Cindy Sheehan and W to be neighbors

[Displaced Flames fan]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14062166

I think this woman is out of her mind and embarassing herself on a daily basis.

[Clarkey]

That dude needs to stop!

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

I think this woman is out of her mind and embarassing herself on a daily basis.

Why? Because she is willing to take a stand and speak out against Dumbya and his war? I have to give her credit, she is tenatious. I would have given up a long time ago.

Oh, and Dis, what would you do if one of your kids was killed in an unnecessary and immoral war? Would you just accept the flag "from a greatful nation" or would you do something to make sure that other people didn't have to suffer that similar fate, or worse, suffer through it again with another of your children? How would you channel your sorrow and hatred?

[Clarkey]

I saw her blabbing on t.v. about how no war in history has ever accomplished anything good. I repeat, that dude (Sheehan) needs to go away!

[CaptainCrunch]

I almost feel bad for her, she's being taken advantage of by some pretty media savy people.

He ramblings about the evils of Israel, and pointing to them as one of the root causes of the war, while calling terrorists freedom fighters, is just not right.

Her flip flop report on her meeting with Bush was odd at the least.

In all of this, you have to wonder what her son would think. From all accounts he was a good soldier in a tough situation, and now his mother is using his death to push a agenda that he might not be on side with.

[moon]

Originally Posted by Lanny_MacDonald

Why? Because she is willing to take a stand and speak out against Dumbya and his war? I have to give her credit, she is tenatious. I would have given up a long time ago.

Oh, and Dis, what would you do if one of your kids was killed in an unnecessary and immoral war? Would you just accept the flag "from a greatful nation" or would you do something to make sure that other people didn't have to suffer that similar fate, or worse, suffer through it again with another of your children? How would you channel your sorrow and hatred?

If I was a soldier I would be proud to have died fighting in a legitiment and moral war and would be ****ed to see my mom acting like an ass and making my death a mockery.

[Flame On]

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

I think this woman is out of her mind and embarassing herself on a daily basis.

I think she tends to think the same thing about Bush, along with I'm sure Millions of other people.

[Weiser Wonder]

Originally Posted by moon

If I was a soldier I would be proud to have died fighting in a legitiment and moral war and would be ****ed to see my mom acting like an ass and making my death a mockery.

Talk is cheap. The guy is dead. Respect that please.

[moon]

Originally Posted by Weiser Wonder

Talk is cheap. The guy is dead. Respect that please.

Respect what? How did I disrespect him?

[Weiser Wonder]

Originally Posted by moon

Respect what? How did I disrespect him?

By saying what you would do if you were a "dead soldier". Something tells me you haven't had that exprience.

[moon]

Originally Posted by Weiser Wonder

By saying what you would do if you were a "dead soldier". Something tells me you haven't had that exprience.

I am expressing how I would want to be treated if I had died in the war. I think that I, and anyone else, is able to say how they would like to be treated after death. People do it all the time with wills and what not.

I am not saying how he should feel.

How is that disrespecting him?

[Weiser Wonder]

Originally Posted by moon

How is that disrespecting him?

Your whole statement was so shallow it was disrespectful. He died in a war. I hate how people say soldiers are proud to die in a war. Such self-centered, nationalistic bull ****.

[moon]

Originally Posted by Weiser Wonder

Your whole statement was so shallow it was disrespectful. He died in a war. I hate how people say soldiers are proud to die in a war. Such self-centered, nationalistic bull ****.

I never said he was. I said I would be and have talked to plenty of guys who were in Iraq and have said the same thing. Didn't mean it to be disrespectful but the truth is that some people who are in the military woudl feel that way.

[arsenal]

Originally Posted by Weiser Wonder

I hate how people say soldiers are proud to die in a war. Such self-centered, nationalistic bull ****.

So you are saying you would not be proud to die for your country? Or in the defence of others?
I have to disagree that this statement is self-centered. It's actually a very selfless act.

[Weiser Wonder]

Originally Posted by arsenal

So you are saying you would not be proud to die for your country? Or in the defence of others?
I have to disagree that this statement is self-centered. It's actually a very selfless act.

To speak for them and say they are proud to die in a war. "It's ok he's dead, he'll be proud to serve his country." Respect that death is a tragedy and just because he died in a war does not make it ok or take away any pain. Of course, dying for your country or others is a self-less act. I'm proud of the soldiers in Iraq but I wouldn't assume that they should be the same. It's their lives that are being lost not mine.

[Weiser Wonder]

Originally Posted by moon

I never said he was. I said I would be and have talked to plenty of guys who were in Iraq and have said the same thing. Didn't mean it to be disrespectful but the truth is that some people who are in the military woudl feel that way.

Yes and they are allowed to and state as such. They are the ones fighting, not you. Again, talk is cheap. You can be proud of them but assuming they're proud to die for their country is, like I said earlier, self-centered bull ****.

Originally Posted by moon

I am expressing how I would want to be treated if I had died in the war. I think that I, and anyone else, is able to say how they would like to be treated after death. People do it all the time with wills and what not.

I am not saying how he should feel.

How is that disrespecting him?

You were answering Lanny's question by stating that if you had died you would be proud to die in a war. You were trying to make a point and from my perspective it was: that soldiers should be proud to die in wars and their family should just shut up afterwards because he's proud. My point is that you have never been in that situation and that your point made the whole situation seem shallow. Thus disrespecting him and his family.

[arsenal]

No, they are not all the same. But in the case of Cindy and her son Casey, I have to agree with moon. Cindy is making a mockery of her son's death, and using it to push her own political agenda.
According to a few sources, Casey was in a community college for 3 years, then joined the military in 2000. He re-enlisted, during the Iraq war, and was killed on a mission to free american soilders from capture.
To me, that sounds like a man that beleived in what he was doing, loved his country, and was trying to make the world a better place.

What Cindy is doing is selfish and self centered. If you don't like the war, great join the crowd, there are millions of others just like you, it's huge. Don't use your own son's death as the springboard to launch your campaign. As by doing that, she has cheapened her son's life, his accomplishments and his death.

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally Posted by moon

If I was a soldier I would be proud to have died fighting in a legitiment and moral war and would be ****ed to see my mom acting like an ass and making my death a mockery.

Well, there's you problem. Iraq is not a legitimate nor moral war.

Originally Posted by arsenal

So you are saying you would not be proud to die for your country? Or in the defence of others?
I have to disagree that this statement is self-centered. It's actually a very selfless act.

Sheehan did NOT die for his country. He was NOT fighting a foe that attacked his homeland. He was NOT fight ing a foe that was a threat to his country. He was NOT fighting a foe that was a threat to others in the region. He was part of an invading and occupying force that has done more to harm the country in question, and destabalize the region, than the despotic dictator that was removed did in the prior decade. Hussein was a paper tiger and was no threat to anyone. Everyone in the region knew, the American military knew it, and the rest of the world knew it. Sheehan's death is not only wrong and tragic, but perverse when you place it in the context you suggest.

[arsenal]

Originally Posted by Lanny_MacDonald

Sheehan did NOT die for his country. He was NOT fighting a foe that attacked his homeland. He was NOT fight ing a foe that was a threat to his country. He was NOT fighting a foe that was a threat to others in the region.

That is your view. There are numerous resolution violations that where commited by Iraq from the end of the first gulf war, to the point where the US invaded again, that if the UN had any balls, or was not corrupt, would have justified the invasion of Iraq and the removal of Saddam Hussein.
Wiki on Saddam found here.

Saddam continued to loom large in American consciousness as a major threat to Western allies such as Israel and oil-rich Saudi Arabia, to Western oil supplies from the Gulf states, and to Middle East stability generally. U.S. President Bill Clinton (1993-2001), maintained economic sanctions, as well as air patrols in the "Iraqi no-fly zones". In October 1998, President Clinton signed the Iraq Liberation Act.[23] The act calls for "regime change" in Iraq and authorizes the funding of opposition groups. Following the issuance of a UN report detailing Iraq's failure to cooperate with inspections, Clinton authorized Operation Desert Fox, a three-day air-strike to hamper Saddam's weapons-production facilities and hit sites related to weapons of mass destruction. Iraq responded by expelling UN inspectors.

Originally Posted by Lanny_MacDonald

Hussein was a paper tiger and was no threat to anyone. Everyone in the region knew, the American military knew it, and the rest of the world knew it. Sheehan's death is not only wrong and tragic, but perverse when you place it in the context you suggest.

Maybe you can tell that to the Iranian, Kuwaitis, Kurds, *****te's, Saudi's that he was no threat to anyone else in the region.
Sheehan re-enlisted in the US army after the Iraq war started. He obviously wanted to stay in the military, and serve his country. It may not have been in defense of his country, but it was in the defense of the Iraqi people.

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally Posted by arsenal

Maybe you can tell that to the Iranian, Kuwaitis, Kurds, *****te's, Saudi's that he was no threat to anyone else in the region.

Hussein was no threat. Many of the American generals in the military said so. Rumsfeld just kept retiring them until he found one that would support his twisted view of reality. And no one in the region thought he was a threat as he had been neutered in the Gulf War. It was outlined very well in Cobra II (Gordon and Trainor). It was also supported in American Theocracy (Phillips) and State of War (Risen). Hate to burst your bubble, but Hussein was as dangerous as a 20 year old declawed tabby. The greatest threat was him ****ting on the couch and not being able to get the stains out. He was contained, had no military to speak of, and had no capability to attack anyone. That story was a complete and total fabrication by the Bush administration using selected intelligence that supported their goal of an invasion.