Group Proposes 30km/h Speed Limit for Sunnyside

[Bigtime]

http://www.30forsunnyside.com/

This is a new group proposing to reduce the speed limit in Sunnyside from the standard 50km/h to 30km/h.

Note that this will exclude 10th street and Memorial drive, here is the map showing the proposed area of the new speed limit:



Now I've only been a resident of the community for about 2-1/2 years, but I see this as a solution to a problem that doesn't exist. Almost all the streets are narrow and have on-street parking, which naturally slows down the speed of traffic anyways. I know I am not comfortable going much above 30 on those streets in the community.

The only possible road this could be applied to would be 2nd avenue. It is the widest road in the community, so the natural calming measures of on-street parking don't slow you down. However it has two 4-way stops and a playground zone along it, not exactly a road built for speeding. Plus most commuters know that trying to use 2nd avenue to shortcut delays on Memorial is futile since you end up stuck at 10th street anyways.

We have been discussing this on twitter and on a thread at Skyscraperpage. Forumer Radley77 over there compiled this map of the community showing cycling accidents from 1996-2011 (he is working on a pedestrian one):



Pedestrian stats:



As you can see, the area with the most accidents (10th street) is excluded from this proposal. The community proper has had very few incidents over the time shown in that map.

I'm curious to hear what CP thinks of this.

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

I'm curious to hear what CP thinks of this.

I think someone should form an opposition group and lobby to have the limit raised to 70

[GGG]

A 30km speed limit is just a tax on residents of the neighbourhood. Eventually everyone accidently will get caught in a speed trap. Speed limits are also inffective at reducing speed. Instead the natural devices of narrow streets and uncontrolled intersections reduce speed on there own.

If there are any particularly bad streets (from the above picture there aren't) they should look at traffic calming devices like widening the curbs at the intersection or turing intersections into traffic circles like is done south of 17th in mount royal.

Speed limits in general should be the last resort to control speed.

[MRCboicgy]

The best thing they could do (speaking as a former resident of 6 years) is post signs telling cyclists that they are vehicles too, and have to follow traffic rules. EDIT: how there were not more cycling accidents at 2nd Av and 7th St is beyond me. Both the hipsters and the Lance Armstrongs blow through there at car-like speeds.

For cars, the worst things are the impatient rush hour d-bags on Memorial roaring up 5A or 7th to cut up to 10th st behind the Safeway.

I think the biggest issue is the pedestrians who walk through the neighbourhood without looking up from their iPhones. No one ever seemed to get to a corner and pause for a second to show which direction they were going to cross, made worse by some blind corners.

And yes, I was purely a pedestrian when I lived there.

[Locke]

Kill 'em all and let God sort 'em out!

[burn_this_city]

The cars move so fast they blew the foam off my latte.

[Bertuzzied]

If this does pass i hope they use some of the ticket money to fix those rusted letters spelling out M-E-M-O-R-I-A-L.

aren't these letters new?

[Flames in 07]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

The cars move so fast they blew the foam off my latte.

You don't understand Sunnyside very well.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Bertuzzied

If this does pass i hope they use some of the ticket money to fix those rusted letters spelling out M-E-M-O-R-I-A-L.

aren't these letters new?

They're intended to be that way to symbolize the distress caused by war.

As a resident, I think it's dumb. Other than 2nd Ave, you pretty much already have to drive a bit slower in Sunnyside because they're old streets and there are so many parked cars. This is especially the case north of 2nd where someone has to pretty much pull over on some streets to let a car coming the opposite direction pass.

Originally Posted by Flames in 07

You don't understand Sunnyside very well.

I drive slow so inertia doesn't disrupt the chocolate shavings on my macchiato.

[Addick]

Instead of making roads 30km/h, we should focus on making residential streets where the only logical speed of travel is 30km/h.

[jammies]

Convert all the roads to colourful street markets. This will both boost the local economy, and end traffic issues. Allow only hilariously inept clowns on unicycles as "vehicles" henceforth.

[Bigtime]

SSP forumer Radley started crunching the pedestrian accident statistics for Sunnyside, no map yet but here is what he says:

Along 2nd Ave NW, the first instance found in the spreadsheet was 574th in terms of severity with 1 major incident, 1 minor incident and 1 no injury accident. There was maybe 1 or 2 other minor pedestrian incidents over a 15 year period on 2nd Avenue.

[The Yen Man]

Is this a petition started by some bored housewives with nothing better to do? I don't drive through Sunnyside, so I don't really care. But I'm sure residents are going to start caring when they get regularly ticketed for going 45KM/H.

[trew]

I suspect this has more to do with reducing short cutting through the community than it does safety. There's a fair number of drivers who will turn up one of the streets by the curling club and then take 2nd ave or 4th ave over to 10st in order to avoid the Memorial and 10st intersection. It saves a lot of time, and perhaps they think that a 30 km/hr speed limit will reduce that time savings and reduce the traffic.

(That or raise money for the police department by parking a full time photo radar van on 2nd ave ).

[Bigtime]

I use 2nd avenue a lot (driving, walking, cycling) and I just don't see people ripping through on it. It's only 1.1km long and has 2 4-way stops plus the playground zone, not a lot of room to get up to crazy speeds, and the accident stats seem to back that up.

[MRCboicgy]

Originally Posted by Flames in 07

You don't understand Sunnyside very well.

Exactly, more like "the cars move so fast they ventilate my patchouli, so I have to apply even more"

[Bunk]

Originally Posted by GGG

A 30km speed limit is just a tax on residents of the neighbourhood. Eventually everyone accidently will get caught in a speed trap. Speed limits are also inffective at reducing speed. Instead the natural devices of narrow streets and uncontrolled intersections reduce speed on there own.

If there are any particularly bad streets (from the above picture there aren't) they should look at traffic calming devices like widening the curbs at the intersection or turing intersections into traffic circles like is done south of 17th in mount royal.

Speed limits in general should be the last resort to control speed.

100% correct.

[Addick]

Originally Posted by jammies

Convert all the roads to colourful street markets. This will both boost the local economy, and end traffic issues. Allow only hilariously inept clowns on unicycles as "vehicles" henceforth.

I think Bigtime should have a block party every Saturday.

[octothorp]

Yeah, I'd rather see traffic calming measures, but don't think those are even necessary (especially after seeing the maps in the OP). I'm on 5a, which is one of the main roads used to cut through the community, and there are very few cars going too fast, even during the afternoon rush hour. I'd be curious to sit out front with a radar and see how fast cars are actually going, but my guess is all but a few are around 40km/h anyway.

I would love to see a solution implemented that cuts down on congestion on Memorial and 10th, reduces people cutting through the neighbourhood, and makes it easier for residents to get or out of Sunnyside during those peak hours. But honestly I have a really hard time coming up with any sort of solution that would address that.

[Bigtime]

Here are the pedestrian accident stats from 1996-2011:



I think it is pretty safe to conclude that Sunnyside proper is doing just fine with the 50km/h limit and the narrow roads reducing speed right now.

10th street definitely needs some help.