4 people charged with terror plot at JFK Airport

[OILFAN #81]

The FBI caught 4 people who were charged for a terror plot to blow up JFK Airport. It was in the planning stages only but it's a good thing that they were captured because it's said this would have caused more damage then 9/11.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/06/02/jfk...lot/index.html

[Hemi-Cuda]

Kim Jong Il: It will be 911 times 2356.
Chris: My God, that's... I don't even know what that is!
Kim Jong Il: Nobody does!

[Lanny_MacDonald]

The Bush doctrine of "they'll follow up home" is proving to be unmitigated BS. "They" are already here and have been for decades. As I pointed out quite some time ago, the "terror threat" that is being uncovered is home grown. The only thing that is being done in Iraq is to give those who that have an ax to grind with the government more reason to lash out. Also, military action is not the proper response and only exacerbates the problem. This is a policing and intelligence operation. Kudos to the agencies that exposed the plot, but Iwonder if they were pushed into making arrests. I have to wonder how close to reality this conspiracy was to becoming a reality. All too often these big splashy announcements that make so much news turn out to be overblown, sensationalistic, "stories" that don't hold up in court and are never heard from again. The whole Ft. Dix thing sounded real nasty when it broke, and got lots of play in the media, but turned out to be a bunch of guys talking smack and having neither the resources nor the brains to execute a damn thing. Nothing could stick, even with the Patriot Act in place.

On to this "plot", smells like more BS to me. Anyone with a brain in their head would know that blowing up a pipeline or fuel depot would not cause the damage suggested. Too bad the media has very few brains and does not think this stuff through. They are too much of a rush to get the sensationalistic story out and cause un-needed panic. This plot is a no go from the start. For the damage to be sustained as suggested, the whole pipeline would have to be ruptured at one time, along with the storage facilities. That would take an incredible number of synchronized explosives. It would take an incredible amount of digging to access the pipeline. It would require an incredible breach of security at multiple points that share different security systems. It would also require a complete and total failure of the control systems in place that safeguard against ruptures. In other words, this is an impossibility, especially for four poorly funded men. I suspect this one will end up being nothing more than a splashy announcement with no significant changes sticking.

[Displaced Flames fan]

I remember an explosion at Stapleton International Airport in Denver in the last few years it was open before they opened DIA. They were worried they might lose all the fuel on site to the fire. The explosion was huge...didn't hurt a soul.

Lanny, whether it's BS or not...or these people are complete idiots or not is irrelevant...if there is evidence they were planning something, even something completely stupid, it's still against the law.

[FurnaceFace]

Perhaps the CNN article was updated a few times because reading it now, it doesn't sound overly sensational. They quote homeland security who basically says what Lanny does

Homeland Security sources said there is no current threat at the airport and the attack as planned was "not technically feasible."

I also read the paragraphs regarding the fuel line not as a potential for blowing the entire line up, but as a way of disrupting the line which affects lots of business and as a way of affecting operations at the airports. breaking the line at any point along it would cause problems so it makes sense to check it.

Perhaps the CNN TV stories are much more grandious, I could see that. They made a great big stink over the UK plot to blow up planes and that turned into another ill conceived plan. (unless the plan was to inconvenience travellers by separating them from their liquids).

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

Lanny, whether it's BS or not...or these people are complete idiots or not is irrelevant...if there is evidence they were planning something, even something completely stupid, it's still against the law.

Law? What law? Name the law that these guys supposedly broke? Is there a law against conjecture? There better not be a law against stupidity, otherwise this country better start building more prisons as 2/3rds of the people in America are headed to the big house! Also, what evidence? A conversation? Unless these guys have schematics of explosive devices and access cards to the facilities in question, its going to be pretty hard to make a damn thing stick. These guys will get kicked loose in 72 hours and no charges will stick, because there is nothing to it.

[Displaced Flames fan]

Originally Posted by Lanny_MacDonald

Law? What law? Name the law that these guys supposedly broke? Is there a law against conjecture? There better not be a law against stupidity, otherwise this country better start building more prisons as 2/3rds of the people in America are headed to the big house! Also, what evidence? A conversation? Unless these guys have schematics of explosive devices and access cards to the facilities in question, its going to be pretty hard to make a damn thing stick. These guys will get kicked loose in 72 hours and no charges will stick, because there is nothing to it.

Conspiracy to murder or to damage private property is against the law.

No idea what evidence there is, so you may be right. Certainly not as big of a story as the Ft. Dix thing...which was bourne of stupidity too if you ask me.

[Flames_Gimp]

Originally Posted by Lanny_MacDonald

Law? What law? Name the law that these guys supposedly broke? Is there a law against conjecture? There better not be a law against stupidity, otherwise this country better start building more prisons as 2/3rds of the people in America are headed to the big house! Also, what evidence? A conversation? Unless these guys have schematics of explosive devices and access cards to the facilities in question, its going to be pretty hard to make a damn thing stick. These guys will get kicked loose in 72 hours and no charges will stick, because there is nothing to it.

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

Conspiracy to murder or to damage private property is against the law.

No idea what evidence there is, so you may be right. Certainly not as big of a story as the Ft. Dix thing...which was bourne of stupidity too if you ask me.

Since the story has changed a dozen times since it was originally posted, and pulled off the Yahoo news page all together, there is nothing to this story. I suspect this is going to be someone tipping off the local bureau about the potential for this attack and an over-reaction which lead to a very public arrest and news briefing release. I wouldn't be surprised if it was nothing more than the guys being brought in for questioning and some information leaking to the press that caught fire. The whole thing appears to be in damage control right now as it is all being down played.

[oldschoolcalgary]

i'll wait and see if any charges actually occur in this case...if I recall correctly, many, if not most, of the other home grown terrorist plots ended up simply in dismissal of charges...

but the public never sees that part of it - only the sensational aspect of the initial reports...only to fade back in the media while leaving the mass (uninformed) public with the feeling of impending doom...the 'power of nightmares' anyone?

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Lanny_MacDonald

Since the story has changed a dozen times since it was originally posted, and pulled off the Yahoo news page all together, there is nothing to this story. I suspect this is going to be someone tipping off the local bureau about the potential for this attack and an over-reaction which lead to a very public arrest and news briefing release. I wouldn't be surprised if it was nothing more than the guys being brought in for questioning and some information leaking to the press that caught fire. The whole thing appears to be in damage control right now as it is all being down played.

It's still there...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070603/...t_caribbean_dc

[Clever_Iggy]

Originally Posted by Lanny_MacDonald

Law? What law? Name the law that these guys supposedly broke? Is there a law against conjecture? There better not be a law against stupidity, otherwise this country better start building more prisons as 2/3rds of the people in America are headed to the big house! Also, what evidence? A conversation? Unless these guys have schematics of explosive devices and access cards to the facilities in question, its going to be pretty hard to make a damn thing stick. These guys will get kicked loose in 72 hours and no charges will stick, because there is nothing to it.

Lanny, how do you always have the inside scoop that no one else can get? It's amazing... really. I dont even watch the news anymore because I can get the truth here.

Obviously they were at some stage of planning and the law is broad enough to encompass that. A conspiracy is based on the intent of conspirators... even if it was just a conversation. With the US and its government being so tight with terrorism, theyll find something to make it stick.

[Azure]

nm....not worth it, especially not with someone who 'knows' everything and posts that 'everything' on a message board.

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally Posted by Azure

nm....not worth it, especially not with someone who 'knows' everything and posts that 'everything' on a message board.

I don't post 1/10th of what I know on here or anywhere. That would be against the law. Conversely, a fresh out high school punk is always right on the money when it comes to these justice matters.



Surprise, surprise, the news just found out the whole plot was turned over by a known drug dealer looking for a lighter sentence. Probably on his third strike too (no, say it isn't so).

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070603/...terrorism_plot

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Lanny_MacDonald

I don't post 1/10th of what I know on here or anywhere. That would be against the law. Conversely, a fresh out high school punk is always right on the money when it comes to these justice matters.



Surprise, surprise, the news just found out the whole plot was turned over by a known drug dealer looking for a lighter sentence. Probably on his third strike too (no, say it isn't so).

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070603/...terrorism_plot

Whats your point?

Unlike you, I applaud the FBI for using all resources, even drug dealers to catch these people.

Since the story has changed a dozen times since it was originally posted, and pulled off the Yahoo news page all together, there is nothing to this story.

Yep, thats my story and I'm sticking too it.

Way to go!

But you still 'know' Lanny, right?

These guys must have been part of the 'phantom' organization you were talking about a few weeks ago.

[transplant99]

Lanny you seem awfully upset that this has happened...

Im just wondering what part you are having trouble with.

Is it that there wasn't any sort of plot at all, therefore they are arresting one and extraditing others based on completely false allegations?

Or are you upset that people can be arrested for plotting to destroy property?

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Lanny you seem awfully upset that this has happened...

Im just wondering what part you are having trouble with.

Is it that there wasn't any sort of plot at all, therefore they are arresting one and extraditing others based on completely false allegations?

Or are you upset that people can be arrested for plotting to destroy property?

I'm not upset. I actually find it quite hilarious at the over-reaction of the media and ######s that write high school papers about a topic they have no grip on. This is a complete non-event, it really is. There have been real plots that have not made the light of day that posed actual risks, but they have not made the media because the authorities had no idea what the ramifications of the events would have. But this, a plot that is no threat at all, gets all the coverage in the world. I makes zero sense what so ever and is mind boggling that people buy into this garbage. Five seconds of critical thought blows the whole thing out of the realm of possibilities.

I see this as yet another attempt to keep the general population "terror-fied". Terror is the great distraction from issues that really matter in this country. It's a ploy, and has been a ploy for some time. If you realy look at this "plot", it's not at all possible (and that's without considering the source of the information). It's nothing but an attempt to generate more hysteria and paranoia.

I think the domestic agencies do a fantastic job at keeping on top of these issues. These are the guys that should be doing the job in the first place. I have been saying that for a very long time. I do know that many of the "plots" exposed in the media have turned out to be nothing and ended up in acquittals. To me, this seems like another one of those. This will likely turn out to be another Detroit or Seattle situation, and the information that matters won't make the media. That's the only thing that frustrates me.

But hey, this will give all of those "terror-ists" out there that think we are about to be attacked by al Qaeda (EVERYTHING terror related is some how related to al Qaeda, which is the Kaiser Soeze for America at the moment) even though almost every threat identified since 9/11 has been domestic in nature. So lets blow this one out of proportion and give the usual suspects more ammunition for their next high school paper. There is no room in America for rational thought.

[Flames in 07]

Originally Posted by Lanny_MacDonald

I'm not upset. I actually find it quite hilarious at the over-reaction of the media and ######s that write high school papers about a topic they have no grip on. This is a complete non-event, it really is. There have been real plots that have not made the light of day that posed actual risks, but they have not made the media because the authorities had no idea what the ramifications of the events would have. But this, a plot that is no threat at all, gets all the coverage in the world. I makes zero sense what so ever and is mind boggling that people buy into this garbage. Five seconds of critical thought blows the whole thing out of the realm of possibilities.

I see this as yet another attempt to keep the general population "terror-fied". Terror is the great distraction from issues that really matter in this country. It's a ploy, and has been a ploy for some time. If you realy look at this "plot", it's not at all possible (and that's without considering the source of the information). It's nothing but an attempt to generate more hysteria and paranoia.

I think the domestic agencies do a fantastic job at keeping on top of these issues. These are the guys that should be doing the job in the first place. I have been saying that for a very long time. I do know that many of the "plots" exposed in the media have turned out to be nothing and ended up in acquittals. To me, this seems like another one of those. This will likely turn out to be another Detroit or Seattle situation, and the information that matters won't make the media. That's the only thing that frustrates me.

But hey, this will give all of those "terror-ists" out there that think we are about to be attacked by al Qaeda (EVERYTHING terror related is some how related to al Qaeda, which is the Kaiser Soeze for America at the moment) even though almost every threat identified since 9/11 has been domestic in nature. So lets blow this one out of proportion and give the usual suspects more ammunition for their next high school paper. There is no room in America for rational thought.

Curious if you have an example I can learn about here.

[Displaced Flames fan]

So the media are idiots.

No argument here.

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally Posted by Flames in 07

Curious if you have an example I can learn about here.

One that I have mentioned in the past, that has been mentioned in a couple books since by those that were in the government, was the threat to take out several specific hydro dams.