Minor Hockey and its affect on kids and parents

[Sample00]

Not a huge fan of Ray Ferraro mainly cause I dont care for him as a sports announcer but this message really hits the mark about minor hockey and how it affects both kids and parents.

http://strengthcoachblog.com/2015/03...-youth-hockey/

"Coaches are coaches we all know the game and think this should be done a certain way … how come we never tell our kids math teacher how to teach calculus but we think as parents we have the right to tell a hockey coach how much ice time and with whom and when our kids should play."

[Northendzone]

he has got some good points

[PsYcNeT]

The quote above kind of uses a poor comparison, as I'm pretty sure minor hockey coaches are mostly volunteers with other jobs, while a calculus teacher is both paid and has a degree (though not usually in math).

[habernac]

Hockey coaches also have to go through training or they can't coach

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Sample00

"Coaches are coaches we all know the game and think this should be done a certain way … how come we never tell our kids math teacher how to teach calculus but we think as parents we have the right to tell a hockey coach how much ice time and with whom and when our kids should play."

What? He doesn't think parents all over teachers too?

[Sled]

Originally Posted by habernac

Hockey coaches also have to go through training or they can't coach

I think the point was that coaches don't go through 6 years of dedicated education in the belief to pass that information on to the next generation.

I think the point Ray was trying to make was if you know better then step and coach if you don't know more then let the person who is sacrificing their spare time teach your child something.

It's been my experience that the one's with the highest critiquing of coaching usually have the lowest time of commitment for the other off ice duties in regards to minor hockey.

[Russic]

I agree his comparison with teachers is a stitch off in that parents are obnoxious in both scenarios, but that's just splitting hairs. The point he's driving home in my eyes is that the point is for the kids to find fun, which leads to passion, which leads to success. If that chain breaks it's a sad scenario for the kid who's parents force him to keep on trucking.

[Derek Sutton]

What makes Ferraro and authority figure on this? It seems as if he is trying to give another black eye to minor hockey. It is only natural, as the kids get older and more competetive, everyone is judged more harshly be it the players, the coach or the officiating. If he is directing this at atom and novice parents then I totaly agree, but he mentions BWC and NSWC and those programs would be on a totaly different level.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Derek Sutton

What makes Ferraro and authority figure on this? It seems as if he is trying to give another black eye to minor hockey. It is only natural, as the kids get older and more competetive, everyone is judged more harshly be it the players, the coach or the officiating. If he is directing this at atom and novice parents then I totaly agree, but he mentions BWC and NSWC and those programs would be on a totaly different level.

Why isn't a guy who's entire life has been dedicated to hockey and put a child through minor hockey who is now playing pro an expert? Seems to me that's some pretty good qualifications

Where's the "black eye"? He's giving parents good solid advice... Did you read the article?

[Derek Sutton]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Why isn't a guy who's entire life has been dedicated to hockey and put a child through minor hockey who is now playing pro an expert? Seems to me that's some pretty good qualifications

Where's the "black eye"? He's giving parents good solid advice... Did you read the article?

Well it is more of a black eye for hockey parents then it is for minor hockey but the two go hand in hand anytime there is a controversy. He just seems to be another mouthpiece "celebrity" dumping on parents. For him to say what is right and what is wrong has no mre value then if I said it. If a kid dreams of playing in the NHL and his parents are going to do everything they can(within reason) to make that happen good for them. Parents have to look out for what is best for their kid because no one else looks out for them.

He was also the first to criticize the coaching of USA hockey after they lossed in the 2006 Olympics as his wife was cut from the team earlier in the year (thanks wikipedia).

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Derek Sutton

Well it is more of a black eye for hockey parents then it is for minor hockey but the two go hand in hand anytime there is a controversy. He just seems to be another mouthpiece "celebrity" dumping on parents. For him to say what is right and what is wrong has no mre value then if I said it. If a kid dreams of playing in the NHL and his parents are going to do everything they can(within reason) to make that happen good for them. Parents have to look out for what is best for their kid because no one else looks out for them.

He was also the first to criticize the coaching of USA hockey after they lossed in the 2006 Olympics as his wife was cut from the team earlier in the year (thanks wikipedia).

He's taking about a lot of parents who push their kids through hockey. It is just as true if you said it, but a man with his background brings more weight. I don't think he's dumping anything on parents. That's out there. There are tons and tons of parents like that.

As for the Olympics, you don't think there's a world of difference between commenting on player selection for an Olympic team vs a bantam team ice time allocation?

[Derek Sutton]

It just bugs me how people so thoughtlessly point out all the "flaws" with minor hockey and a select few of minor hockey parents. There are 1000's and 1000's of parents, I would say 95% of the parents I have encountered, met, crossed paths with over the last 12 years that go by what Ferraro is saying. As for the other 5% or so that he is directly reffering to; this will have no effect. Parents look out for their kids best interest, they all have various tolerance levels in a variety of different circumstances. There are parents who question and harrass (bully)teachers untill their kids marks improve (one of my best freinds is a teacher who can provide endless stories of this happening), but like minor hockey, or any childhood activity, these are in the minority. Parents over reaction, or over protection or whatever you want to call it exists in anytihng where children are involved. If a kid is bullied at Brownies, it is the leaders fault, if your kid is getting poor grades it is the teachers fault, if your kid is not getting equal ice time it is the coaches fault. The "hockey parent" parallels exist everywhere you turn, but people (Ferraro) and the media dump on minor hockey, and hockey parents, at any given opprotunity.

I consider what Ferraro is say as "dumping" on parents becasue it is very implied; don't get mad at the coaches, don't let your kids play spring hockey, don't push your kids towards hockey, he will not make the NHL. He is just going after the sterotypes that exist.

[Coach]

Originally Posted by Derek Sutton

Well it is more of a black eye for hockey parents then it is for minor hockey but the two go hand in hand anytime there is a controversy. He just seems to be another mouthpiece "celebrity" dumping on parents. For him to say what is right and what is wrong has no mre value then if I said it. If a kid dreams of playing in the NHL and his parents are going to do everything they can(within reason) to make that happen good for them. Parents have to look out for what is best for their kid because no one else looks out for them.

He was also the first to criticize the coaching of USA hockey after they lossed in the 2006 Olympics as his wife was cut from the team earlier in the year (thanks wikipedia).

Not everyone knows the line of "within reason".

And no, parents aren't the only ones looking out for their kids. Volunteers are giving their time SPECIFICALLY for the kids. And, believe it or not, may be able to give some advice that you, as the parent, may not.

The teacher vs coach scenario is about as close as analogy that you can put on it. But most Canadians know at least a little bit about hockey. Any parent that wasn't fluent in it before their kid started playing generally are after a few seasons. Whereas, parents may know a lot about 1 or 2 of the subjects their kid is taking, but not much about the others. And so, there is less instance of overbearing parents (although I'm sure it exists for teachers plenty).

But I think what some parents miss is that their kids getting away from them and learning from other people is part of growing. It's one of the reasons they don't let parents coach beyond a certain level (beyond obvious bias and whatnot). How do you expect your kid to grow in a game, or life in general, if you the parent, is the only person they learn from? There's things they'll learn from friends, the opposite sex, teachers, other kid's parents, and coaches. Don't be hurt or insulted when they learn something from someone that's not you, even if it seems counter to something you know or grew up with. Things change, faster now than ever, if you're not open to allowing your kid to move with those changes, you hold them back.

The best point that Ferraro makes is in regards to it being the kids choice. If the kid wants to do extra work, extra ice, summer hockey, etc... all the power to them and full kudos to the parents for supporting it. If the kid is constantly pushed, doing things to make mom/pop happy rather than themselves, and trying to be something that they're just not, is when there are problems. Kids should feel safe enough to be able to tell their parents that they've had enough of something, whether that's piano lessons or hockey.

I have no problem with parents supporting a kids dream to go all the way, but support them with finances, encouragement and the knowledge that it takes incredible work and sacrifice, rather than with cries to coaches, pressure and hysterics.

[GreenLantern]

It would be interesting to see the percentage of NHL players who had fanatic parents vs. those who were just out there to 'have fun'.

[Coach]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern

It would be interesting to see the percentage of NHL players who had fanatic parents vs. those who were just out there to 'have fun'.

I'd bet it would surprise you. No matter how badly you want your kid to make it, only they can will themselves to do it.

And to be clear, putting kids in programs they want to participate in, sending them to camps they get invited to, etc... are NOT fanatical parents.

Once they're there and you're yapping in every coaches/scouts/GMs/other parents ear about how great your kid is or sending them to live in some crap town to play Jr A when they didn't want to, but hey, made the team...not so good.

[Derek Sutton]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern

It would be interesting to see the percentage of NHL players who had fanatic parents vs. those who were just out there to 'have fun'.

You will find as the kids get older the parents tend to mellow, kind of. The highest levels have the fewest problems in terms of both parents and on ice behaviour. I was at over 20 AAA midget games and AAA bantam games were there was no incidents except one on ice fight. At the house league levels midget and bantam can often be a gong show on and off the ice. But the worsre I saw this year was at a tier 5 pee wee game, the kids were going bananas, the parents went bezerk and the coaches were worse then both the kids and the parents combined.

I was at a WHL game about four years ago here in Lethbridge and was sitting next to a players Mom (the kid my bro billeted) and she had her stop watch out tallying his ice time. When I asked her about it she just said it was an old habit....

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Derek Sutton

You will find as the kids get older the parents tend to mellow, kind of. The highest levels have the fewest problems in terms of both parents and on ice behaviour. I was at over 20 AAA midget games and AAA bantam games were there was no incidents except one on ice fight. At the house league levels midget and bantam can often be a gong show on and off the ice. But the worsre I saw this year was at a tier 5 pee wee game, the kids were going bananas, the parents went bezerk and the coaches were worse then both the kids and the parents combined.

I was at a WHL game about four years ago here in Lethbridge and was sitting next to a players Mom (the kid my bro billeted) and she had her stop watch out tallying his ice time. When I asked her about it she just said it was an old habit....

House was awful. There was a dad on our team that had almost weekly calls to the coach about his son not getting good enough linemates, ice time, being put on wing when he's a center, etc.

Another dad the year before (in house) told his son in front of the rest of the team that he was too good to be on the team and tried with minor hockey to have him moved to another team (he was our best player by far).

In midget Rep I've seen two fist fights from parents of opposing teams in one year (same dad from our team both times). Parents cheering when a 16 year old kid gets clobbered with a clean check and had trouble getting back up.

The vast majority of games I've been to include parents yelling (often obscenities) at the 14 year old refs.

There's a lot of truth to what Ferraro is saying. I love minor hockey and will put my youngest son in it as well, but there's lots of black eyes to be pointed out

[Sample00]

Oddly enough, this is my last year of coaching minor hockey. My son is in his last year of Midget. I can tell you without a doubt that this is the first year that I have had a great group of kids, a great group of parents and an amazing year (we're in the finals this coming weekend). All previous years have had some form of overbearing parents.

From Initiation to PeeWee, if you ask the parents, their kids are going to the NHL. If they're still playing Bantam hockey in small town Alberta, if you ask the parents, the kids are going to the Dub, JR.A or University. If they are playing Midget hockey in small town Alberta, if you ask the parents, most will tell you its beer league next but some still think they have a shot, ala Glencross (Midget C).

Its a small percentage but that small percentage can ruin a perfectly fun time with a great group of kids.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern

It would be interesting to see the percentage of NHL players who had fanatic parents vs. those who were just out there to 'have fun'.

In my experience it is seasy to tell the parents/coaches that played at a higher level. Generally, they are less crazy, while still holding kids accountable.

My boy has had a coach two years in a row that played some pro-hockey in the AHL/ACHL/Europe. He is focused on player development (do the players get better) and fun. He has said to parents that he doesn't care if we win a game or not. If he is developing players then the results look after themselves. A mate of mine has a boy playing for a coach that was drafted 36 or 39 overall in the 90's. He said the guy is an enjoyment focused coach, while still holding the players accountable. As an aside this is how he described professional hockey:

getting to the CHL is like winning the lottery
getting to the AHL is like winning the lottery
getting to the NHL is like winning the lottery
staying in the NHL is like winning the lottery


In short my experience is that the parents/coaches that played a hight level of sport are generally less crazy. Those parents/coaches that didn't play a high level are worse.


Also, last night my daughter's team took a bus to play a play-off game in another town. Her team lost the game, but won the series based on 2 game total goal. After the game the subsitute coach for the other team (the original coach is suspended for punching someone in another town) was calling on myself and the other coaches to fight in the hallway outside the dressingroom.


Over all minor hockey is great. I have two kids playing in it, so obviously I think it is great. But, I will say that as in most things the vocal minority is louder than the silent majority. I decided this year to be a vocal majority.


I dislike Ray as a "talking head", but his points are valid. He, IMO, is qualified to comment on them, and it is always useful to be reminded that this is a game, and that they should be plyaing because they enjoy it.

[Flames89]

There was an interesting article pertaining to these topics in last month's Toronto Life. It is scary what that sport has become in large urban centres where competition for icetime is extreme.

http://www.torontolife.com/informer/...thl-puckheads/