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Displaced Flames fan · 03-26-2009, 06:27 PM

Just bought a new router today after months of trying to figure out why my clients suddenly couldn't connect to the home network. Here's what I have...

cable modem..1 USB port (to pc), 1 ethernet port (to router)
new router 1 ethernet connection to PC and 1 to modem.

I have completely uninstalled and reinstalled the modem and then tried to install the router and at the end of the installation the router software says it can't find it.

Based on the connections above, is there something obvious that I'm doing wrong?

Thanks in advance.

Jedi Ninja · 03-26-2009, 07:11 PM

Any reason you have the modem connected to both the PC and the router? Try removing the USB connection. The computer should only need to be connected to the router (on a LAN port).

Displaced Flames fan · 03-26-2009, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jedi Ninja

Any reason you have the modem connected to both the PC and the router? Try removing the USB connection. The computer should only need to be connected to the router (on a LAN port).

I tried it without the USB connection first, as that made sense to me. Without the router installed, the PC couldn't find the modem. I'm on the host, so I have to had to put the USB back on to get here and post this.

I will say that this is way more frustrating than what has happened with the Flames in the last 26 hours.

Jedi Ninja · 03-26-2009, 09:01 PM

Ditch the USB connection.

Connect the PC to a LAN port, modem to WAN port.

Power cycle the modem. (Unplug it for a minute and then plug it back in.)

Ditch the CD that came with the router and follow directions for accessing the router console directly (192.168.1.1 or whatever the manual says.)

If necessary, choose the option to clone the MAC address of your computer.

Verify that your modem is acquiring an IP address from the the router.

Displaced Flames fan · 03-26-2009, 09:06 PM

Believe it or not, there is no manual...only a quick start guide that mirrors the CD installation process.

I'll see what I can do. I appreciate the help!

Rathji · 03-26-2009, 09:19 PM

well I typed up a whole post and then lost connection. Here are the main points.

Remove USB cable, unless there is something physically wrong with your RJ45 port on modem, it has no reason to be there.

Try resetting router via pinhole on back.

Try power cycling your modem, router and computer. Turn power off and reconnect them one by one. turning power on after each device fully connected.

Make sure you are not using crossover cables for anything, the colours of the wires should not be mixed up.

See if your wireless works, if it does it eliminates your modem as the cause.

Jedi Ninja · 03-26-2009, 09:28 PM

What's the make and model of router?

Displaced Flames fan · 03-26-2009, 09:44 PM

Cisco Linksys WRT160N

Ok, get this....

Took the USB cable out of the equation. Instantly, the clients can connect on the router that supposedly wasn't there. HOWEVER, the host can NOT connect to the internet without the USB. I had to reinstall that connection to post this message. As soon as the USB cable is hooked up, the clients can connect to the router, but not the internet.

This seems impossible to me.

What is an RJ45 port? All I have on the modem is 1 ethernet port and 1 usb port. Of course the cable port and power port are there as well.

Only other question is what do you mean by crossover cables? All ethernet cables are not the same? I have the cable that came with the router hooked up as instructed and another ethernet cable making the other connection to the modem.

Rathji · 03-26-2009, 10:06 PM

RJ45 is the plug connection type for ethernet. Male on the cable, female in the router/modem.

A cross over cable is one that is hardly ever used anymore, that was to directly connect 2 computers, if you look at the plugs and the colour of the little wires is in the same order on each plug, then you are fine. I had included this link in my original post to explain, but I forgot it on the repost. It explains the difference between a normal (striaght through) ethernet cable and a cross over cable. Chances are this is not your problem if you are only using supplied cables, but 10 second checking can save you a ton of stress if it is.

I assume by clients you mean 'people' clients accessing the network wirelessly and are unable to connect to the internet? I also am assuming you mean the computer that is plugged into the router when you are saying host.

If this is correct, then if you take the USB cable out, no one has internet, but everyone can access the network? If you plug in the USB cable, the computer it is plugged into can access the internet but no one else? If this is the case, then the problem is either the ethernet cable between the router and the modem or one of the NIC on the router or modem.

Try bypassing the router by running an ethernet cable from the modem to the NIC in the computer. If this works, then it is your router. If it still doesn't work, make sure the cable is good. If the cable is no good, or looks like it might be a cross over cable then try replacing it. If the cable seems ok, and any other cable you try doesn't work either then chances are your modem is fried in some way.

Displaced Flames fan · 03-26-2009, 10:18 PM

You've almost got it.

If I take the USB cable out, the clients have internet but not the host. If I plug it in, the clients can access the LAN but not the WAN (internet) but the host can access the internet. You are correct in your assumptions about host and clients.

I'm thinking the crossover might be the issue and I will check that now.

Really appreciate the help. Going to bed as soon as I check and will resume the torture tomorrow!

Displaced Flames fan · 03-26-2009, 10:22 PM

OK...don't have crossover cables.

I'm wondering how the router or modem could be fried if I can get internet in different situations for different users?

Rathji · 03-26-2009, 11:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

You've almost got it.

If I take the USB cable out, the clients have internet but not the host. If I plug it in, the clients can access the LAN but not the WAN (internet) but the host can access the internet. You are correct in your assumptions about host and clients.

I'm thinking the crossover might be the issue and I will check that now.

Really appreciate the help. Going to bed as soon as I check and will resume the torture tomorrow!

The bolded part has me baffled, but if I understand it correctly you are probably missing some cables or they are installed incorrectly. Check #1 below. Otherwise read on.

If a computer that is plugged into any of ports 1 through 4 on your router has internet access, then the problem is something about your wireless, and I would suggest returning the router. This is very unlikely since from what you say you can access your network.

If the only way any computer has any internet access is by plugging into the modem via USB cable. Try these things:

1. Make sure the Cat5 cable from your modem is going into the yellow labeled port that says "Internet". Make sure your computer that is hardwired is plugged into port 1 on the back of your router. There should be no other cat5 cables pluged into your router, computer or modem at this time other than these 2.

2. Type 192.168.1.1 into your browser. After entering your admin name/pw do the following 3 things:
i) Click "Wireless" on the black bar, and "Wireless MAC Filter" on the blue bar. Ensure that that it is clicked "Disabled".

ii) Click on "Wireless Security" in the blue bar and take note of your password, security type etc. In your situation it seems like you want to have an unsecure network, so this might be disabled, and that is ok.

iii) Click on "Basic Wireless Settings" and then click the 'manual' button. Take note of your SSID and your network type. This shouldn't matter but make sure it is set to "Mixed", "BG Mixed", or "Wireless G only". This might be set to "Wireless N Only" or "Wireless B Only", if it is for now change it to "Mixed".

3. Bypass the router and plug the modem directly into the computer. Can you access the internet on that computer? If you can, then your router is buggered. A hard reset (via small pinhole on back beside your power cord) might solve the problem. If you cannot, try another ethernet cable that you are sure works. If it still does not work, contact your cable provider as at this point the problem is almost certainly your modem. An extended power cycle (disconnect modem from coax, power and ethernet for 30 + mins) might fix the problem if you want to avoid the on hold for a whole hour situation.

Jedi Ninja · 03-26-2009, 11:29 PM

For our purposes, an ethernet port and an RJ45 port are the same thing.

It doesn't surprise me that the ethernet port on the modem becomes inactive when the USB is connected, the modem probably can't support both interfaces at once.

It sounds like the problem is on the computer end. As a result of using a USB network interface, your ethernet port on your computer may have become disabled, and now all you have is the USB network interface.

If you go into "Network Connections" on your control panel, what does it list? (See her for some troubleshooting tips: http://www.practicallynetworked.com/.../troubleshoot/)

You want to make sure that your ethernet adapter is enabled, and that it is set to default network settings for DHCP, DNS, etc.. You may need to run "IPCONFIG /RELEASE" and "IPCONFIG /RENEW" commands after plugging in the ethernet cables. Or reboot.

Just curious, prior to this new router, what was your setup?

EDIT: Note -- I started this post before seeing Rathjii's last note, so there may be some redundant content.

Hack&Lube · 03-26-2009, 11:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

OK...don't have crossover cables.

I'm wondering how the router or modem could be fried if I can get internet in different situations for different users?

Probably not the router that is fried, but something wrong with the NIC (the ethernet connection on your computer).

Displaced Flames fan · 03-27-2009, 05:39 AM

Will work on this when I get home from work. Thanks for the help guys.

The setup, prior to this, was the same as now with a different router. At some point our cable company installed a modem between the wall outlet and all the peripherals so they could add the HD service and telephone service. Shortly after this, the clients on my network (another PC and a WIRED X-box 360) became unable to connect to the internet.

I know I sound completely inept, but I know the cables are installed correctly (USB cable aside) so that's not the problem. I will follow the steps outlined above this afternoon and let you know how it goes.

Again, since at times I can connect to the internet from any PC in the house (just not at the same time) I can't see the problem being modem, router or NIC. Am I wrong in making that assumption? I think it has to be in my settings somewhere.

Thanks again!

Rathji · 03-27-2009, 08:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

Will work on this when I get home from work. Thanks for the help guys.

The setup, prior to this, was the same as now with a different router. At some point our cable company installed a modem between the wall outlet and all the peripherals so they could add the HD service and telephone service. Shortly after this, the clients on my network (another PC and a WIRED X-box 360) became unable to connect to the internet.

I know I sound completely inept, but I know the cables are installed correctly (USB cable aside) so that's not the problem. I will follow the steps outlined above this afternoon and let you know how it goes.

Again, since at times I can connect to the internet from any PC in the house (just not at the same time) I can't see the problem being modem, router or NIC. Am I wrong in making that assumption? I think it has to be in my settings somewhere.

Thanks again!

You don't sound inept, trust me. If you want to know inept ask me how my entertainment center in connected. Or ask my mom why it takes her 20 minutes of coaching on the phone for her to figure out if her router is plugged in. Some of the stuff you are saying is kinda unclear though.

From what you have described it is either your ethernet card (NIC) in the computer or the connection it has to the router (Ethernet cable or port on router). Maybe we have misunderstood the situation though.

When you say you can connect to the internet on any computer in the house, is this before or after you got the new router? Are those computers connected to the router or to the modem? wirelessly or with ethernet?

You said they put in the modem, did you not have a modem before or did they just replace the one that is there?

If the problem is sporadic on all computers, it might be an ISP related issue, especially since the problem materialized after they put in the modem. Bad equipment, Signal level etc. Give them a call, they have tools to figure this stuff out with.

Hack&Lube · 03-27-2009, 04:02 PM

Draw a picture in paint

Displaced Flames fan · 03-27-2009, 05:05 PM

I just figured it out. I'll get back to you guys and let you know.

Yes, I am an idiot....but so is my cable guy.

Jedi Ninja · 03-27-2009, 06:59 PM

Any wagers. My money is on: Modem connected to a LAN port and not the WAN port of the router. Second guess is ethernet port disabled.

Displaced Flames fan · 03-27-2009, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jedi Ninja

Any wagers. My money is on: Modem connected to a LAN port and not the WAN port of the router. Second guess is ethernet port disabled.

1 is not correct.

Is there a way I can check to see if my ethernet port is disabled? This sounds promising....it fits with my limited understanding.

Obviously my earlier hopes were dashed.