work, get paid. Be nice, have friend. Be good, get toys.

The thing that disturbs me about that guy is his "Santa killed Jesus" crap. Is this a tactic to force religous parents to spill the beans? This totally reminds me of that PETA story where they were handing pamphlets to kids with fur wearing parents that said "you mommy kills kittens".

Why can't everyone just live & let live?

[StoneCole]

You guys should watch the Spirit of Christmas by Robert T. Pooner (aka Trey Parker and Matt Stone of South Park). There's actually a battle between Jesus and Santa.

[octothorp]

Originally posted by 4X4@May 27 2005, 08:42 AM
Isn't that the first step in learning about the world? You do this, you get that. Work, get paid. Be nice, have friend. Be good, get toys.

Why not make honest deals with the child and say "if you do all your homework for the rest of the schoolyear, I'll buy you some Pokemon cards" or whatever the kids want these days. That's far more representative of the way the world works, rather than "there's some magical man who rewards all children for good behavior." The reality is that good behavior often goes unnoticed, unless you draw attention to it and make a deal. The real reason parents rely on Santa Claus is so that they have an easy excuse for why the child didn't get the things he or she wanted. Of course, the parents' nostalgia for their own childhood is a factor, too.

Personally, I don't think it would be that tragic if we changed our whole approach to the Santa Claus myth. It would suck for the current generation of children who are exposed to tremendous disappointment, but then they'd only end up hearing it from older kids anyway. After that, there's no lies, so there's no disappointment. Would a world without Santa Claus really be such a horrible place? Personally, I don't see it that way at all.

[transplant99]

I dont get it.

Why would you hold back from your children, all that can be oh so magical about Xmas, and yes that includes SC.

Has it become commercialized? Of course it has, but that has nothing to do with the spirit of what can be at that time of year. SC is merely a figure of that very spirit IMO.

Jeezuz....the PC crowd blows me away sometimes.

[FlamesAddiction]

I like the statement the artist is making, but I also agree that it is not appropriate for children. Children don't know about consumerism and all that other crap. Why ruin it for them? They have a life time ahead of them to fight the man!

[Buff]

Consumerism has gone too far. Christmas is a christian holiday celebrating the birth of the savior Jesus Christ. The gift giving was symbolic of the three wise men who came afar bearing gifts for baby Jesus. Somewhere along the way our greedy nature took over and it became more and more about giving and receiving gifts than it was about the celebration of Jesus.

Along came the legend of Santa and eventually the increasing presence of marketing and whamo! People who don't even believe in Jesus celebrate Christmas because it is a time to relax with family and give and get presents.

I have no problems with spending time with family and giving and receiving gifts, but go to a store and you wouldn't know what Christmas is really about. I worked at a retail store for 6 years and I felt myself hating Christmas. Hating it for what it has become, not for what it is supposed to be. Seeing all the people rushing about trying to get the perfect present for everyone on their list, while I'm supposed to be pushing merchandise out the door. It has become about which retailer can make the most money, who can look good by giving the biggest, most expensive and largest quantity of gifts, or who got the best gifts given to them.

I fall for the hype myself. I spend more time worrying about what to buy, and if they will like the presents, or if I will get what I want, than I do refleting on the true meaning of Christmas. And I hate myself for doing it.

[RougeUnderoos]

Personally, I've never met a toddler that can read. It'd be interesting to see the rest of the poster and how he gets across (if he even tries) to children that Santa doesn't exist. Must be a pretty elaborate yet easily understood image for little kids to understand it.

I think Santa is a pretty harmless myth. Consumerism/materialism is certainly crazy these days but Santa has very little if anything to do with it. It's free as well.

[JiriHrdina]

"People who don't even believe in Jesus celebrate Christmas because it is a time to relax with family and give and get presents."

I understand your point Buff but really is Xmas really that bad. Its turned into a time when family is important and people exchange gifts. I see nothing wrong with that. Everyone is in such a rush with their busy lives what's wrong with having a few days to spend with family. And if some gifts get exchange so be it.

I'm not religious at all but Xmas is very important to me for family reasons. The meaning of Xmas has evolved over the years and is no longer an exclusively Christian event. Again - I see nothing wrong with that.

[photon]

As a new parent I find this whole topic very disconcerting.. the whole consumerism argument aside I can honestly say that I do not like the idea of having my kid believe in Santa (and the tooth fairy and easter bunny et al) only to tell them later it was all a lie.

But I also don't want them to be social outcasts (the only kid who doesn't believe in Santa) and never "be a child". Or worse, have parents after me because my kid told their kid there is no Santa.

Can you teach you child the legend of Santa and have them appreciate it without going over into dressing up as Santa and making the child believe it is real?

[Cheese]

Originally posted by photon@May 27 2005, 01:12 PM
As a new parent I find this whole topic very disconcerting.. the whole consumerism argument aside I can honestly say that I do not like the idea of having my kid believe in Santa (and the tooth fairy and easter bunny et al) only to tell them later it was all a lie.

But I also don't want them to be social outcasts (the only kid who doesn't believe in Santa) and never "be a child". Or worse, have parents after me because my kid told their kid there is no Santa.

Can you teach you child the legend of Santa and have them appreciate it without going over into dressing up as Santa and making the child believe it is real?

Just from my many years as a parent....The years between 1-5 when children are not in school is the BEST time to have Xmas. You can do whatever you want without the external pressures of peers forcing you into purchases that are insane. Like that Arnold Schwartzenegger movie...many people buy into the hype and go WAY out of their way to get the dumbest gift the child never needed in the first place.
Photon...simply teach your child now...in their formative years what YOU want it to mean/be and there is no issue. Parents who spend $3000 on their 2 year olds who have no clue what the gifts are, simply set themselves up for failure.
You also have the choice...if Christian to call the holiday Christams and celebrate that meaning...or if Atheist or other to call it a Winter break.

[Buff]

Originally posted by JiriHrdina@May 27 2005, 11:03 AM
"People who don't even believe in Jesus celebrate Christmas because it is a time to relax with family and give and get presents."

I understand your point Buff but really is Xmas really that bad. Its turned into a time when family is important and people exchange gifts. I see nothing wrong with that. Everyone is in such a rush with their busy lives what's wrong with having a few days to spend with family. And if some gifts get exchange so be it.

I'm not religious at all but Xmas is very important to me for family reasons. The meaning of Xmas has evolved over the years and is no longer an exclusively Christian event. Again - I see nothing wrong with that.

I'm not trying to berate you for doing so. I think it is great that you can have a time to relax and be with family. I wouldn't dare think about taking that away from you because Christmas is a christian event and you're not a christian. Really, what do you and I do differently on Christmas? I still eat a tonne of turkey, spend time with family and exchange gifts. I will go to church for a special Christmas Eve and or Christmas Day service. That is all the good part about Christmas.

The part that gets me is the lead up to Christmas. The advertisements that imply that Christmas is about buying buying buying. Go to the mall in December and you see that it isn't relaxing at all.

[Ironhorse]

Originally posted by RougeUnderoos@May 27 2005, 10:56 AM
Personally, I've never met a toddler that can read. It'd be interesting to see the rest of the poster and how he gets across (if he even tries) to children that Santa doesn't exist. Must be a pretty elaborate yet easily understood image for little kids to understand it.

I think Santa is a pretty harmless myth. Consumerism/materialism is certainly crazy these days but Santa has very little if anything to do with it. It's free as well.

Exactly!

Let them be little....

[V]

Originally posted by Cheese@May 27 2005, 10:18 AM
You also have the choice...if Christian to call the holiday Christams and celebrate that meaning...or if Atheist or other to call it a Winter break.

Holy discrimination Batman! The Atheists can't enjoy the holiday properly if they can't use the exact same word! That's an awful idea!
:P

[Maritime Q-Scout]

oh man, come on people

OPEN YOUR EYES!!!

























SANTA CLAUS EXISTS!!!!

The evidence is all around you:

1. If Santa didn't exist who puts the presents under your tree? Your mom and dad? Think of how tight money is, can they really afford new electronics? Where do they keep this bounty? Do they have a secret portal to another dimension in their closet to store stuff? Maybe they burry it in the yard. I'll tell you what, next Christmas you go outside and dig holes looking for your presents, if you find them I'll send you my presents as well!

2. If Santa doesn't exist, then why does the commerical industry love him and use him so much? He's a fat hairy old guy! Think about it, the majority of shopping is done Christmas time, and who does the majority of shopping? Women! Wouldn't it be smarter to have Santa (if indeed he were fictional) to be tall, dark, handsome, and young? Give the shoppers eye candy while they wait, then they won't be so annoyed with the screaming kids, and long lines. Same logic has having a hot waitress and big gazoogas serving drinks at a bar. People will spend more money! Yeah, fat, hairy, old guy, great marketing gimick!

3. If Santa Claus doesn't exsit then it means the following address is incorrect:

Santa Claus
c/o North Pole
Canada
H0H 0H0

If he indeed does not exist then: who replies to the letters? As well incase you were unaware it's against the law (I believe the term is fraud) to make up a person, give them an address, tell people they're real, then get the public to mail them their likes, dislikes, interest, family members, biographical information about themselves, give an address to where they live, possibly phone number, and even where they can be found! This is especially scary when you factor in little children.

If you or I did that we'd have the book thrown at us, be called sick disgusting, Michael Jackson-esque (without the skin thing, and better noses) creatures, not fit for human society. It wouldn't suprise me if they Cdn gov't brought back the death penalty just for us. So you're telling me that Canada Post is currently enacting on this grave injustice and fraud in our society, everyone's aware of it, yet NO ONE does anything?

Give me a break.

You conspiracy theorists are all insane. Yeah, ok Santa doesn't exist, and there's aliens at Area 51, oh and the Secret Service killed JFK, Elvis is a mailman in Wala Wala Washington, UFOs cause El Nino.

People open your eyes, wake up, and see the spirit of Christmas, and REALITY!!!






SANTA


CLAUS


EXISTS