Hypothetical Illegal Basement Suite - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

StoneCole · 01-14-2010, 11:18 PM

I suggest this forum can be used as a source of information for anyone wondering about cases involving hypothetical illegal basement suites.

I'll start with some questions that hopefully someone can answer:

1. if the city suggests that an inspector is coming to inspect a house to see if there are more dwelling units than allowed for the property, what is the process (hypothetically would the city just come in and give a date to have everything comply and then come back for a follow-up).

2. what type fines / penalties can be incurred by the owner of a hypothetical illegal basement suite

3. hypothetically speaking, could the owner of a hypothetical basement suite incur any costs penalties if the following exists:

-electric sub-panel installed to code although not formally inspected by an electrician

-windows do not meet code

4. hypothetically speaking, would the homeowner be okay to leave the suite in for the inspection, or should they try to have it and all evidence removed (i.e. stove, locks, conforming but not inspected electrical sub-panel) prior to the inspection.

jar_e · 01-14-2010, 11:18 PM

I'm going to guess none of this is hypothetical....

StoneCole · 01-14-2010, 11:19 PM

In other topic-relevant but completely unrelated news, I may be looking for an electrician to do a quick inspection of a conforming but not-inspected sub-panel.

StoneCole · 01-14-2010, 11:21 PM

In other topic-relevant but completely unrelated news, I may be looking for a concrete cutter / window installer to install larger windows for the basement of a house.

...it's funny I've actually inquired about this and the company wouldn't tell me what size of window complies...the person I talked would only say "we sell/install two sizes of windows and this size is the most commonly installed size"...if anyone can comment on this I'd be interested to hear why the organization was so vague.

StoneCole · 01-14-2010, 11:22 PM

In other topic-relevant but completely unrelated news, I might have a house for rent (or even for sale) in the coming months, so stay tuned.

FanIn80 · 01-14-2010, 11:22 PM

Am I the only one who thought this was going to be another Chicken on the Way thread?

jar_e · 01-14-2010, 11:22 PM

To actually add something of substance in this thread....

somewhere here should be your answer (http://content.calgary.ca/CCA/City+H...ing+Policy.htm)

StoneCole · 01-14-2010, 11:24 PM

In other hypothetically topic-relevant but completely unrelated news, I'm pretty sure that the sister of a tennant of mine is a complete big fat dirty that sticks her nose into and effs up the lives of people that aren't really the cause of her family issues.

4X4 · 01-14-2010, 11:29 PM

There are tons of illegal basement suites (mother in law suites) in Calgary. I would be less worried about the fact that you have the suite and more worried about at least meeting code on a few things. Don't be running an extension cord to some kind of jerry rigged stove (duh) and the windows? You mention windows? If a person can't escape out the window, you're playing with fire. And when I say "playing with fire" I mean that you're seriously fata'd if there is ever a fire.

That fire in Parkdale last year killed three people because they couldn't escape from the basement suite. Don't know whether it was bars on the windows or small windows, or windows painetd shut... Doesn't matter. Make damn sure the windows are sufficient.

Gozer · 01-15-2010, 02:32 AM

moncton golden flames · 01-15-2010, 07:32 AM

minimum egress windows:

min. opening area = 0.35m2 with a minimum of any one side being .38m in length.

ie: .38mx.92m window opening or .592mx.592m opening.

reference - Figure A-9.7.1.2.(2) of the Alberta Building Code 2006

algernon · 01-15-2010, 07:39 AM

Quote:

Each dwelling unit must have at least one exit which
leads directly outside. Entry doors serving the exit need
to be a minimum 810mm (2’-8”) wide.

Bedroom egress windows
Note: shaded areas indicate the required
unobstructed opening where a minimum dimension
of 380mm (15”) and an area of 0.35m2 (3.8ft2)
are required.

Here's the pamphlet: http://www.calgary.ca/DocGallery/BU/...quirements.pdf

I installed 30"x30" casement(opens like a door) windows in my basement, that meet code. I have a walk-out, if I didn't, I'd need window wells.

Besides windows, the City is harping on Interconnected Smoke and Co2 detectors. If your place was built before 2006, they are more relaxed on meeting some of the other requirements.

frinkprof · 01-15-2010, 08:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4X4

There are tons of illegal basement suites (mother in law suites) in Calgary. I would be less worried about the fact that you have the suite and more worried about at least meeting code on a few things. Don't be running an extension cord to some kind of jerry rigged stove (duh) and the windows? You mention windows? If a person can't escape out the window, you're playing with fire. And when I say "playing with fire" I mean that you're seriously fata'd if there is ever a fire.

That fire in Parkdale last year killed three people because they couldn't escape from the basement suite. Don't know whether it was bars on the windows or small windows, or windows painetd shut... Doesn't matter. Make damn sure the windows are sufficient.

They had bars on the windows and an inadequate smoke alarm system.

http://www.calgaryherald.com/news/Pr...627/story.html

So OP, hypothetically speaking, ensuring there are adequate smoke alarms is another thing to look into.

North East Goon · 01-15-2010, 08:00 AM

I think most people are fine with someone having a basement suite, it only becomes a problem when your tennants start taking neighbours parking spots. Hypothetically you should make sure there is a set parking structure for these hypothetical new tennants.

REDVAN · 01-15-2010, 08:38 AM

Hypothetically, I'd be interested to know this too.

For future reference, you know what I mean?

Tron_fdc · 01-15-2010, 09:07 AM

Wouldn't it only be defined a suite if you had a seperate entrance, and a kitchen installed?

Pull out the appliances, remove the door going upstairs, and call it your man cave that you happened to rent to a friend who would come upstairs to cook all their meals.

algernon · 01-15-2010, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tron_fdc

Wouldn't it only be defined a suite if you had a seperate entrance, and a kitchen installed?

Pull out the appliances, remove the door going upstairs, and call it your man cave that you happened to rent to a friend who would come upstairs to cook all their meals.

I think this is right. It becomes a suite, once you have a kitchen. I don't think there's a problem with a door to the basement, but, it would be a good idea to put on a non locking doorknob.

Burninator · 01-15-2010, 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tron_fdc

Wouldn't it only be defined a suite if you had a seperate entrance, and a kitchen installed?

Pull out the appliances, remove the door going upstairs, and call it your man cave that you happened to rent to a friend who would come upstairs to cook all their meals.

I could be wrong on this, so don't quote me...

Once you put a toilet and a oven in a basement it's classified as a suite. So hypothetically if you removed the oven it would no longer be a suite and it would no longer have to meet the qualifications of a suite. And hypothetically with the oven removed it would pass a city inspection. Of course once the oven finds it's way back into the basement and a tenant wanders in it's an illegal basement suite again.

Now to have a legal basement suite you need things like a separate entrance and I believe a fire rating between the basement and the main floor. The majority of basements probably don't have a separate entrance to the outside let alone a fire separation.

StoneCole · 01-15-2010, 12:41 PM

...has no one experienced this situation before? I guess I'm still wondering about the process that occurs when an inspector visits during this hypothetical situation:

Would the inspector just come around, tell the homeowner to change things (i.e. remove stove, entrance) and tell the homeowner they will be back in a month for a follow-up to ensure compliance...or would he issue some penalty (i.e. a fine) based on the initial visit?

StoneCole · 01-15-2010, 12:44 PM

I'm also looking for some commentary on the following:

If the hypothetical downstairs tennant has a rental agreement that states stove, etc. will be provided...what would the homeowner have to do in terms of notice, etc. if they were to remove the stove and eventually have the tennant move out?

The hypothetical rental agreement is this case: the tennant had a six month lease that expired and they are on the first month (going on second) of a month-to-month continuation following the initial lease. How much notice does the homeowner in this hypothetical situation have to give the tennant?