New car question

[HitterD]

I am currently in the market for a sporty new mid-size sedan.

After some research and test driving, I have narrowed my choices to the

Nissan Altima

Pontiac G6.

The G6 is a little less powerful, but more fuel economic. Other than that, the features are roughly the same, except GM vehicles have OnStar, which is a nice feature given the amount of out-of-town travel i do.

The Nissan is about $4000 more. I have heard good things about Import cars Vs. Domestic cars, but the G6 seems to be getting good reviews from credible car magazines and such.

What do yuo guys think.... is it worth it to go Import for the $4000 more, just for the extra (supposed) reliability?? or am I smart to go with the domestic vehichle, on the assumption that it won't cause me $4000 more worth of trouble over the life of the vehicle?

Any input is greatly appreciated, especially form owners of either of these vehichles.... or other mid-size sedan owners as well.

Thanks in advance

[HelloHockeyFans]

I bought an Infiniti (which is made by Nissan) in '95 with about 50k kms on the meter. From '95 to 2002 I brought the meter up to about 240k, which included about three drives from Vancouver to Calgary and Edmonton and back to BC during that time.

I took the car in for regular maintenance (nothing crazy), and changed the oil periodically.

I NEVER had to throw extra money in for repairs and the car never caused me any trouble.

My experience with Infiniti (Nissan) was nothing but good. Haven't driven a GM before so I can't comment to that.

[REDVAN]

I have a Pontiac Grand Am (the precursor to the G6). I think it is an alright car. The features you can't argue with. Nothing missing really. The car itself, I would assume this is the same for the G6, it isn't as powerful as it could be. Of course it is fast enough, and the V6 has no problems anywhere... but it just feels sluggish sometimes. I always want more from it.

That being said, if you are getting them new (I got mine used) then go for the Altima. The main reason I picked the Grand Am was because it was the best available in my price range. But if $4000 isn't an issue for you, then go for the import. It'll be a bit faster, a little smoother, a little nicer maybe, and a little more reliable. At least that's what everyone thinks.

[ken0042]

Myself, I really like my '03 Grand Am, so that makes me biased.

One downside of GM's is they lose their value quicker than an import. For me; I plan on keeping my car for many years so it isn't a concern.

Other thing with Onstar, IIRC you have to pay $25 per month after the 1st year, so it's a lot to pay to not have to use your cell phone.

Big thing with my Grand Am is the stability control. I have a buddy who is a domestic hater who was blown away with how well it worked on ice for acceleration.

And the one time I had to use the ABS I found that it not only did it's job, but reacted to what I was doing to prevent me from over compinsating. I thought I was going to crash for sure and was quite suprised to see I had actually avoided the crash.

[HitterD]

Thanks for the comments so far!

I was thinking the same thing about the extra $4000. I can afford it (0% financing at both dealerships right now).

I guess the real issue is how much more reliable are the imports? is it just myth that they are that much better?? who knows.

I never looked into the infinity, but I'll check that out as well

[HitterD]

Originally Posted by ken0042

Myself, I really like my '03 Grand Am, so that makes me biased.

One downside of GM's is they lose their value quicker than an import. For me; I plan on keeping my car for many years so it isn't a concern.

Other thing with Onstar, IIRC you have to pay $25 per month after the 1st year, so it's a lot to pay to not have to use your cell phone.

Big thing with my Grand Am is the stability control. I have a buddy who is a domestic hater who was blown away with how well it worked on ice for acceleration.

And the one time I had to use the ABS I found that it not only did it's job, but reacted to what I was doing to prevent me from over compinsating. I thought I was going to crash for sure and was quite suprised to see I had actually avoided the crash.

Good call.

I also liked the Traction Control on the G6. I havent compared it to the Nissan (if it has it) yet, though.

This is a big issue for me, given that I drive about 4000 km's a month on the hwy. Winter driving safety is a must. I'd get an SUV or Truck but the mileage is terrible.

The thing I like about OnStar is the ability for them to track me down if i wind up in a ditch somewhere in the middle of nowhere in Alberta

[Frank the Tank]

Originally Posted by HitterD

Good call.

I also liked the Traction Control on the G6. I havent compared it to the Nissan (if it has it) yet, though.

This is a big issue for me, given that I drive about 4000 km's a month on the hwy. Winter driving safety is a must. I'd get an SUV or Truck but the mileage is terrible.

The thing I like about OnStar is the ability for them to track me down if i wind up in a ditch somewhere in the middle of nowhere in Alberta

Have you considered a Subaru as well? Just a thought.

[firebug]

I have a g6.

Likes:
Reasonable power
Great gas mileage
Very affordable for the size and equipment
Above average appearance

Dislikes:
Large turning circle (due to long wheelbase)
Rearward visibility could be better
Back seat has great legroom, but occupants sit quite low in relation to the beltline of the car

Overall I have been very satisfied with the car. For the same money, I was looking at a corolla or a civic but wanted a bigger vehicle.

I recognize that LT reliability will not be as good as some import cars, but I am leasing so that was not a concern for me.

For what it is worth, Cosumer Reports gives both cars a "Recommended" rating.

[I-Hate-Hulse]

Isn't the Altima due for a model remake for next year? I think that's the reason it's on for 0% financing.

[ken0042]

Originally Posted by HitterD

I guess the real issue is how much more reliable are the imports? is it just myth that they are that much better?? who knows.

My arguement as a GM fan is that yes imports are more reliable. However I have found that with my GMs I have always been able to limp home; like when I lost a coil pack (or whatever its called now) in my Beretta I was able to get home on 2 cylinders. (Yes, I was the a-hole doing 90 on hwy 2.)

The other thing I've found is that while the number of breakdowns may be higher, the cost of each one is quite a bit lower.

I also compared the theft rate of vehicles, as I am often parking downtown or at a C Train station.

[Bring_Back_Shantz]

Originally Posted by I-Hate-Hulse

Isn't the Altima due for a model remake for next year? I think that's the reason it's on for 0% financing.

I have no idea if it is or not, but as far as the 0% financing goes, all of the dealers are doing it right now to clear out their 06 inventory. They do it every year around this time.

[Log]

Originally Posted by I-Hate-Hulse

Isn't the Altima due for a model remake for next year? I think that's the reason it's on for 0% financing.

The 0% is only for up to 2 years financing on the Alti (atleast according to the website). And yes, the 07 Alti will be a new design.

I bought an 06 Alti 2 months ago. Have racked up 3k on there so far.

So far it gets pretty close to what it says for city driving (gets 22 right now - Nissan said it will get 24)... But apparently that gets better once the vehicle is fully broken in. On the highway is supposed to get 39 mpg... I took it on the highway for a few hundred km, it got 34 or so cruising at 120. This is mainly from the 5 speed auto and gets the same mileage (highway) as the 4 cyclinder engine (it has a 4 speed auto).

The car handles great, has a wicked sound system, has great sightlines, has tons of interior room, and the list goes on....

My only complaint is it's too easy to put your foot down to the floor!! The 250hp V6 has AMAZING passing power!!!

Seriously, zero complaints (other than paying for it now).

Also, one other thing.... The Altima V6 will hold its value big time. That's the reason why I went new as opposed to used.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Did you consider the Mazda 6? I've heard nothing but good things about the latest generation of Mazda's.

If not then I'd go with the Altima. I hate the interior on most domestics and I think the exterior of most of them is equally as disappointing. There are some exceptions but in general I wouldn't even consider a domestic if I were buying a new car and haven't considered one in the past when I decided to go German with an Audi.

Of course we all look for different things when buying a car. For me the driving experience, the exterior and the interior plays a huge role. For others that isn't important and instead they want something reliable that is under warranty. So I doubt you'll get any sort of consensus unless we all happened to have the identical criteria.

[Regulator75]

My first "big / new" car purchase was a 2001 Chevy Impala LS 3.8L fully loaded. I loved up until little things started going wrong.

I think we had 3 recalls during the first year.
Engine cradle - unsecure
Block heater over cooked
Disc Brake / rotor problems
Gas gage issues / Tranny problems
the list goes on.

Now the Impala see's very little road.
The wife drives it about 6 Km mon-fri (C-train and back).

I drive my little Acura and love it.

Domestics have driven me away, I was always Pro GM. Now, I could never go back. Imports rock, European or Japanese.

So, if I were you I would choose the Altima. Plus it looks great!

My next car will be the Audi A6 or a BMW.

[Nuje]

As a former GM fanatic turned Nissan of all things, I can probably offer you info on the matter. For a casual car buyer, you've narrowed your cars down to two excellent cars. The G6 is from what I've driven, GMs best made North American car ever. The fit and finish was not GM-esque at all. I agree with the rearward visibility, it's less than it should be. Reliability should NOT be a problem. The engine (3500....same goes for the 3900 if you get that option) is based on a 60 degree V6 made in 1982. I've owned a car with a version of that motor with upwards of 325 000 on the clock. The person I sold that car to was shocked that it was the original motor. I do know that from 94 onwards they had a TSB (Technical service bulletin) for the intake manifold gasket. I assume they fixed the problem when the 3500 came in, but check first. It'll be a good few hundreds (up to a thousand in a minivan due to limited access) to repair. GM will not pay for this, but they do have an updated part to fix the problem. Now the Nissan. If you like this Altima, it's a great deal. I like it better than the one coming in as well, and they are very good cars. My Nissan has 285 000 on it as well....different motor, but it's insane how long these cars last. It just, FEELS much newer than a domestic of the same years too. The V6 in the Altima has won many awards, and is very very VERY durable. Do keep in mind that it requires premium fuel however. The feel of the Altima is more likely better, and my personal opinion, I would spend the extra 4 grand. You will get that back when you sell it (and then some) due simply to the badge on the car. Test drive both cars, and make sure there's nothing that'll annoy you in either. Good luck.

[Bill Bumface]

Originally Posted by Regulator75

Domestics have driven me away, I was always Pro GM. Now, I could never go back. Imports rock, European or Japanese.

That generalization is not quite specific enough. If you are talking reliability, European does not rock at all. Japanese does, if you are talking Toyota or Honda. Subaru/Mazda/Nissan are second tier Japanese manufacturers and Mitsubishi third tier when it comes to reliability.

I think its very true that fit and finish is better on most Japanese and European brands. Its a bit of a misconception that is hanging over from the early 90's though that domestics are below European and Japanese brands for reliablity. For example:



Incase the image doesn't show, it has Pontiac at 245 problems per 100 cars per 3 years, and Nissan at 275, 4th worst.

EDIT: It just so happens my dad's Nissan blew its transmission before it was a year old The 3.5 V6 is a GREAT engine though, very rock solid. I'd probably go for an Altima SE-R.

[HitterD]

Thanks again for the input everyone, Very much appreciated.

Seems like some mixed results, however, it also seems like both cars are good buys

Hulk, thanks for the Data, very helpful

Nuje. Thanks for the perspective. I may be leaning towards the G6 right now especially because of the premium fuel on the V6. Although I get paid per/Km to drive for work, i still want something economical.

Log. Nice looking car! and yes, the milage will improve its fullest by around 7-10000 Km's

FDW - I looked at the Mazda6, but it is the smallest of the Mid-size sedans. I would prefer something a little heavier for Highway safety in the winter. I drive a smaller car now, and they tend to skid easier. Although, i'll probably put blizzaks on my new car for the winter anyway.

[Bring_Back_Shantz]

Hulk,
Does this list include all vehicles or just cars?
If it includes all vehicles it could be somewhat misleading.
For example, GMC, Ford, and Chevrolet all manufacuture a large number of trucks, which on average I'd say probably have many more problems, which is more just a reflection of their use.

For example, the average oil/gas operator will probably put 60 000 km on a truck in a year, and it is usually on pretty rough roads, so you'd easily expect more problems within three years.

meanwhile the only non luxury brand near the top that does produce trucks is Toyota (I'll give them that they probably do make the best trucks), but the affordable ones, Mercury, Honda (don't even think of mentioning the ridgeline, Acura, do not make trucks.

Even more interesing is the division between companies that are essentially the same company, for example Mercury and Ford, several of cars are just rebranded versions of each other, but one makes trucks and the other doesn't, meanwhile Honda and Acura (both the same company, both without trucks) are pretty much exactly the same. Could trucks account for this?

Just my two cents.

[Regulator75]

Fair enough, My point is I was a hardcore GM guy.

Now I will never buy a domestic again. Been biten too many times.

Audi or BMW(<--probably), Acura, Lexus or Infiniti are 3 other brands I would consider purchasing.

[Log]

Originally Posted by Nuje

As a former GM fanatic turned Nissan of all things, I can probably offer you info on the matter. For a casual car buyer, you've narrowed your cars down to two excellent cars. The G6 is from what I've driven, GMs best made North American car ever. The fit and finish was not GM-esque at all. I agree with the rearward visibility, it's less than it should be. Reliability should NOT be a problem. The engine (3500....same goes for the 3900 if you get that option) is based on a 60 degree V6 made in 1982. I've owned a car with a version of that motor with upwards of 325 000 on the clock. The person I sold that car to was shocked that it was the original motor. I do know that from 94 onwards they had a TSB (Technical service bulletin) for the intake manifold gasket. I assume they fixed the problem when the 3500 came in, but check first. It'll be a good few hundreds (up to a thousand in a minivan due to limited access) to repair. GM will not pay for this, but they do have an updated part to fix the problem. Now the Nissan. If you like this Altima, it's a great deal. I like it better than the one coming in as well, and they are very good cars. My Nissan has 285 000 on it as well....different motor, but it's insane how long these cars last. It just, FEELS much newer than a domestic of the same years too. The V6 in the Altima has won many awards, and is very very VERY durable. Do keep in mind that it requires premium fuel however. The feel of the Altima is more likely better, and my personal opinion, I would spend the extra 4 grand. You will get that back when you sell it (and then some) due simply to the badge on the car. Test drive both cars, and make sure there's nothing that'll annoy you in either. Good luck.

Almost forgot.... The only downside to my Altima is as you mentioned the premium fuel it drinks.

EDIT - Nissan recommends (not requires) premium fuel. It will run on regular, but won't perform as well as it would on premium.