Thoughts on Liberal leadership race?

[Table 5]

So just like the vote in Alberta will determine the next premier of this province, the national Liberal leadership race has a great chance of determining the next Prime Minister of Canada. Let's face it, all the Liberals have to do is steady their ship, and the chances of them coming back into power in the next election are pretty damn good.

Interesting to note however, that while many thousands are deciding the provincial direction in Alberta, if you look at the Liberal vote numbers, they are being decided by a much smaller (although more official party delegate) group.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Table 5

So just like the vote in Alberta will determine the next premier of this province, the national Liberal leadership race has a great chance of determining the next Prime Minister of Canada. Let's face it, all the Liberals have to do is steady their ship, and the chances of them coming back into power in the next election are pretty damn good.

While they have a better chance then they would if Chretian or Martin were leading the party. I don't think the Liberal chances are that great that they would topple the Conservatives who have shown that they are better in carrying through in power then the Liberals were.

Its easy to point to the polls and say that the Liberals would win, but since the libs don't have anyone in power its easy for the polls to be soft on them.

None of the Liberal leadership wannabe's are especially appealing to me, and in a few cases of the front runners are down right repulsive. The only one that I respect is Kennedy and his chances of winning are the same as my chances of nailing Gwen Stefani. Less then zero.

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

While they have a better chance then they would if Chretian or Martin were leading the party. I don't think the Liberal chances are that great that they would topple the Conservatives who have shown that they are better in carrying through in power then the Liberals were.

Its easy to point to the polls and say that the Liberals would win, but since the libs don't have anyone in power its easy for the polls to be soft on them.

None of the Liberal leadership wannabe's are especially appealing to me, and in a few cases of the front runners are down right repulsive. The only one that I respect is Kennedy and his chances of winning are the same as my chances of nailing Gwen Stefani. Less then zero.

Problem is...the Conservative leader has shown as much charisma and leadership capabilities as a thumb tack. Harper has to be the most bland leader Canada has ever seen next to Joe Who. That will unfortunately be the Cons undoing.

[jolinar of malkshor]

1.) According to recent polls any of the top three liberal leadership candidates would fair poorly against Harper. As it appears now the party would do much better with no Leader. So I don't agree with the statment that the winner of this leadership race will be a shoe in for the next PM

2.) As for a smaller group of delegates deciding this....well....it is fairly typical of the Libs. Instead of the grass roots deciding, they choose a delegate system where in order to become a delegate you need to pay the $995.00 registration fee plus all the other expenses, ie: Hotel, Transportation. This makes it very expensive for the average joe to participate in the process and since it is in Montreal......not a lot of people from the West will be flying down to participate.

3.) My biggest fear is that Bob Rae wins this thing. The guy almost Bankrupted Ontario and is a complete left wing yahoo. His platform is basically...."I have experience...vote for me". None of the other Candidates have really called him out on what he did to Ontario. Personally I think that if he wins.....the Libs will be much worse off. Having said that.....I don't put much trust in my fellow eastern Canadians when it comes to making logical political decisions ie: voting for the right person, not the ideological party.

[jolinar of malkshor]

Originally Posted by Cheese

Problem is...the Conservative leader has shown as much charisma and leadership capabilities as a thumb tack. Harper has to be the most bland leader Canada has ever seen next to Joe Who. That will unfortunately be the Cons undoing.

I disagree. Charisma wears off fast.....people want substance....not hot air. The was Martins down fall.

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

I disagree. Charisma wears off fast.....people want substance....not hot air. The was Martins down fall.

Ever hear of Trudeau? The vast majority of uneducated voters vote just for that...charisma. I would venture to suggest thats at least 60% or more of voters. Who was the last charismatic PC leader? Mulroney?

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

1.) According to recent polls any of the top three liberal leadership candidates would fair poorly against Harper. As it appears now the party would do much better with no Leader. So I don't agree with the statment that the winner of this leadership race will be a shoe in for the next PM

2.) As for a smaller group of delegates deciding this....well....it is fairly typical of the Libs. Instead of the grass roots deciding, they choose a delegate system where in order to become a delegate you need to pay the $995.00 registration fee plus all the other expenses, ie: Hotel, Transportation. This makes it very expensive for the average joe to participate in the process and since it is in Montreal......not a lot of people from the West will be flying down to participate.

3.) My biggest fear is that Bob Rae wins this thing. The guy almost Bankrupted Ontario and is a complete left wing yahoo. His platform is basically...."I have experience...vote for me". None of the other Candidates have really called him out on what he did to Ontario. Personally I think that if he wins.....the Libs will be much worse off. Having said that.....I don't put much trust in my fellow eastern Canadians when it comes to making logical political decisions ie: voting for the right person, not the ideological party.

As much as I dislike Rae it is unfair to suggest it was him or his party that led Ontario into the pits. All of Canada was in a raging recession at that time and all provinces felt the heat.....including Calgary and Alberta. Many in Alberta went on work sharing and wage cutting excersizes...yet noone wants to bring those fun experiences up.

[flambers]

Originally Posted by Cheese

Ever hear of Trudeau? The vast majority of uneducated voters vote just for that...charisma. I would venture to suggest thats at least 60% or more of voters. Who was the last charismatic PC leader? Mulroney?

Especially in Ontario......

[jolinar of malkshor]

Originally Posted by Cheese

Ever hear of Trudeau? The vast majority of uneducated voters vote just for that...charisma. I would venture to suggest thats at least 60% or more of voters. Who was the last charismatic PC leader? Mulroney?

OK....yes....if they happen to get a majority to hang around long enough. If they get a minority....well....they will end up being like Martin.

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by flambers

Especially in Ontario......

not so....there were a number of Liberal seats in BC, Manitoba as well as the eastern provinces. I think Saskatchewan even voted a few Libs into power now and then.
As much as Alberta wants to paint the Liberals as the Evil force, I still see Canada as one of the best countries to live in this world...maybe the best...and that was WITH Liberals holding power for the vast majority of the last century. They do deserve some credit to go along with their helping of crow.

[flambers]

Originally Posted by Cheese

not so....there were a number of Liberal seats in BC, Manitoba as well as the eastern provinces. I think Saskatchewan even voted a few Libs into power now and then.
As much as Alberta wants to paint the Liberals as the Evil force, I still see Canada as one of the best countries to live in this world...maybe the best...and that was WITH Liberals holding power for the vast majority of the last century. They do deserve some credit to go along with their helping of crow.

Oh... I have to admitt I hate the Liberals. I am puzzled why so many folks vote for them even after the disaster they did the last 4 years of their power.

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by flambers

Oh... I have to admitt I hate the Liberals. I am puzzled why so many folks vote for them even after the disaster they did the last 4 years of their power.

That answer is very simple actually...simply look south and see the headlines the Conservatives make...that plays to a largely Secular Canadian not wanting to wallow in that same swamp. That and the fact that Liberals are...

• broad: showing or characterized by broad-mindedness; "a broad political stance"; "generous and broad sympathies"; "a liberal newspaper"; "tolerant of his opponent's opinions"
• having political or social views favoring reform and progress
• tolerant of change; not bound by authoritarianism, orthodoxy, or tradition
• a person who favors a political philosophy of progress and reform and the protection of civil liberties
• big: given or giving freely; "was a big tipper"; "bountiful compliments"; "a freehanded host"; "a handsome allowance"; "Saturday's child is loving and giving"; "a liberal backer of the arts"; "a munificent gift"; "her fond and openhanded grandfather"
• a person who favors an economic theory of laissez-faire and self-regulating markets
• free: not literal; "a loose interpretation of what she had been told"; "a free translation of the poem"
  
  
  

[flambers]

Originally Posted by Cheese

That answer is very simple actually...simply look south and see the headlines the Conservatives make...that plays to a largely Secular Canadian not wanting to wallow in that same swamp. That and the fact that Liberals are...

• broad: showing or characterized by broad-mindedness; "a broad political stance"; "generous and broad sympathies"; "a liberal newspaper"; "tolerant of his opponent's opinions"
• having political or social views favoring reform and progress
• tolerant of change; not bound by authoritarianism, orthodoxy, or tradition
• a person who favors a political philosophy of progress and reform and the protection of civil liberties
• big: given or giving freely; "was a big tipper"; "bountiful compliments"; "a freehanded host"; "a handsome allowance"; "Saturday's child is loving and giving"; "a liberal backer of the arts"; "a munificent gift"; "her fond and openhanded grandfather"
• a person who favors an economic theory of laissez-faire and self-regulating markets
• free: not literal; "a loose interpretation of what she had been told"; "a free translation of the poem"
  
  
  

Sure, but how about that Gun Registry program... what a mistake that was (budgeted to cost millions now its in the billions). Will never be enforced.

Not to mention old Jean built a golf course by his personal house.... lots of the liberals were corrupt and should be found accountable for their services.

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by flambers

Sure, but how about that Gun Registry program... what a mistake that was (budgeted to cost millions now its in the billions). Will never be enforced.

Not to mention old Jean built a golf course by his personal house.... lots of the liberals were corrupt and should be found accountable for their services.

all governments make mistakes..even Ralphs.

[flambers]

Originally Posted by Cheese

all governments make mistakes..even Ralphs.

LOL, Ralph has the most profitable province....

Liberals made massive mistakes, they do not deserve to run the country.

[Table 5]

Originally Posted by flambers

Sure, but how about that Gun Registry program... what a mistake that was (budgeted to cost millions now its in the billions). Will never be enforced.

The gun registry simply isn't that high of a priority for many people. Sure if you're a farmer in Saskatchewan, it might be, but do you really think that's what drives Joe Sixpack to vote one way or another? I myself definitely wouldn't vote based on it.

[Table 5]

Originally Posted by flambers

LOL, Ralph has the most profitable province....

Come on, with the way the economy is these days, a monkey could have run this province....and the way Ralph has handled things over his last term, it probably did. It's been pretty much cruise control for a while now.

[Table 5]

Originally Posted by Cheese

That answer is very simple actually...simply look south and see the headlines the Conservatives make...that plays to a largely Secular Canadian not wanting to wallow in that same swamp.

Yep, whether people like it or not, the Conservatices are seen as the Republicans of Canada, and any comparison these days is not viewed in a positive light. I don't want Canada to go anywhere near that direction.

Personally, what drives me away from the Conservatives is not their policies on economics or money, its their stance on social and environmental issues. Harper's environmental "plan" released a few weeks ago pretty much sealed his fate for me in the next election. I've voted for them before in the past, but the last few elections I feel my beliefs growing more and more distant.

[The Goon]

Of the candidates, I am perhaps most entranced by Dion. He is level-headed, and would be a good leader for the party. As a political junkie, I'm really enjoying the wall-to-wall coverage.

[Ford Prefect]

Originally Posted by Table 5

Personally, what drives me away from the Conservatives is not their policies on economics or money, its their stance on social and environmental issues. Harper's environmental "plan" released a few weeks ago pretty much sealed his fate for me in the next election. I've voted for them before in the past, but the last few elections I feel my beliefs growing more and more distant.

Vote Green. Ever since I've started voting Green, which has been for about three elections now, I haven't even had to hold my nose while I cast my vote!