MJK and Beerfund agree to disagree - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Beerfund · 10-30-2006, 06:42 PM

After a spirited debate MJK challenged Beerfund to come up with his own ranking system. That was done and in an effort to stem more debate here are our rankings - obviously we have a different way to evalute clubs.
HANDSOME MJK vs the Beerstool Critic

TOOL RANKINGS by MJK.................. REALITY RANKINGS by Beerfund

This Week Team Change..................This Week Team Change
1 Panthers 0 .................................1 THRASHERS 0
2 Canadiens 2................................2 LIGHTNING 2
3 Wild 0....................................... 3 WILD -1
4 Thrashers 3............................... 4 PANTHERS -1
5 Kings -3.................................... 5 JETS 0
6 Lightning 3................................. 6 RANGERS 3
7 Leafs 4...................................... 7 CANADIENS -1
8 Washington 0 ............................ 8 AVALANCHE 0
9 Rangers 1.................................. 9 CANUCKS 7
10 Avalanche 5.............................. 10 SENATORS 0
11 Penguins -5............................... 11 CAPITALS 4
12 Blues 2..................................... 12 LEAFS -5
13 Oilers -1................................... 13 ISLANDERS 0
14 Preds -2................................... 14 OILERS 4
15 Flames -8................................. 15 KINGS -4
16 Canucks 3................................ 16 JACKETS 7
.................................................. ........................
17 Hurricanes -3.............................17 HURRICANES -5
18 Stars -1................................... 18 BLUES -4
19 Jets 4...................................... 19 FLAMES 1
20 Sabers -2................................. 20 PREDATORS -3
21 Senators 1............................... 21 COYOTES 3
22 Jackets 2................................. 22 STARS 4
23 Islanders 3............................... 23 NORDIQUE -4
24 Hawks -4 ................................ 24 HAWKS -2
25 Bruins -4.................................. 25 DEVILS -4
26 Nords -1.................................. 26 PENGUINS -1
27 Flyers 0................................... 27 WINGS 1
28 Devils 2................................... 28 SHARKS -1
29 Coyotes 0................................ 29 SABRES 1
30 Wings -2................................. 30 FLYERS -1
31 Sharks 0................................. 31 DUCKS 1
32 Ducks 0.................................. 32 BRUINS -1

Biggest Moves: TOOL

Avalanche +5
Flames -8

With a game in hand and only one loss to one of the CPHL’s best team’s, the Panthers maintain the #1 spot in the TOOL Power Rankings for this week. The Avalanche have found their stride, moving up 5 spots and benefiting from the team’s around them in the rankings. The Flames have lost 6 straight games, plummeting down 8 points to 15th spot.

Biggest Moves: REALITY

CANUCKS/JACKETS +7
HURRICANES -5

Hurricanes drop due to strong performances by the Canucks/Jackets and other teams in the same range. Surprisingly the Lightning make a big jump mostly due to their only dificulty coming agains top ranked clubs. Teams that tie or lose to those teams at the bottom take a big hit. If you can't beat the poor clubs then do you really deserve to be ranked high? Reality hurts.

Let the debate begin...

Noops · 10-30-2006, 06:45 PM

I like MJK's rating system better

MJK · 10-30-2006, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noops

I like MJK's rating system better

That's because they are!

HelloHockeyFans · 10-30-2006, 06:49 PM

I like Beerfund's better!

Mango · 10-30-2006, 06:59 PM

Interesting.

HalifaxDrunk · 10-30-2006, 07:36 PM

I like beerfunds better ('Yotes = 21).

I also like Troy better than Dave.

Prototype · 10-30-2006, 07:41 PM

Shampoo is better, I cleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeean the hair!

Antithesis · 10-30-2006, 09:05 PM

At the moment I must say I like beerfund's better ... but MJK's is likely a better representation of my team's reality.

Flickered Flame · 10-30-2006, 09:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antithesis

At the moment I must say I like beerfund's better ... but MJK's is likely a better representation of my team's reality.

Ditto for the Jets.

MJK · 10-30-2006, 09:13 PM

^^^

I will take that as a compliment! I just love taking REALITY away from Beerfund!

looooob · 10-30-2006, 10:16 PM

Sabres don't accept either system

Beerfund · 10-30-2006, 10:34 PM

Reality Ratings represent where teams are...not where they should be. The games are played for a reason. The top five differences between the two scales are as follows:

Penguins: 11 Tool vs 26 Reality: This team is quite simply underperforming. With loses to the sabres and the jackets (two teams that combine for 7 wins in 17 games) the Pens take a big hit. Beating up on the Bruins hasn't helped them climb the rankings. Recent moves could spark the Pens, and they should start performing to their potential soon.
Jets: 19 Tool vs 5 Reality: Their only loses have come against the Thrashers. Ironically, one of their victims have been the Kings, ranked high by the tool rankings. Reality reflects that the teams that win games are rewarded.
Senators: 21 Tool vs 10 Reality: The sens are really a team that could have easily slipped down several spots. At the same time they could have moved up as well. 3 ties indicates they are a middle of the pack team right now. They earned points by beating the Canadiens, losing to the Thrashers doesn't hurt at this point.
Islanders: 23 Tool vs 10 Reality: Their losses have come at the hands of the lightning and the Ranagers, they've won the teams they are supposed to win.
Kings 5 Tool vs 15 Reality: The Kings have been punished by a weak schedule, playing weak teams doesn't allow a team to show how strong they really could be. At the same time, when they've had the opportunity to demonstrate they are a strong club, they've failed. Loses to the Jets and the Rangers indicate the Kings aren't in the top ten right now.

Sometimes reality hurts.

MJK · 10-31-2006, 07:03 AM

I want to give you a very easy example of how the "reality" is flawed here so early in the season.

Let us pretend that the Penguins and the Bruins are playing a best of 3 for the Stanley Cup. I know it isn't realistically possible but hear me out.

The Penguins end up sweeping the Bruins for the cup, does that make the Bruins crap? No, they just got beat by the better team and unfortunatly lost 3 in a row.

You say the Penguins are bad becuase they beat up on the weak Bruins. Yet the Bruins are bad because they lost to the Penguins 3 times. How is it possible for one of these teams to be good in your reality rankings? I don't think it is.

flambers · 10-31-2006, 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MJK

I want to give you a very easy example of how the "reality" is flawed here so early in the season.

Let us pretend that the Penguins and the Bruins are playing a best of 3 for the Stanley Cup. I know it isn't realistically possible but hear me out.

The Penguins end up sweeping the Bruins for the cup, does that make the Bruins crap? No, they just got beat by the better team and unfortunatly lost 3 in a row.

You say the Penguins are bad becuase they beat up on the weak Bruins. Yet the Bruins are bad because they lost to the Penguins 3 times. How is it possible for one of these teams to be good in your reality rankings? I don't think it is.

Why does it matter if a team beats a weak team or a strong team? The key is the team is winning.

HelloHockeyFans · 10-31-2006, 09:10 AM

The reason I like Beerfund's rankings is because he takes into account how teams perform against specific teams.

It's like the NHL Flames right now. As fans, we all knew to not get too excited after they shellacked the Coyotes 6-1 because in reality, the Coyotes are a horrible team and they should be handling them with ease. The true evaluation should come when they play teams like the Predators etc.

And losses to the Capitals like last night amplify the state of the team because these are teams the Flames should beat.

the_only_turek_fan · 10-31-2006, 09:14 AM

The Stars have held a playoff spot from day 1 and do not make the top 16 on either list.

MJK · 10-31-2006, 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flambers

Why does it matter if a team beats a weak team or a strong team? The key is the team is winning.

BINGO! Penguins beat Bruins 3 times yet still suck last week.

Goffie · 10-31-2006, 02:06 PM

I don't see how beating the Bruins 3 times does not give me any points in these "reality ratings." The Bruins are a powerhouse every year and would have had a decent start this year had they beat me in those 3 games. When was it decided that the Bruins were not a great team and that beating them means nothing? After the first week or so of the season I was in first in the Imlach division, which gave me the second playoff seed, yet because it was the Bruins I beat twice I was ranked like 21st in the reality rankings. If the Bruins had beat me would I have been ranked at the bottom and would they have only been ranked 21st while sitting in 2nd in the division cause they beat a weak team like the Penguins?

I think that these reality rankings would be more accurate if the teams were given some type of ranking based on the potentail of their roster and then adapted each week after that based on performance; but then again if that was the case then we would have two sets of identical "tool ratings" to look at wouldn't we.

MJK · 10-31-2006, 02:08 PM

Quote:

but then again if that was the case then we would have to sets of identical "tool ratings" to look at wouldn't we.

ZING! Well said my good man!

Goffie · 10-31-2006, 08:50 PM

What happens in the reality rankings if...I dunno for example lets say the #7 ranked team loses by 5 goals to the #26 ranked team? Does that affect the rankings?