The draft lottery is still a joke

[puckluck2]

The new draft lottery was supposed to help keep teams from purposely tanking.

Well tonight the Flames sit Stempniak, Backlund, Stajan, Cammalleri.

They are in tank mode and have been for at least the last 2 weeks, but the young guys just haven't got the memo.

Scratching those players is an embarrassment to the NHL in my opinion. In what other league would they not dress the best possible lineup? It really is a disservice to the fans who watch the game.

I am hoping we win every game to end the season. Rewarding such actions is just plain wrong.

We made fun of the Oilers for purposely tanking yet here we are dressing a lineup the ECHL might reject.

The lottery needs to be changed and I liked this post in the GDT

Originally Posted by Parallex

Sure just hand the Oilers another 1st overall why dontcha.

Just use the PingPong balls to determine every draft slot for non playoff teams. If you don't even have pick range certainty then there is little incentive to tank. Keep it a progressive lotto (so the worst teams have more pingpong balls in the hopper) but remove the range certainty. That would do it I think.

Every non playoff team should have an equal chance so gong shows like tonight don't happen. Nashville is also icing a pathetic lineup.

[Imported_Aussie]

I don't think the flames are resting veterans and playing young guys to tank. I think it is talent evaluation time. You know the season is over, as you have missed the playoffs, and the AHL season is done, so you can bring up as many AHL guys as you want, so give the young guys a run and see who is separating themselves from the other AHL guys, who to take a closer look at in camp next season, etc.

I am not a fan of taking deliberately, I think if the team is playing out the stretch and they win by playing hard, as a fan, I like that, even though it means it is less likely the team gets their choice of which young guy to draft. If the team plays young guys and plays hard but loses, I can respect that as a fan. Basically for me now, I want the season to be done, so I am content if they win or lose, so long as they respect the game, play hard, and don't get injured

[neo45]

No, not every non-play off team should have equal odds. That ruins the point of the draft completely. NHL has great parity right now and it shouldn't be messed with too much


They should have a lottery for EACH of the top 5 picks, so even finishing last would only guarantee the 6th pick. Fixes the tanking problem but also guarantees that bad teams get high picks, which is the point

[t0rrent98]

Originally Posted by Imported_Aussie

I don't think the flames are resting veterans and playing young guys to tank. I think it is talent evaluation time. You know the season is over, as you have missed the playoffs, and the AHL season is done, so you can bring up as many AHL guys as you want, so give the young guys a run and see who is separating themselves from the other AHL guys, who to take a closer look at in camp next season, etc.

I am not a fan of taking deliberately, I think if the team is playing out the stretch and they win by playing hard, as a fan, I like that, even though it means it is less likely the team gets their choice of which young guy to draft. If the team plays young guys and plays hard but loses, I can respect that as a fan. Basically for me now, I want the season to be done, so I am content if they win or lose, so long as they respect the game, play hard, and don't get injured

thats the way I look at it too...

[Major Major]

I had to read OP twice just to understand the mangled point you are trying to make. You think the Flames are the embarrassment? The team that has done nothing but play balls out for wins after they were eliminated from the playoffs? The team that has crawled from 2nd pick to 7th in the last 2 weeks or so? The team that this entire city has been collectively scratching their head at, not knowing if we should laugh or cry? Have you seen the other teams that are in a similar position?

I agree that tanking should be looked at, but it should be looked at based on what is happening on the ice, not based on roster changes that allow a team to look at what they have in prospects, allowing youth and energy to come into the lineup, and also, in case you missed it, WINS

[cDnStealth]

At the very least, I don't think it should be possible for the same team to draft first overall more than two years in a row. IMO, every team not in the playoffs should get an equal shot at the #1 pick. The rest can be ordered as it is now.

[Flames Fan, Ph.D.]

Moving this post from another thread:

I've been thinking of this as well. I'm agreed that there needs to be a balance between teams that genuinely need help versus teams being purposefully non-competitive. I suspect the very strong top 3 in this draft year has exacerbated the drive for the basement.

My preference would be very similar to yours in that I would keep it a progressive lotto, but make a couple of small differences:

- teams get a certain percentage allotted to them based on their position in the overall standings, but the difference between worst and 17th worst in points is narrower than it is now

- award teams additional % points based on wins (regulation wins only), with the team with the lowest wins receiving no additional percentage allotment

- the lottery defines the first three positions, with the remaining filled out based on position in the standings


Ideally you could mess with the percentage allotments so that the teams out of the playoffs still have an incentive to play well to gain chances at the lottery to a point where it would make a meaningful impact on their chance to pick top 3. The reliance of the additional percentage points on regulation wins would also be a subtle nudge to urge teams to go for the win... the 17th best team in the league (by points) wouldn't automatically be rewarded additional lottery chances as a reliance on extra-time wins would be a negative.

[Erick Estrada]

Take a look at the two lineups the Flames and Predators are showcasing thonight and try to come up with an educated reason they are not tanking to get a higher pick in July. The talent evaluation angle works to an extent but you can't sugar coat what his happening here. I want one of these high and mighty posters that like to make these high on the horse posts berating others for having a different opinion and simply observing what has transpired over the past few weeks in the NHL. Please explain to the peasants your vast knowledge of how the NHL works because I have news for you. Tanking is real.

[SebC]

Said it before and I'll say it again... the formula should account for previous picks. If you are hanging out at the bottom repeatedly (like the Oilers) you get a higher pick because the expectation is that your previous high picks are putting you on an upward trajectory.

Teams might still tank in any given season though.

[HOOT]

Originally Posted by puckluck2

In what other league would they not dress the best possible lineup?

The NBA is one.

[Flames Fan, Ph.D.]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Take a look at the two lineups the Flames and Predators are showcasing thonight and try to come up with an educated reason they are not tanking to get a higher pick in July. The talent evaluation angle works to an extent but you can't sugar coat what his happening here. I want one of these high and mighty posters that like to make these high on the horse posts berating others for having a different opinion and simply observing what has transpired over the past few weeks in the NHL. Please explain to the peasants your vast knowledge of how the NHL works because I have news for you. Tanking is real.

The only thing missing from tonight's Preds - Flames game will be a Jimmy Conway sighting.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by HOOT

The NBA is one.

You are correct although the NBA isn't exactly the high bar for professional sports. That's as fixed a league as there is in North America.

[puckluck2]

Originally Posted by HOOT

The NBA is one.

Players coming off the bench or actual regulars being scratched?

Maybe it does happen as I do follow the NBA, but not as closely as the NHL.

[Igottago]

Its a black mark on the league and should be considered an embarrassment. I understand the philosophy of letting the weaker teams draft higher, but there needs to be an incentive to actually compete. Also, teams like the Oilers should not be consistently rewarded with top assets every year just becuase they mask continuous suckage as some type of amazing management strategy. That is horse manure.

The integrety of the league and the game really takes a hit when you look at whats going on this season.

[hayduke's dad]

Originally Posted by puckluck2

The new draft lottery was supposed to help keep teams from purposely tanking.

Well tonight the Flames sit Stempniak, Backlund, Stajan, Cammalleri.

They are in tank mode and have been for at least the last 2 weeks, but the young guys just haven't got the memo.

Scratching those players is an embarrassment to the NHL in my opinion. In what other league would they not dress the best possible lineup? It really is a disservice to the fans who watch the game.

I am hoping we win every game to end the season. Rewarding such actions is just plain wrong.

We made fun of the Oilers for purposely tanking yet here we are dressing a lineup the ECHL might reject.

And still not a good enough tank effort for moon and eric. Maybe they should pull the goalie and try 6 on 5 for a couple periods.

[Tinordi]

What is the outrage over? That paying fans don't get to see the best possible lineups? That's a fair criticism. But otherwise, it's an invariably flawed system by rewarding failure. There's no other way around it and the incentives it creates. The alternative is just not as good in the long-term health of the league.

This is why the 3 point game argument hangs over this conversation. Most people on the board are against the current point system but it does serve to keep more teams "in it" to compete to the very end.

You can't be against the point system and against the draft lottery system at the same time.

[FakenHaken]

I liked the Fan 960 idea this morning to be honest.

The idea I think is this once a team is mathematically elimanted from the playoffs. Then the team with the most points accumulated between then and the end of the season gets the first pick and so on down the line.

For Example:

If Columbus were eliminated from the playoffs on game 60 then they would have game 61 - 82 to try and accumulate the most amount of points possible. Let's say that is 10 points.

If Edmonton were eliminated from the playoffs on game 72. Then they would have game 73 - 82 to try and accumulate the most amount of points possible. Let's say 5 points and came in 4th.

In this example Columbus picks first and then Team 2, Team 3, and then Edmonth 4th.

This would prevent the tanking theory, but it would still bring fans to the rink trying to cheer their team onto victory.

Also, I'd stop being a fan of the Edmonton Oilers, Carolina Hurricanes, Tampa Bay Lightning, Florida Panthers, Colorado Avalanche, Nashville Predators. It's too hard cheering for all these teams to win.

[AC]

I think the easiest modification would be to eliminate 1 pingpong ball for each top 3 pick a team has had in the past 3 years (or 5 years maybe). In addition, have a lottery for each of the top 5 picks.

[CSharp]

Originally Posted by puckluck2

The new draft lottery was supposed to help keep teams from purposely tanking.

Well tonight the Flames sit Stempniak, Backlund, Stajan, Cammalleri.

They are in tank mode and have been for at least the last 2 weeks, but the young guys just haven't got the memo.

Scratching those players is an embarrassment to the NHL in my opinion. In what other league would they not dress the best possible lineup? It really is a disservice to the fans who watch the game.

I am hoping we win every game to end the season. Rewarding such actions is just plain wrong.

We made fun of the Oilers for purposely tanking yet here we are dressing a lineup the ECHL might reject.

The lottery needs to be changed and I liked this post in the GDT




Every non playoff team should have an equal chance so gong shows like tonight don't happen. Nashville is also icing a pathetic lineup.

Too late to tank now. Flames as a team really don't know when to win. They're probably gonna win against the Preds tonight because the Preds are in tank mode as well. And when one talks about other team tanking, you know for sure they're gonna do so. With the Flames, when you want them to win, they lose. When you want them to lose, they win. Flames team is like Murphy's Law.

[EldrickOnIce]

Originally Posted by FakenHaken

I liked the Fan 960 idea this morning to be honest.

The idea I think is this once a team is mathematically elimanted from the playoffs. Then the team with the most points accumulated between then and the end of the season gets the first pick and so on down the line.

For Example:

If Columbus were eliminated from the playoffs on game 60 then they would have game 61 - 82 to try and accumulate the most amount of points possible. Let's say that is 10 points.

If Edmonton were eliminated from the playoffs on game 72. Then they would have game 73 - 82 to try and accumulate the most amount of points possible. Let's say 5 points and came in 4th.

In this example Columbus picks first and then Team 2, Team 3, and then Edmonth 4th.

This would prevent the tanking theory, but it would still bring fans to the rink trying to cheer their team onto victory.

Also, I'd stop being a fan of the Edmonton Oilers, Carolina Hurricanes, Tampa Bay Lightning, Florida Panthers, Colorado Avalanche, Nashville Predators. It's too hard cheering for all these teams to win.

I like it a lot.
The earlier you are eliminated, the worse team you are and the more games you have to get points to count toward top draft pick.
So maybe you tank earlier instead of later..... but there is at leaast some integrity in it.
Never happen, but I like it!