Should the US be executing teenagers?

[Agamemnon]

I've seen a few comments about the death penalty sprout up in other debates, and when I ran across this article I thought I'd post it.

The story revolves around a 17 year old killer and whether he should be put to death or not. Really interesting to note the countries that do kill teenagers are basically the US and a bunch of authoritarian regimes. I'm not sure if any of the European states condone the death penalty.

Is the US behind the times when it comes to state-sanctioned executions? Or is the rest of the world that is allowing murderers/rapists to go under-punished?

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/national/A...artner=homepage

[BlackArcher101]

I for one am against the death penalty. The only thing it satisfies is revenge for the victims family (which could be looked at murder in itself), and freeing up the jail's, hence saving money.

I'd rather have the bas***ds sufferring instead of putting them out of their misery.

[moon]

I support the death penalty and believe that anyone who is an adult as such 18 year olds in the US, should be eligible for the death penalty for horrible crimes.

Also the death penalty actually costs more money than to keep them in jail for life in most cases.

[BlackArcher101]

Originally posted by moon@Oct 13 2004, 06:17 PM
Also the death penalty actually costs more money than to keep them in jail for life in most cases.

Really? Why is that? Lot's of red tape and paperwork to kill someone?

[Reaper]

Originally posted by moon@Oct 13 2004, 04:17 PM
I support the death penalty and believe that anyone who is an adult as such 18 year olds in the US, should be eligible for the death penalty for horrible crimes.

Also the death penalty actually costs more money than to keep them in jail for life in most cases.

How does the death penalty cost more than life imprisonment?

From what I understood, the chemicals required for lethal injection cost less than $200.

[the_only_turek_fan]

Originally posted by BlackArcher101@Oct 13 2004, 03:29 PM
I for one am against the death penalty. The only thing it satisfies is revenge for the victims family (which could be looked at murder in itself), and freeing up the jail's, hence saving money.

I'd rather have the bas***ds sufferring instead of putting them out of their misery.

Yeah so they can have free food, a bed, and lots of recreational things to do, and not have to worry about money again in there life.

Hell No.

You killed someone. You deserve a long painfull death.

[BlackArcher101]

Originally posted by the_only_turek_fan@Oct 13 2004, 06:32 PM
You killed someone. You deserve a long painfull death.

Exactly, and a death by lethal injection isn't long, nor painful.

[the_only_turek_fan]

Originally posted by BlackArcher101+Oct 13 2004, 04:34 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (BlackArcher101 @ Oct 13 2004, 04:34 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-the_only_turek_fan@Oct 13 2004, 06:32 PM
You killed someone. You deserve a long painfull death.

Exactly, and a death by lethal injection isn't long, nor painful. [/b][/quote]
No.

But they should not be given a warm bed, clothes and food either.

That part of the judicial system makes my blood boil. They can shove the constitution up there ass, but I am sorry for my language, but that is the worst rule ever.

I cant believe that some of these prisoners live the same standard that some average Canadians do. Absolutely the most stupidest thing I have ever seen/heard in my life.

In fact it motivates ppl that dont have a lot going for them to engage in criminal behavior. They should be given 3 pieces of bread a day, some water, and a cold cell with no windows or light.

[Reaper]

Originally posted by the_only_turek_fan@Oct 13 2004, 04:41 PM
In fact it motivates ppl that dont have a lot going for them to engage in criminal behavior.

This is the most ridiculous thing that I've read all day.

[the_only_turek_fan]

Originally posted by Reaper+Oct 13 2004, 04:44 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Reaper @ Oct 13 2004, 04:44 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-the_only_turek_fan@Oct 13 2004, 04:41 PM
In fact it motivates ppl that dont have a lot going for them to engage in criminal behavior.

This is the most ridiculous thing that I've read all day. [/b][/quote]
How?

If you had no food and lived on the street.

Why not do something bad, go to jail and get all the basic needs all for free?

Would you like that? Or to sit outside in the -30 temperature begging for pennies and dimes?

[Reaper]

Originally posted by the_only_turek_fan+Oct 13 2004, 04:45 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (the_only_turek_fan @ Oct 13 2004, 04:45 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

This is the most ridiculous thing that I've read all day.

How?

If you had no food and lived on the street.

Why not do something bad, go to jail and get all the basic needs all for free?

Would you like that? Or to sit outside in the -30 temperature begging for pennies and dimes? [/b][/quote]
You state your case as if it were commonplace for people to commit crimes so they can go to jail for food and shelter.

It is really ridiculous for two reasons:
1) Most people don't like to give up their freedom in the way that jail forces you to.
2) Grass roots social programs actually go a long way towards feeding the destitute.

[the_only_turek_fan]

Originally posted by Reaper+Oct 13 2004, 04:50 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Reaper @ Oct 13 2004, 04:50 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

How?

If you had no food and lived on the street.

Why not do something bad, go to jail and get all the basic needs all for free?

Would you like that? Or to sit outside in the -30 temperature begging for pennies and dimes?

You state your case as if it were commonplace for people to commit crimes so they can go to jail for food and shelter.

It is really ridiculous for two reasons:
1) Most people don't like to give up their freedom in the way that jail forces you to.
2) Grass roots social programs actually go a long way towards feeding the destitute. [/b][/quote]
You state your case as if it were commonplace for people to commit crimes so they can go to jail for food and shelter.

Where did I say that it was common?

Dont put words in my mouth.

All I suggested is that it was a free way to get out of there current situation.

1) Most people don't like to give up their freedom in the way that jail forces you to.

Ahhhhh, when you have no home, no money and no food, I dont think your freedom is your number one concern. I think getting food and shelter would be?
Or is that ridiculous as well?

Grass roots social programs actually go a long way towards feeding the destitute.
Riggggggght, hence all the people on the streets that are beging for money.

Now I am not suggesting that these people are going to commit a crime, but that option for them and a better life is there.

[BlackArcher101]

Originally posted by the_only_turek_fan@Oct 13 2004, 06:55 PM
Grass roots social programs actually go a long way towards feeding the destitute.
Riggggggght, hence all the people on the streets that are beging for money.

Now I am not suggesting that these people are going to commit a crime, but that option for them and a better life is there.

I'll admit that it probably happens, but there isn't enough people living on the streets doing this to make a huge difference in the jail population.

[Reaper]

Originally posted by the_only_turek_fan+Oct 13 2004, 04:55 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (the_only_turek_fan @ Oct 13 2004, 04:55 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

You state your case as if it were commonplace for people to commit crimes so they can go to jail for food and shelter.

It is really ridiculous for two reasons:
1) Most people don't like to give up their freedom in the way that jail forces you to.
2) Grass roots social programs actually go a long way towards feeding the destitute.

You state your case as if it were commonplace for people to commit crimes so they can go to jail for food and shelter.

Where did I say that it was common?

Dont put words in my mouth.

All I suggested is that it was a free way to get out of there current situation.

1) Most people don't like to give up their freedom in the way that jail forces you to.

Ahhhhh, when you have no home, no money and no food, I dont think your freedom is your number one concern. I think getting food and shelter would be?
Or is that ridiculous as well?

Grass roots social programs actually go a long way towards feeding the destitute.
Riggggggght, hence all the people on the streets that are beging for money.

Now I am not suggesting that these people are going to commit a crime, but that option for them and a better life is there. [/b][/quote]
Obviously, you don't know what it means for someone to put words in your mouth. I did not attribute any statement to you that you did not say. I wrote:

You state your case as if it were commonplace for people to commit crimes so they can go to jail for food and shelter.

I merely inferred how I thought your statement came across. That's not putting words in your mouth. That's a matter of interpreting your point of bias. Believe it or not, it is possible for you to refute my statement without getting all p*ssy about it.

As far as sacrificing personal freedom goes... Have you ever been forced to give up your freedom? Have you ever been homeless or starving? If not, Then you can't speak as if you would know what someone in those positions would do. Many homeless persons actually forego staying at shelters because they feel they would be "locked down" and prefer to spend the night in the cold over feeling an impingement on their freedom.

As far as begging for change goes, most people who beg for money don't do it so they can buy food. The vast majority of begging proceeds go towards fueling drug and alcohol addictions.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally posted by the_only_turek_fan@Oct 13 2004, 04:55 PM
Riggggggght, hence all the people on the streets that are beging for money.

Huh? You are talking out of both sides of your mouth. You say "homeless people are motivated to go to jail" in one breath and "hence all the people on the streets" in the next. Which is it? Are people motivated to go to jail or aren't they.

It motivates people who don't have anything going for them to engage in criminal behavior, does it? Why do criminals always try to get away with it? How often do you hear stories about a guy committing a crime and then just hanging out, waiting for the cops?

I've never been to prison either but you paint a pretty rosy picture. Guys in the slammer for murder aren't tiptoeing through the tulips. The are likely locked up 20 hours a day with some other lunatic and when they aren't locked in their cells they are in a very unpleasant environment.

As to the death penalty -- no thanks. It doesn't stop anyone and I say we should leave the murdering to the murderers. It's such a silly message -- "You can't kill someone, it's against the rules, so we'll kill you now".

While we're at it, let's not advocate torture (cold, darkness, very little food)for prisoners either. It's beneath us.

[Displaced Flames fan]

I'm wishy washy on the death penalty.

For teenagers, no way.

For that sick bas**rd that abducted, raped and murdered the 13 year old girl in Sarasota, FL this past year.....I see zero good in allowing the person to remain alive.

I'm probably against in most cases. When the crimes involve children I tend to be for it.

[moon]

Originally posted by BlackArcher101+Oct 13 2004, 03:28 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (BlackArcher101 @ Oct 13 2004, 03:28 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-moon@Oct 13 2004, 06:17 PM
Also the death penalty actually costs more money than to keep them in jail for life in most cases.

Really? Why is that? Lot's of red tape and paperwork to kill someone? [/b][/quote]
It has to do with all the appeals that go into the process and some of the extra security and other measures that go into keeping these people on Death Row.

[moon]

Some homeless will in fact willing break the law to go to jail particularly in inclement weather, but when they do so it is usually petty crimes that require a small fine (which they of course don't pay) or a small amount of jail time.

[Cube Inmate]

Originally posted by Agamemnon@Oct 13 2004, 03:01 PM
The story revolves around a 17 year old killer and whether he should be put to death or not. Really interesting to note the countries that do kill teenagers are basically the US and a bunch of authoritarian regimes. I'm not sure if any of the European states condone the death penalty.

Is the US behind the times when it comes to state-sanctioned executions? Or is the rest of the world that is allowing murderers/rapists to go under-punished?

US is a signatory to the UN Convention on the Rights of the Child, but has never ratified it...

That convention, in Article 37, prohibits capital punishment of children. NYTimes article mentions that the world opposes this, but doesn't mention the convention which is signed by more members than most of the others ... list here

[Hockey_Rules_22]

I'm for it. If you're old enough to do the crime you should do the time. It also costs tax payers to keep them in jail. The justice system here in the USA is horrible.