Laptops are fair game for border searches

[Boblobla]

http://calgary.ctv.ca/servlet/an/loc...ub=CalgaryHome

The arrest of a Catholic bishop on child-pornography charges highlights the power of border agents to see not just your passport, but the contents of your laptop computer. Between them, the Canada Border Services Agency and the RCMP enforce dozens of statutes -- the border agency at various ports and crossings, the Mounties between ports of entry.

The Customs Act gives Canada's border officers authority to examine people's personal baggage and goods upon arrival to, and departure from, Canada, including scrutiny of electronic devices.

I don't understand how this works.

I have a fingerprint protection on my laptop, if I refuse to unlock it for them what are they going to do?

This is scary too:

But unlike the RCMP, the border agency has no independent watchdog to investigate public complaints.

[GreenLantern]

Ya the Border guards don't need a warrant to search anything, they can go anywhere on you they want.. ANNNNYYYWHHEREE...

[fredr123]

Originally Posted by Boblobla

http://calgary.ctv.ca/servlet/an/loc...ub=CalgaryHome

I don't understand how this works.

I have a fingerprint protection on my laptop, if I refuse to unlock it for them what are they going to do?

This is scary too:

Probably seize it. Sayanora MacBook.

I'm not sure why this is causing such a concern for people. You can't bring illegal things across the border. Firewood, crack, underage sex workers, kiddie porn. Leave that stuff at home.

I suppose the only problem I can see is that your laptop differs from your other luggage in one significant respect: whereas you pick exactly goes in to your luggage, you may not have the same power with your laptop. You opt illegal stuff in to your luggage but have to opt it out of your laptop... if that makes any sense.

[MarchHare]

I'm not sure why this is causing such a concern for people. You can't bring illegal things across the border. Firewood, crack, underage sex workers, kiddie porn. Leave that stuff at home.

Exactly! If you have nothing illegal to hide, what's the big deal if the border guards seize your computer and search through all your files. Civil liberties are over-rated, amirite?

[mykalberta]

Just FYI.

You have to give them the laptop, you do not have to give them any passwords. They can ask and BS you but you by law do not have to give them anything.

Ever since they came up with that I have put TrueCrypt on my laptop. No neanderthal border guard or low paid US border protection service IT lacky could break into it.

[Boblobla]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

Exactly! If you have nothing illegal to hide, what's the big deal if the border guards seize your computer and search through all your files. Civil liberties are over-rated, amirite?

That is what I am getting at. What if I don't want the border nazis to see my man on donkey porno. I am not breaking any laws by having it, as long as the donkey is of age.

What about personal banking information?

[Muta]

Originally Posted by Boblobla

That is what I am getting at. What if I don't want the border nazis to see my man on donkey porno. I am not breaking any laws by having it, as long as the donkey is of age.

What about personal banking information?

So you're an ass man, are ya?

[mykalberta]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

Exactly! If you have nothing illegal to hide, what's the big deal if the border guards seize your computer and search through all your files. Civil liberties are over-rated, amirite?

Was that meant to be in green?

[fredr123]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

Exactly! If you have nothing illegal to hide, what's the big deal if the border guards seize your computer and search through all your files. Civil liberties are over-rated, amirite?

Amen, brutha!

I have seen both sides of the argument and, frankly, I'm torn. To think you can just waltz across an international border without scrutiny is obviously erroneous. On the other hand, "cavity searches for all" is not a policy I see myself getting behind. There needs to be a balance no doubt.

If you have a beef with broad, arbitrary powers granted to border guards with seemingly no recourse or checks and balances to hold them accountable then I think I am onside with you. If, on the other hand, you are advocating for a difference in the application of these powers to your computer versus your luggage then I'm not sure I agree.

[Clever_Iggy]

Originally Posted by mykalberta

Just FYI.

You have to give them the laptop, you do not have to give them any passwords. They can ask and BS you but you by law do not have to give them anything.

Ever since they came up with that I have put TrueCrypt on my laptop. No neanderthal border guard or low paid US border protection service IT lacky could break into it.

That may be true (I don't know if it is or not, I would want to see some legal citations before I trusted it), but the ultimate trump card is to not allow you to enter the country, especially if you're not a citizen of the country you are trying to enter.

But attempting to enter or exit (and in the US, be within a reasonable proximity of the border) US/Canada/Mexico gives authorities pretty much a green light to do as they please.

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by mykalberta

Was that meant to be in green?

Sometimes sarcasm is so blatantly obvious that green text shouldn't be needed.

[Boblobla]

Originally Posted by mykalberta

Was that meant to be in green?

I don't think something so dripping in sarcasm needs to be green.

[Boblobla]

Originally Posted by Clever_Iggy

That may be true (I don't know if it is or not, I would want to see some legal citations before I trusted it), but the ultimate trump card is to not allow you to enter the country, especially if you're not a citizen of the country you are trying to enter.

But attempting to enter or exist (and in the US, be within a reasonable proximity of the border) US/Canada/Mexico gives authorities pretty much a green light to do as they please.

They can stop people from existing now? This has really gone too far.

[mykalberta]

Originally Posted by Clever_Iggy

That may be true (I don't know if it is or not, I would want to see some legal citations before I trusted it), but the ultimate trump card is to not allow you to enter the country, especially if you're not a citizen of the country you are trying to enter.

But attempting to enter or exit (and in the US, be within a reasonable proximity of the border) US/Canada/Mexico gives authorities pretty much a green light to do as they please.

Believe what you want.

What the law is meant to do is to check for illegal music/movies/software

Meaning that if you have any movies or music installed that you don that have a valid invoice for then they will charge you. I dont know about you but when I burn my lawfully purchased music and movies from CD and DVD onto my computer I dont have an invoice for that. And since legally (DMCA) you only purchased those songs/movie on that media, any transferring of those liceneses to a different media is illegal.

I would prefer a ticket home rather than prison or a huge fine any day of the week. Also, I doubt they can send you to jail for not giving up your password, the most they can do is send you packing or hold you for a while.

[4X4]

The poor perv probably would have been waved through if he hadn't told the border guard that he was a catholic bishop.

[Traditional_Ale]

Originally Posted by 4X4

The poor perv probably would have been waved through if he hadn't told the border guard that he was a catholic bishop.

Theres an issue of "Battle Pope" in there somewhere...

[Phaneuf3]

Originally Posted by fredr123

If, on the other hand, you are advocating for a difference in the application of these powers to your computer versus your luggage then I'm not sure I agree.

The privacy concerns with a laptop are much, much different.

For example, what if its a doctor's or a lawyer's confidential files? There's tons of very very valid reasons to prevent a boarder guard from going snooping through personal files to try to find some pirated mp3s or something as equally stupid.

You're not going to stop anything distasteful from entering your country if it can be stored in an electronic format by searching laptops at airports. You can simply hook up to the internet and download it once you're in the country. This type of boarder security strategy is ineffective for anything other than catching the very rare complete idiot doing some relatively minor crimes and harassing normal folks and invading their privacy.

IMO, the negatives far outweigh the positives.

[GreenLantern]

[fredr123]

Originally Posted by Phaneuf3

The privacy concerns with a laptop are much, much different.

For example, what if its a doctor's or a lawyer's confidential files? There's tons of very very valid reasons to prevent a boarder guard from going snooping through personal files to try to find some pirated mp3s or something as equally stupid.

You're not going to stop anything distasteful from entering your country if it can be stored in an electronic format by searching laptops at airports. You can simply hook up to the internet and download it once you're in the country. This type of boarder security strategy is ineffective for anything other than catching the very rare complete idiot doing some relatively minor crimes and harassing normal folks and invading their privacy.

IMO, the negatives far outweigh the positives.

I might have some paper files in my luggage that are confidential too. I could also just buy drugs in the United States once I got there. No sense searching my luggage for drugs.

I do agree that only the idiots get caught though.

[Sliver]

As long as they stay the frack away from my weed they're welcome to my porn.