Eastern Europe Plans... Thoughts?

[Phanuthier]

I think I'm moving towards getting a better idea of my Europe trip, I've run some thoughts by a poster or two here. I know there's some real travel guru's here. Wanted to see if anyone had any other recommendations / advice / warnings for my plans below.

Croatia
Dubrovnik (includ Hvar, Korcula) - Split
Plitsville Lakes
(Montenegro - Budva, if time... it would be awsome to sail there)

Slovenia
Ljubljana
Lake Bled
Ptuj
(Soca Valley if time... hear there is good paragliding there)

Hungary
Pecs
Budapest (includ Eger if time)

Romania
Maramuras
Brasov / Sinaia
Bucharest
Sibiu

And Bratislava fitting in somewhere, and Poland (Krakow) at the end.

Anyone think Romania will feel any issues with the Kosovo-Serbia issue?

[Delthefunky]

Hey Phanuthier, i've entertained the idea of visiting easter europe myself... mind if I ask why your going though? Just interested?

[Berger_4_]

Huh...what are the chances that I'd be headed to the same area this summer? What time are you going?

Oh, and I'd go to Slovakia and the Czech Republic for sure, as well as Austria (it's kind of close...and supposedly really beautiful). The Ukraine might be on my hitlist, as well as Moscow/St.Petersburg.

[Phanuthier]

^ The month of May. If you are in Eastern Europe and any cities coincide with mine, let me know. We'll have to get a beer and (try and catch) some Flames playoff games.

St Petersburg I'll be in briefly later on in a different trip, Austria is beautiful but expensive, and I've been to Prague.

Croatia is being a real pain in the butt to plan, I'm either going to have to drive or I might just drop Croatia for Bulgeria. (Again, hopefully its ok with the Kosovo-Serbia issue)

Originally Posted by Delthefunky

Hey Phanuthier, i've entertained the idea of visiting easter europe myself... mind if I ask why your going though? Just interested?

Yeah, interested. I like to travel, and I'd like to try experiencing something that I've never experienced before (ie. sailing along the Dalmation Islands, paragliding in Slovenia, living with a family in a Romanian home).

[stuck_in_chuk]

Never been to Hungary, but Lake Balaton is the largest lake in Europe if I recall. Might be worth investigating.

[prarieboy]

I was in Romania last summer and visited Sibiu, Sighisoara and Brasov. Saw a little in Bucharest but spent most of my time visiting relatives in Romnicu Valcea (sp?)

Sibiu and Brasov are great places, lots of history in them both and they are quite clean with lots of outdoor restaurants and bars to enjoy. Easily the best places I visited when I was there.
Sibiu is a great place to wander around and check out the old stuff. There is a big square surrounded by restaurants that is great to watch the world go by. Sibiu was the European Unions city of culture for 2007 and they had done a really good job of making sure the place was tourist ready, buildings painted, everything cleaned up etc. Lots of interesting achitecture there.
Brasov was quite similar to Sibiu in many ways, it has a large square with restaurants and bars. There is more shopping compared to Sibiu. The Black Church is kinda cool, really big catholic church that was involved in a big fire turning the outside of the building black. They also have a cable car that takes you up to the top of the mountain overlooking the town and you can have a really good look around.
Sighisoara was pretty cool as well but he town was being restored in a big way. Lots of street repairs and general building repairs going on. I assume it was to make it better for the tourist trade. This is a very old place, the main attraction there is the walled city which has a museum located in the clock tower. They have roman artifacts there dating from the year 200. (I think) Lots of Vlad the Impaler references there. Good place to visit for the history aspect but it was a little rough around the edges.
Didn't spend to much time in Bucharest but we did see the BIG parliment building and surroung in area which was pretty impressive.

All I can say is watch out for Gypsys. Every Romanian I've ever met will cross the street as opposed to getting close to those guys/gals. It may be more of a reputation than anything but that's what they tell me.

Let me know if you have any questions and I'll try to answer them.

[Aeneas]

Originally Posted by stuck_in_chuk

Never been to Hungary, but Lake Balaton is the largest lake in Europe if I recall. Might be worth investigating.

Balaton is huge, but also shockingly shallow. This leads many to complain about how dirty it gets. Me, I don't care how dirty it is when it's north of 30 -35 degrees, but others may be more particular.

[prarieboy]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

^
Yeah, interested. I like to travel, and I'd like to try experiencing something that I've never experienced before (ie. sailing along the Dalmation Islands, paragliding in Slovenia, living with a family in a Romanian home).

If you want to live with a family in Romania I suggest your liver is in good shape and that you like to eat, a lot.

[Incogneto]

Originally Posted by Aeneas

Balaton is huge, but also shockingly shallow. This leads many to complain about how dirty it gets. Me, I don't care how dirty it is when it's north of 30 -35 degrees, but others may be more particular.

Balaton is a party town. No english there at all, all German, but I had tons of fun there! some great parties in the summer time.

In Croatia, the best place I went is called 'Bol' on the island of Brac (pronounced 'Brach') and known for its beach. It is a 2 or 3 day stop between Split and Hvar. I have been to Europe 3 times, and for over a combined 5 months, and Bol has been my favorite place. By far!

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by prarieboy

Let me know if you have any questions and I'll try to answer them.

I'll take you up on your offer

Sibiu - was it worth the effort to get there, if I'm going to Brasov? Where did you depart and arrive from - just Bucharest, or Budapest? How was the train rides?

Sighasoara - I considered going here, but it didn't seem all that attractive. With all the restorations, did it take away from the experience? Just wondering if its a destination I should add.

Maramorus - did you spend any time in that area?

[Kybosh]

I was in some of those countries last May with a friend and it was great. The weather was awesome and the crowds weren't overwhelming. We started in Slovenia then went south to Zagreb then Plitvice then Split. From Split we hit up Hvar and Korcula then hightailed it into Herceg-Novi, Kotor and Budva in Montenegro. Came back to Dubrovnik then went to Mostar and finally Sarajevo. I loved every minute of it.

Aside from a couple places, we never booked accommodation in advance. Just hop off the bus or ferry and follow someone back to their house. Check it out to make sure it's ok and then agree on a price. It was great.

Some highlights:
1) Ljubljana - great little city with a laid back vibe. Just wander around the central area and relax.
2) Bled - It's pretty neat and easy to get to from Ljubljana. In May a lot of the things around the lake were closed but it was still ok.
2) Plitvice - It was pretty busy but it was really quite spectacular. Catching the bus to Split from the highway in front of the national park was a little sketchy but it worked.
3) Split - wished we spent more time here but the whole Diocletian palace area beside the Ferry docks is cool.
4) Hvar - Awesome
5) Korcula - Less awesome but still ok. I wouldn't recommend having a car for island hopping unless you really want one. A lot of the time the car ferries have different departure points than the main towns. Also, the catamarans (sp?) are really really fast comparatively.
6) Dubrovnik - Must see, at least 3 days here if you can.
7) Kotor - neat place but it's pretty small.
8) Budva - Happening beach town. Lots of stuff to do here.
9) Mostar - Really cool old town with the famous bridge and a Turkish market. I wouldn't overnight here again.
10) Sarajevo - My friend didn't really like Sarajevo but for some reason I find myself still thinking about this city.

I'm open to fielding any questions from these areas .

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Kybosh

I'm open to fielding any questions from these areas .

How did you travel around Croatia? (Zagreb - Plitvice - Split - Dubrovnik)

Plitsvice - in your opinion, what is the best way to get to/from there? Sounds like you have to request a stop if you take the bus - which seems kind of sketchy to me. This part is where I'm having some trouble. Somewhere between Split-Plitsvice-Ljubljana, I need a source of transportation - driving, trains or planes.

Transportation is the main trouble I'm having, how to get from Split-Plitsvice-Ljubljana.

Thanks for the help

[prarieboy]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

I'll take you up on your offer

Sibiu - was it worth the effort to get there, if I'm going to Brasov? Where did you depart and arrive from - just Bucharest, or Budapest? How was the train rides?

Sighasoara - I considered going here, but it didn't seem all that attractive. With all the restorations, did it take away from the experience? Just wondering if its a destination I should add.

Maramorus - did you spend any time in that area?

If I had to pick I'd go to Brasov over Sibiu, we primarily went there to visit a museum which we all felt was dissapointing. The town itself was nice but a similar experience to Brasov.

We arrived and departed from Bucharest. We didn't take any trains there, we were driven around by my father in-law. The driving there is insane. Mostly two lane roads on the highway with everyone doing everything they can to pass everything on the road. Not for the faint of heart.

The main attraction to Sighisoara is the walled city center which was a little disappointing due to the amout of restorations so it did take away from the experience some. They do have a torture chamber you can tour though. It's a really old medival place and has some appeal in that regard. I wouldn't spend more that a half day there but if your close by it might be worth a look see.

Never been to Maramorus so I can't comment.

I was in Romania two years before last summer and it had changed a ton since that time. I read an article which described Romania as a country on fast forward, a very acurate description.

[Kybosh]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

How did you travel around Croatia? Ferry?

Thanks for the help

We took the train from Ljubljana to Zagreb. Caught an early morning bus to Plitvice and spent the day hiking. Then we flagged down the last bus to Split off the highway and got to Split at night. For the islands we always took Catamarans and they were great. They are very fast and air conditioned, we normally bought our tickets in the morning of our day of departure.

We bussed around everywhere else except for taking a cool train ride up the mountains from Mostar to Sarajevo. The ride was mostly switchbacks up the mountains through a bunch of tunnels. The light in our cabin was also broken. It felt like some sort of murder mystery. On that ride we met a nice woman from Sarajevo that told us to try eating "flesh" in Sarajevo . Turns out she was talking about eating some cevapi (che-va-pee) .

[Kybosh]

Oh, another thing. It really wasn't that bad to get the bus to stop at Plitvice. There is a small stop there and the Ranger's station at the park entrance has all the bus times. They can tell you exactly when everything should be coming. Also, I remember there being quite a few obvious signs about the entrance to Plitvice so that you know when to get off from Zagreb.

Transportation in the whole region was surprisingly quite straight forward. Learn yourself some basic Serbo-Croatian (although most people seem to speak at least some English) and you're off to the races.

ie. "Dva za Dubrovnik, molim." "Two to Dubrovnik, please."

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by prarieboy

If I had to pick I'd go to Brasov over Sibiu, we primarily went there to visit a museum which we all felt was dissapointing. The town itself was nice but a similar experience to Brasov.

We arrived and departed from Bucharest. We didn't take any trains there, we were driven around by my father in-law. The driving there is insane. Mostly two lane roads on the highway with everyone doing everything they can to pass everything on the road. Not for the faint of heart.

The main attraction to Sighisoara is the walled city center which was a little disappointing due to the amout of restorations so it did take away from the experience some. They do have a torture chamber you can tour though. It's a really old medival place and has some appeal in that regard. I wouldn't spend more that a half day there but if your close by it might be worth a look see.

Never been to Maramorus so I can't comment.

I was in Romania two years before last summer and it had changed a ton since that time. I read an article which described Romania as a country on fast forward, a very acurate description.

Cool, info very much appreciated. I'm not big on museum's, and if I skipped it - would Sibiu be worth it?

I'm getting so many ideas here to expand on, so I wouldn't mind some more time.

If you get a chance, Cambodia is has a ton of culture and experience there as well. I was there about 2 months ago. If you wanna see some pics and have Facebook, PM me.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Kybosh

Oh, another thing. It really wasn't that bad to get the bus to stop at Plitvice. There is a small stop there and the Ranger's station at the park entrance has all the bus times. They can tell you exactly when everything should be coming. Also, I remember there being quite a few obvious signs about the entrance to Plitvice so that you know when to get off from Zagreb.

Awsome. I editted my post like 5 times since I wanted to clear up what I was asking. From all the descriptions I read, I was sketchy on taking a bus to/from Plitvice. But you think it would be ok to catch a bus between Zagreb and Split? What was the cost like for the bus?

Also, on the site for the Ferry's (Jadrolinija) they seem to have tickets going for ~$10 - is that accurate? What would the costs be like if I went island hoping (hooping?) between Split and Dubrovnik?

Sarajevo - would it be a place you recommend seeing? I'm a little tenative because of its recent war issues, but it seems like a great place. 10 hr train ride - correct?

Thanks again

[Kybosh]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

Awsome. I editted my post like 5 times since I wanted to clear up what I was asking. From all the descriptions I read, I was sketchy on taking a bus to/from Plitvice. But you think it would be ok to catch a bus between Zagreb and Split? What was the cost like for the bus?

Also, on the site for the Ferry's (Jadrolinija) they seem to have tickets going for ~$10 - is that accurate? What would the costs be like if I went island hoping (hooping?) between Split and Dubrovnik?

Sarajevo - would it be a place you recommend seeing? I'm a little tenative because of its recent war issues, but it seems like a great place. 10 hr train ride - correct?

Thanks again

I don't quite remember the cost for the bus but from Plitvice to Split took about 3.5 hours. I don't think we spent more than $10 or $15 on any given bus ride. I think the most expensive trips were the international ones (Dubrovnik to Kotor or Dubrovnik to Mostar) but I can't quite recall. Also, the catamarans were pretty cheap, $10 sounds about right from Split to Hvar. The cost to island hop is minimal really.

I recommend Sarajevo but I know a lot of people wouldn't like it. You can tell that the city has had many problems. Almost everything still has damage to their exteriors from shrapnel and gunfire. I saw a lot of amputees (especially at the knee) and fields upon fields of graveyards right withing the central part of the city. It is very sobering when you read these gravestones and see just how many people's lives were cut short. I remember seeing one gravestone with almost my exact birthdate but the date of death being 1993.

Despite all this, I found the city to be bustling with activity. Most people seemed pretty friendly and there was quite a bit of stuff to see and do within the center. You can see where Arch-Duke Franz Ferdinand was assassinated. You can visit a Mosque, Orthodox Cathedral, Catholic Cathedral and Jewish Synagogue all within a few blocks of each other (think about that). Also, a lot of people have at least heard of Calgary because we are sister cities. They had the olympics in '84 and Calgary in '88.

Oh ya, the train ride from Mostar to Sarajevo was about 2.5 hours. I think it is about 10 hours from Ljubljana to Sarajevo by train and likely goes through Zagreb and Banja Luka first.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Kybosh

I recommend Sarajevo but I know a lot of people wouldn't like it. You can tell that the city has had many problems. Almost everything still has damage to their exteriors from shrapnel and gunfire. I saw a lot of amputees (especially at the knee) and fields upon fields of graveyards right withing the central part of the city. It is very sobering when you read these gravestones and see just how many people's lives were cut short. I remember seeing one gravestone with almost my exact birthdate but the date of death being 1993.

Despite all this, I found the city to be bustling with activity. Most people seemed pretty friendly and there was quite a bit of stuff to see and do within the center. You can see where Arch-Duke Franz Ferdinand was assassinated. You can visit a Mosque, Orthodox Cathedral, Catholic Cathedral and Jewish Synagogue all within a few blocks of each other (think about that). Also, a lot of people have at least heard of Calgary because we are sister cities. They had the olympics in '84 and Calgary in '88.

That sounds very similar to Phnom Penh in Cambodia. Tons of landmines, lots of amputee's and the like. I'll try to check that out. The whole SE Asia (Thailand, Vietnam, Laos) would be quite nice - as well as my hopeful future trip of hiking from Tibet to India.

Dumb question, but the Zagreb-Split bus that stops in Plitvice, if I went from Split to Zagreb (instead of vice versa) does it make the same spot? Finding info for the bus's are surprisingly difficult. (Same with Croatia Air, but at least its findable)

[Sainters7]

I've never been but I know a lady who's Croatian and she said their beaches rival any's in the world.