Two gunmen killed at cartoon contest

[T@T]

For the Prophet Mohammed

Not sure what is stupider?

1)A religion willing to kill or be killed over an image or cartoon of a man.

2)Or holding this contest at all when the world is going crazy.

I'll pick "1" because no religion should take precedence over freedoms.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/05/04/us/gar...ing/index.html

[Displaced Flames fan]

Agreed, but it's a close call.

I'm guessing there weren't any Mohammed Cartoon contests in the US prior to the Charlie Hebdo stuff.

[bluejays]

I'm all for freedom, but having a contest like this is simply being a ignorant jerk. Religion means a lot to some people. There's no need to needlessly insult something some people feel so passionate about. Standing behind freedom of speech in this case is a cop out. Live your life the way you want but no need to go out of your way to annoy people.

[Flabbibulin]

Originally Posted by T@T

Not sure what is stupider?

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

Agreed, but it's a close call.

I'm pretty sure both can be measured on the stupid scale, but I would suggest that murder is considerably more stupid than drawing a cartoon... regardless of the circumstances behind either.

[Wormius]

Pretty tragic. I wonder if this is part of those vigilante honeypot operations meant to bring extremists out into the open.

[DoubleK]

That's exactly what I thought this morning when I heard it on the radio...

"Let's see, what will happen if I pour some gasoline on this???"

[alan21]

In art class in high school we had to partner up with a classmate and take turns sketching each other in different poses. My partner was (a) Mohammed. I've haven't slept in 12 years waiting for them to finally come finish me off.

[VladtheImpaler]

Originally Posted by alan21

In art class in high school we had to partner up with a classmate and take turns sketching each other in different poses. My partner was (a) Mohammed. I've haven't slept in 12 years waiting for them to finally come finish me off.

I laughed.

[Quis_Separabit]

It's only a picture. But these nut jobs feel the need to kill for this Mohammed guy. Disgusting stuff

[Ozy_Flame]

Originally Posted by VladtheImpaler

I laughed.

Yeah no kidding. There are literally millions of people on this planet named Mohammed. But if you put the word "Prophet" in front of it, it takes a whole new meaning. I went to school with three different Mohammeds, if I recall correctly. If this name really was the problem, I have no idea why so many people have his name. And without knowing someone personally, you have no other option but to visualize "Mohammed" as a person with a human qualities.

So really, it's characterizing the word "Prophet" that really upsets people.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by fleury

I'm all for freedom, but having a contest like this is simply being a ignorant jerk. Religion means a lot to some people. There's no need to needlessly insult something some people feel so passionate about. Standing behind freedom of speech in this case is a cop out. Live your life the way you want but no need to go out of your way to annoy people.

Annoying people by drawing a cartoon.

Drawing something that they had to go out of their way to even see.

They went out of their way to be offended. It's stupid and any attempt at justification or finger pointing is ridiculous.

[Coach]

Originally Posted by fleury

I'm all for freedom, but having a contest like this is simply being a ignorant jerk. Religion means a lot to some people. There's no need to needlessly insult something some people feel so passionate about. Standing behind freedom of speech in this case is a cop out. Live your life the way you want but no need to go out of your way to annoy people.

What about the need to go out of your way to KILL people purely because they are making fun of something you agree with?

I think that it's odd and stupid to hold a cartoon contest PURELY for satirical displays of Mohammed. If this was just a satirical cartoon contest in general, this probably wouldn't have happened.

But you should never have to fear for your life for expressing yourself, especially if you express yourself in a way that literally harms no one, which I think is kind of the point of the contest overall. If you stop, they win their ideological battle. But if you continue, you put yourself at risk (and possibly others). Some of these cartoonists could look at this as their way of fighting this "war".

In the same breath, I hate the tweet of the Dutch keynote speaker where he thanks God for the heroes that saved them. How about thank the people? You know, the living creatures that actually affected things.

[pseudoreality]

It's kind of like those slut walks to protest people who blame rape victims. Is it smart for a young woman to wear provocative clothes and walk around an inner city by herself in the middle of the night? No, but that doesn't put on equal ground with rapists.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Here is the bottom line for me.

A group of people are trying to commit murder for the offense of drawing a cartoon.

End of moral analysis. The instant you start to think, "hey, what was in that cartoon? Was that cartoon racist, or otherwise objectionable?" You have completely lost moral perspective.

[AcGold]

Maybe we should be considering why it's so important to them that they'd kill for it. Not to justify it but to understand, like in the crusades. What was making them so crazy? There was more to it than simple religious fanaticism run amok, it was organized by a central authority. Maybe these people are put up to it, I don't know. It doesn't make sense to just kill someone because of a drawing even if it offends.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by pseudoreality

It's kind of like those slut walks to protest people who blame rape victims. Is it smart for a young woman to wear provocative clothes and walk around an inner city by herself in the middle of the night? No, but that doesn't put on equal ground with rapists.

It would be kind of like going into Harlem wearing a t-shirt with a blackface caricature on it. If the person was harmed, it wouldn't excuse it, but I think you could say that the victim in such a case was asking for trouble.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by fleury

I'm all for freedom, but having a contest like this is simply being a ignorant jerk. Religion means a lot to some people. There's no need to needlessly insult something some people feel so passionate about. Standing behind freedom of speech in this case is a cop out. Live your life the way you want but no need to go out of your way to annoy people.

This is actually offensive to me. "Standing behind freedom of speech"? Freedom of speech has no impact on people's freedom to practice their religion (absent hate speech promoting some sort of violence against a religion like a neo-Nazi rally or something).

What you are attempting to do here is muzzle criticism of a religion on the basis of not giving offense. That sounds nice, until you realize that in practice all it's meant to do is enforce blasphemy laws prescribed by a particular religion on people who do not follow that religion. That's absolutely insane. Being able to criticize a religion - and remember that all a religion is is a set of ideals and prescribed behaviours set down in one or more holy texts - is crucial. Just as I can say, "Hey, maybe hunting down and killing witches as the Old Testament demands isn't the best use of our time", I can also say, "Hey, maybe killing people for apostasy isn't the best idea".

This contest may or may not have been motivated by bigotry but in theory, I support the idea of a "Mohammed Cartoon Contest" simply as a protest in favour of free speech generally. I'd participate but I'd rather not die, which sort of makes the point in itself.

Originally Posted by AcGold

Maybe we should be considering why it's so important to them that they'd kill for it. Not to justify it but to understand, like in the crusades. What was making them so crazy? There was more to it than simple religious fanaticism run amok, it was organized by a central authority. Maybe these people are put up to it, I don't know. It doesn't make sense to just kill someone because of a drawing even if it offends.

It's hard from the perspective of a first world resident who's had the advantage of a thorough education to identify with the true belief in the provisions of a religion. If you really, truly believe that the best path to the rewards of heaven is through martyrdom, you will do things that appear crazy to people who don't share those beliefs. This is a communication breakdown that seems common - when people commit extreme acts and attribute them to religious motivations, many people are inclined to doubt that and go looking for some other cause because it just seems completely batcrap nuts.

[AcGold]

I'm not saying it's not because of religion just that calling said actions the work of nutjobs or religious fanatics doesn't really do much. I work with nutjobs and religious fanatics but they don't kill anyone. I know people offended by the Mohammad drawings but they would never kill. There's more to it then oh they are just crazy religious people, what got them there? What doctrine or sect is driving people to such extreme behavior?

[Coach]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

It would be kind of like going into Harlem wearing a t-shirt with a blackface caricature on it. If the person was harmed, it wouldn't excuse it, but I think you could say that the victim in such a case was asking for trouble.

This would be the case if these people were running around the middle east waving the cartoons. This was in Texas. Not sure your analogy applies.

This is the more like having a cartoon contest satirizing Captain Kirk, and having a small minority of Trekkies go on a murderous rampage over it. (and yes, I liken any religious figurehead to pretty much any popular fictitious character).

[saillias]

Heavy security for event

The American Freedom Defense Initiative said it specifically picked the venue, a school district-owned facility, because it hosted an event denouncing Islamophobia in January.
The Sunday night event invited cartoonists to send in caricatures of Mohammed. The group said it received more than 350 submissions. The winning entry would get $10,000.
There were about 200 people at the event, police said.
"Most of the people who were there were from out of state," Athas said.
Security was tight. The school district brought in extra officers, and the group itself hired several more. Security costs, the group said, were upwards of $30,000.
Only those who purchased tickets ahead of time were admitted. They had to go through metal detectors.
"We were prepared for something like this," Harn said.

It kinda seems like the whole thing was bait intentionally set up to create this scenario. Geert Wilders is icing on the cake. Well mission accomplished, I think.