Baseball in Canada...

[dustyanddaflames]

Hey all, just wanted to start a thread and get some insight from others with the state of baseball within Canada. I know there are a lot of us that played the sport growing up, and I am sure quite a few of us continue to play the sport in some capacity.

I have grown up in a rural setting, and continue to live in the same rural setting, and have seen the baseball numbers for kids within our community continue to plummet. Some now play soccer at the local level, some do summer hockey, and some have chosen to do nothing throughout the summer months. Whether their families are vacationing, or they just want their summers off - the numbers in a lot of communities I am involved in don't lie.

I got this idea for a thread from the MLB one, but didn't think it was right to have a long-winded post about the minor baseball within an MLB topic and steer it off course. But what is it that has baseball numbers so down within our country, and I am looking for insight from everyone (U.S. residents as well may be able to speak from their experiences)?

I know it was a major concern for Baseball Calgary during the early 2000's when I worked with the Calgary Herald for a year. I had numerous discussions with the President and was hoping to get a three-part article put into the paper before my contract had come up. I ran out of time and was never able to complete what I had started.

While doing this column, I attended a MLB ID camp within the city, and 16 kids turned out. Really shocked me to see so little interest to get their names into an MLB database, as their are a lot of talented baseball players throughout the city and province. Example, I grew up in a hamlet of 16 people and within a 20 mile radius we have produced two MLB contracts, one who will be drafted this upcoming year (would have been this year, if not for a bummed shoulder during Team Canada national junior team try-outs), and another playing at LSUS in his second year. So there is talent within our country to be sure.

Here are my thoughts:
1. The season is far to short for those who want to pursue a career in baseball in a lot of provinces throughout our country - unless you want to pack up and move to B.C. or Ontario, both provinces which are producing most, if not all, of our major league talent. I have never played any type of ball past midget AA baseball, but I know for me it was April/May until the first weekend in August - that was it.
2. The costs associated with playing higher end baseball. I don't know what the money situation is for playing baseball within Calgary's city limits, but I can imagine it'd be a costly tag to assure little to no traveling costs.
3. There aren't enough academy's or development programs within our country that will give kids a chance of achieving their dreams. These "pipelines" that are in place are often costly. I know that the Prairie Baseball Academy in Lethbridge is just shy of $3000 for fall baseball, and that is without assurance you will be there in the spring when games commence (which is more on top of the 3k you have already paid).
4. Parents just don't have the time to run their kids around anymore, as the economic crunch has gotten into most homes, and is seeing both parents having to work to try and make ends meet. I know for me, it was just my father that was working, and allowed my mother to drag me all over the province. It seems as though that isn't much in the norm of things anymore.
5. The chances of making the MLB are so slim, that it may deter kids from even wanting to plunge into the sport of baseball. Off the top of most people's heads, they may be able to name one or two Canadian's who have even reached that level.

I just wanted to see what others ideas are as to why baseball is kind of being ransacked by soccer, hockey and video games these days. I think that there are steps being taken to ensure that the sport doesn't die within this country of ours, as you are starting to see more and more high school academy's popping up in Alberta alone (i.e. Vauxhaul, and next fall in my hometown of Oyen).

While I love baseball, the lack of interest is concerning as to where it is headed and I'd love to see what others have to offer. Thanks.

[Puppet Guy]

having not played organized baseball since about 1982 I can't comment on costs or organization, but I usually blame the strike in '94 that cancelled the season for killing the sport in Canada. Seemed that interest just died in the game at that point; I know that crowds were down for a LONG time in the States after '94, but they never recovered north of the 49th. The Jays' fortunes went downhill at that point, and the Expos never recovered. Triple A dried up within ten years, nationally, too. I personally haven't watched a single game since then, and I've spoken to many who had the same reaction.

[SebC]

Originally Posted by dustyanddaflames

I just wanted to see what others ideas are as to why baseball is kind of being ransacked by soccer, hockey and video games these days.

Proabably because soccer, hockey and video games are more fun.

[Cheerio]

At my highschool (~200 kids) there is a total of 2 kids that have played organized baseball at some point in their life (im not one of them). One of them grew up in the States and stopped playing once he moved up here, and the other had an uncle who played in the majors. Everyone else in the school just makes fun of baseball calling it a fat person sport.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by Cheerio

At my highschool (~200 kids) there is a total of 2 kids that have played organized baseball at some point in their life (im not one of them). One of them grew up in the States and stopped playing once he moved up here, and the other had an uncle who played in the majors. Everyone else in the school just makes fun of baseball calling it a fat person sport.

I never miss a chance!



Of course that's now a World Champion fat person!

As for the topic at hand. Baseball is a sport that I think you have to be interested when you're 5! And baseball is losing the sports and ratings war because their WS games are being played at 8:30! Kids can't even watch 3 innings.

Kids don't watch, they have no heroes and they don't want to play.
Football plays at 1pm! Every kid can watch that!

[Cheerio]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

I never miss a chance!



Of course that's now a World Champion fat person!

As for the topic at hand. Baseball is a sport that I think you have to be interested when you're 5! And baseball is losing the sports and ratings war because their WS games are being played at 8:30! Kids can't even watch 3 innings.

Kids don't watch, they have no heroes and they don't want to play.
Football plays at 1pm! Every kid can watch that!

I remember going to a Calgary Cannons game back when I was ~5 and I couldn't even sit there for an inning, it was a beautiful day so I'd rather play street hockey or football or something at least entertaining. But I also remember at about the same age, I went to lots of Flames games (Dark years) because my dad always got the front row company tickets that no one wanted, and I loved it more than anything.

[berto9]

I grew up playing baseball my whole life. Started when i was about 5, I grew up in a small town in BC, and then moved to Alberta when I was 10 years old. Once i came to Alberta I was introduced to the "Rep" Program which until that time, i had never heard of. I Continued to play Peewee AAA, Bantam AAA and Midget AAA, as well as being selected for Team Alberta in 2002-2005 and Canada in 2005. Through those years I attended 4 National Championships and am thrilled that i was a part of the first ever Alberta Midget AAA team to win the National Championships in 2004. After High school i played 2 years of college and had offers to 2 different schools in the states. Lack of interest in school (oops) and a tare in my Labrum and rotator cuff held me back.

After finishing minor baseball, i attended the Prairie Baseball Academy in Lethbridge (where i still am today). Though it was a blast and I would never take any of it back, you need to honestly, truly love the game to play even at this Jr. College level. You show up for opening day camp which starts in September, and the first week you get your ass ran off till you puke. This is where you usually see 5-20% of the guys quit. You basically stay outside on the ball diamond till it snows. Then you start the indoor training and weight training (usually end of Oct till Feb). During February and march you do a bit of traveling to play teams in the States so you can get the feel back of seeing live pitching or taking real ground balls, all before season starts in March and last till mid may (If you make playoffs).
The reason i say this is the huge time commitment playing. Think about going to school until 3, heading over to the ball diamond frm 3:30-6:30 or 7. Come home, eat, do homework, head to bed... Do that Monday to Thursday. Friday was the travel day. You hit the bus at 7am, take your (minimum) 10 hour bus ride. Play 3-5 games in that weekend (remember to bring your books with you to study in between games) Take the red eye home sunday night, get home sunday morning and do it all over again.

Basically What I'm getting at is we are not in a climate for baseball. There are Kids here who are passionate and have the utmost love for the game, but for someone like me it was very hard to stay 100% commited to the sport because basically you would train 8 or 9 months out of a year and actually compete 3 or 4 months out of the year. Indoor facilities just isn't the same as the real deal. I can see a few months of indoor training but 5 months in a row eats on you quickly.

Hopefully this post makes sense to you all, i wrote this while moving back and forth to my computer at work. I skipped the proof-reading but hopefully this contributes to the OP topic.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by berto9

I grew up playing baseball my whole life. Started when i was about 5, I grew up in a small town in BC, and then moved to Alberta when I was 10 years old. Once i came to Alberta I was introduced to the "Rep" Program which until that time, i had never heard of. I Continued to play Peewee AAA, Bantam AAA and Midget AAA, as well as being selected for Team Alberta in 2002-2005 and Canada in 2005. Through those years I attended 4 National Championships and am thrilled that i was a part of the first ever Alberta Midget AAA team to win the National Championships in 2004. After High school i played 2 years of college and had offers to 2 different schools in the states. Lack of interest in school (oops) and a tare in my Labrum and rotator cuff held me back.

After finishing minor baseball, i attended the Prairie Baseball Academy in Lethbridge (where i still am today). Though it was a blast and I would never take any of it back, you need to honestly, truly love the game to play even at this Jr. College level. You show up for opening day camp which starts in September, and the first week you get your ass ran off till you puke. This is where you usually see 5-20% of the guys quit. You basically stay outside on the ball diamond till it snows. Then you start the indoor training and weight training (usually end of Oct till Feb). During February and march you do a bit of traveling to play teams in the States so you can get the feel back of seeing live pitching or taking real ground balls, all before season starts in March and last till mid may (If you make playoffs).
The reason i say this is the huge time commitment playing. Think about going to school until 3, heading over to the ball diamond frm 3:30-6:30 or 7. Come home, eat, do homework, head to bed... Do that Monday to Thursday. Friday was the travel day. You hit the bus at 7am, take your (minimum) 10 hour bus ride. Play 3-5 games in that weekend (remember to bring your books with you to study in between games) Take the red eye home sunday night, get home sunday morning and do it all over again.

Basically What I'm getting at is we are not in a climate for baseball. There are Kids here who are passionate and have the utmost love for the game, but for someone like me it was very hard to stay 100% commited to the sport because basically you would train 8 or 9 months out of a year and actually compete 3 or 4 months out of the year. Indoor facilities just isn't the same as the real deal. I can see a few months of indoor training but 5 months in a row eats on you quickly.

Hopefully this post makes sense to you all, i wrote this while moving back and forth to my computer at work. I skipped the proof-reading but hopefully this contributes to the OP topic.

The thing is that's no different than football, and football participation in Calgary is way up from when I came up in the 90's. Your season is only 4 months or so, you get your ass kicked for 4 weeks at the start of the year followed by a 10-12 week grind through the regular season, then into playoffs. Once the season's over you have maybe a couple weeks of downtime before off-season workouts start. 2-3 days a week at 7am for group workouts, your own personalized weight and cardio routine to follow, and occasional testing to make sure you're actually working out. That lasts until May, when you go through a week of spring camp ass kicking, followed by a summer of individual workouts and the occasional team workout. Then it starts out all over again.

My point is that baseball isn't any different than any other sport, at least not at the higher levels, when it comes to the commitment and work that you have to put in, so that really can't be a reason for the low numbers. I don't know what the reason is, I personally stopped playing baseball because it was incredibly boring, but it's struggling all over the place. This isn't just a Canadian issue.

[berto9]

Originally Posted by valo403

The thing is that's no different than football, and football participation in Calgary is way up from when I came up in the 90's. Your season is only 4 months or so, you get your ass kicked for 4 weeks at the start of the year followed by a 10-12 week grind through the regular season, then into playoffs. Once the season's over you have maybe a couple weeks of downtime before off-season workouts start. 2-3 days a week at 7am for group workouts, your own personalized weight and cardio routine to follow, and occasional testing to make sure you're actually working out. That lasts until May, when you go through a week of spring camp ass kicking, followed by a summer of individual workouts and the occasional team workout. Then it starts out all over again.

My point is that baseball isn't any different than any other sport, at least not at the higher levels, when it comes to the commitment and work that you have to put in, so that really can't be a reason for the low numbers. I don't know what the reason is, I personally stopped playing baseball because it was incredibly boring, but it's struggling all over the place. This isn't just a Canadian issue.

This is true, i was just speaking from my personal experience since i have never played another sport.

I still believe its the climate, and that if the weather would cooperate, you would see higher number in baseball and in other outdoor sports.

[burn_baby_burn]

Originally Posted by valo403

but it's struggling all over the place. This isn't just a Canadian issue.

Kids just are not as active as they used to be. There is too much to do in the house with 300 tv channels, video games, the internet. Childhood obesity is becoming a big problem because a lot of kids get zero exercise. Both parents are working so they don't have the time or the ambition to kick the kids butts off the couch to get outside and play baseball, or any other physical activity. Parents are also distracted by the TV, the internet, their Blackberry's.

Thirty years ago or longer, kids would have gathered at the local playground after school or on weekends on warm days to play baseball for fun. Now the only way kids will play is if it is organized. When is the last time anyone saw a group of kids playing baseball for fun at a diamond without any parents around anywhere? Red Deer has ball diamonds all over the place. I never see any kids playing baseball at any of them unless it is organized.

My son is 3.5. He loves hitting right now. Has for two years. I have two friends with sons the same age who love hitting as well. (at this age they can't field because there isn't a glove made that will fit their little hands). When the three of these boys get older, are they going to be able to find enough kids that want to play baseball with them at the local playground after school or during summer break? I think the only time they will play will be organized or with their dads. Its too bad really.

[Coys1882]

Originally Posted by burn_baby_burn

Red Deer has ball diamonds all over the place. I never see any kids playing baseball at any of them unless it is organized.

So true - I remember playing grass hockey for 8 hours at a time. Not enough kids for baseball? 5 was enough to play 500 for hours and hours.

Though I'm find it's not only ball diamonds but playgrounds too. We take our kids out pretty much daily and you wouldn't believe how often the playgrounds are deserted.

[TopChed]

My dad was big into baseball when he was an athlete, and it spread to me. I quit soccer when I was 12 to move into baseball. After playing top level baseball until I was 16, I quit during what would have been my second year of Babe Ruth. For me, the problem was the weather, and the schedule. Training camp beginning in February, and a season that ran basically until the end of September when you include All Stars. That was too much, considering the first ~2 months are basically spent indoors using pitch machines and the old infield training centre.

It was tough for me to get into baseball mode while snow was falling and we were playing indoors. Add to that, I was always playing hockey which sometimes conflicted with the baseball schedule.

Baseball was my top sport athletically, but hockey was always my fave. I'm sure I would have let hockey take a back seat if I lived in BC growing up, and could have played the whole season outdoors. In Calgary, it was pretty miserable usually. I remember playing tourney's in the snow with aluminum bats in little league, not fun.

[berto9]

Originally Posted by TopChed

I remember playing tourney's in the snow with aluminum bats in little league, not fun.

Ahh the good old vibration to the hands, sometimes making them numb before the pain came... I don't miss that one bit.

[604flames]

I played baseball as a kid, and when I lived in Vancouver would hit up C's games regularly (before and after the move from AAA to A ball).

I just find sitting in the sun enjoying the atmosphere with a cold one more enjoyable than the game itself. I rarely watch on TV anymore...

That said, our local slo-pitch league is alive and well.

[burn_baby_burn]

Originally Posted by Coys1882

Though I'm find it's not only ball diamonds but playgrounds too. We take our kids out pretty much daily and you wouldn't believe how often the playgrounds are deserted.

Same thing when I take my kids to any of the playgrounds around our neighborhood. We usually have the place to ourselves.

[dustyanddaflames]

Is that really what it has come to - kids just don't leave the house anymore and aren't involved in many extra-curricular activities? I would agree with the statements above that there are empty ball diamonds and playgrounds all throughout our small town, and the only time you ever see anyone out there, is when there is an organized ball practice/game.

Maybe it just isn't baseball, maybe it is sport in general? I know when I was a kid there just wasn't anything to do inside, so we were outside all the time. Heck I would get my parents drive me over to a friend's house because he had an outfield shaped lawn with trees surrounding it. Was rather small, so we used to spend hours picking cow hair off a barbed wire fence to make a ball that was challenging to hit a home run with. When it got dark, we would put flood lights up in the outfield and continue to play. It was just the way it was.

It really is alarming to how few kids you see anymore doing anything physical.

[burn_baby_burn]

^ I think thats exactly what it is. Decades ago, kids would have played baseball for fun or as a way to spend a nice sunny day. Now they can watch the Suite Live of Zack and Cody 10 times a day. Then play some Star Wars game on their Xbox.

Society is changing, just like it always has. There probably isn't much anyone can do about it.