[Signing] Pens re-sign Justin Schultz (1yr, $1.4 million) - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

sureLoss · 07-13-2016, 09:02 AM

Pittsburgh Penguins @penguins
Welcome back! The #Pens have re-signed defenseman Justin Schultz to a one-year contract.

http://penguins.nhl.com/club/news.ht...t-twt-penguins

Toonage · 07-13-2016, 09:04 AM

I like to think his clothes are still hanging from the top of the arena, and when they raise the banner next season it will hang right beside them.

Par · 07-13-2016, 09:06 AM

The Pens are over the cap.

jaikorven · 07-13-2016, 09:07 AM

More what his true worth is now anyway.

TheScorpion · 07-13-2016, 09:12 AM

Good on him, he seemed to be able to fit in nicely there.

mikeecho · 07-13-2016, 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Par

The Pens are over the cap.

As I understand it, teams can be over by 10% during the off season. Once season starts, Dupuis will be on LTIR and problem will be solved.

kyuss275 · 07-13-2016, 09:17 AM

This is more in line of what he is worth. Not sure what Edmonton was thinking giving him huge money?

Par · 07-13-2016, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikeecho

As I understand it, teams can be over by 10% during the off season. Once season starts, Dupuis will be on LTIR and problem will be solved.

Thanks for the update.

Wolfman · 07-13-2016, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikeecho

As I understand it, teams can be over by 10% during the off season. Once season starts, Dupuis will be on LTIR and problem will be solved.

So we should gain some cap relief with Smid then?

The Fonz · 07-13-2016, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyuss275

This is more in line of what he is worth. Not sure what Edmonton was thinking giving him huge money?

When you're dumbass GM proclaims you'll win multiple Norris trophies to the fans and media, it gives you a lot of leverage in negotiations.

bigrangy · 07-13-2016, 09:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfman

So we should gain some cap relief with Smid then?

From my understanding, you need to actually be over the cap to gain relief from LTIR. So right now the Flames have 15 million in cap space. They could spend up to 15 + 7.3 (10% of the cap) = 22.3 right now, as long as they get under 73 by the start of the season. Also, if they are over the cap at the start of the season, they can place Smid's 3.5 on LTIR (if he is injured), and then they'll get cap relief up to 3.5 million. So if their cap is at 76.4 at the start of the season, they LTIR Smid and end up with 0 cap space. If their cap is at 73.8 at the start of the season, they still have 0 cap space after putting Smid on LTIR. You "save" more space by spending more, it's sort of unintuitive.

The way the LTIR relief works is stupid imo, but I'm sure there's a good reason for it to be the way it is.

Strange Brew · 07-13-2016, 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigrangy

From my understanding, you need to actually be over the cap to gain relief from LTIR. So right now the Flames have 15 million in cap space. They could spend up to 15 + 7.3 (10% of the cap) = 22.3 right now, as long as they get under 73 by the start of the season. Also, if they are over the cap at the start of the season, they can place Smid's 3.5 on LTIR (if he is injured), and then they'll get cap relief up to 3.5 million. So if their cap is at 76.4 at the start of the season, they LTIR Smid and end up with 0 cap space. If their cap is at 73.8 at the start of the season, they still have 0 cap space after putting Smid on LTIR. You "save" more space by spending more, it's sort of unintuitive.

The way the LTIR relief works is stupid imo, but I'm sure there's a good reason for it to be the way it is.

But it isn't' just your cap situation at the start of the year that is relevant, correct?

For example, you have $1 million in cap space at start of year but if you put Smid on LTIR, you could exceed the cap later in the year (e.g: deadline acquisition). Is that correct?

Cap space, in of itself, is not really important. It's the flexibility to make other moves that is the benefit.

bc-chris · 07-13-2016, 09:58 AM

sweet!

i'll be seeing Justin in a couple weeks - he's a nice guy!

JerryUnderscore · 07-13-2016, 10:06 AM

Once the season starts, you can put Smid or Dupuis on LTIR, but not before. Which means both teams will need to be under the cap at the "official" start of the season before they can move those players to LTIR.

Which means, Pittsburgh will probably need to make some paper transactions and move guys down to the minors until the season starts.

Like others have said, the whole way LTIR works is kind of broken. I'd love to see it fixed in the next CBA.

Fighting Banana Slug · 07-13-2016, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

But it isn't' just your cap situation at the start of the year that is relevant, correct?

For example, you have $1 million in cap space at start of year but if you put Smid on LTIR, you could exceed the cap later in the year (e.g: deadline acquisition). Is that correct?

Cap space, in of itself, is not really important. It's the flexibility to make other moves that is the benefit.

I should let the CBA guys weigh in here, but I don't believe you can bank the LTIR space. It will not allow for later acquisitions and only allows a team to exceed while the player is on LTIR. The moment he is healthy, that salary is included in the cap which might lead to some crappy cap related deals.

There may be other examples, but the only time the LTIR really benefitted a team was when Chicago LTIRed Kane and added players for the end of the year. Kane comes back in the playoffs and Chicago effectively had a team over the cap.

spuzzum · 07-13-2016, 10:17 AM

A company should offer a course in NHL cap rules and management to fans. I wonder how many people would take up the offer and attend for a day? We constantly discuss and question cap situations and contracts.

Hugh Jahrmes · 07-13-2016, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyuss275

This is more in line of what he is worth. Not sure what Edmonton was thinking giving him huge money?

"You get what you pay for, so if we pay more...."

Locke · 07-13-2016, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hugh Jahrmes

"You get what you pay for, so if we pay more...."

Exactly it, they sold this guy off to fans as a Norris contender so they back that up by paying him.

Stud_McCool · 07-13-2016, 10:51 AM

Hey Oilers! Why didn't you pick up this right-shooting, Stanley Cup-winning defenseman??

getbak · 07-13-2016, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fighting Banana Slug

I should let the CBA guys weigh in here, but I don't believe you can bank the LTIR space. It will not allow for later acquisitions and only allows a team to exceed while the player is on LTIR. The moment he is healthy, that salary is included in the cap which might lead to some crappy cap related deals.

Yes, that's correct. That's the big difference between having actual cap space and having cap space created by having a player on LTIR.

With real cap space, if you're $1 million under the cap at the start of the season and maintain that space for the full season up to the trade deadline, you could acquire a player with a $4 million salary to fill that hole. This is how the Flames were able to add Jokinen at the deadline in 2009. They didn't have the cap space for his full-season contract, but they had enough room for the rest of the year (until half the defence all got injured with less than 10 games in the season and screwed everything up -- but that's a different story).

With LTIR space, you can only replace an injured player's salary for as long as he is injured, and you can only replace up to the AAV of his contract. If you have $1 million in unused LTIR room from the beginning of the season to the trade deadline, you can only add a player with a cap hit of $1 million to fill that hole.