Alberta Government 2005 Budget Released

[Eagle Eye]

Today the Klein government released the budget for next years spending.

http://www.canada.com/finance/taxes/2005/s...1f-ffb39db14240

No real surprises, looks real nice to increase spending that much and still have a 1.5 Billion surplus.

[Tron_fdc]

At first glance:

Colleges and universities will get a 10 per cent funding increase, including targeted money to increase the number of classroom spaces.

I'm all for spending on education as long as it goes to the right places. A general subsidy would be wrong IMO, as it would encourage foreigners from other countries to take cheap schooling in Alberta, then blaze when they're done.

Maybe subsidize tuition on Canadian citizens only? That would be nice.

There’s also money to hire 190 more police and court security officers in what the government called the largest single-year increase in police officers in 20 years.

New officers is good, as long as it's not a bunch of high paid camera operators. When do we get our "Albertan Army" to take over Curry Barracks??

Both Edmonton and Calgary will get new $500-million health-care centres as part of a three-year, $9-billion capital spending plan. More than $1 billion will go to municipalities this year to help them finance roads, sewers and other projects.

Hospitals=good. New roads....is a billion enough? The roads in Alberta SUCK right now.

Overall, it's GREAT to be in Alberta

[albertGQ]

Hmmm, nothing about AISH or the minimum wage

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

Originally posted by albertGQ+Apr 13 2005, 03:20 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (albertGQ @ Apr 13 2005, 03:20 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Hmmm, nothing about AISH or the minimum wage [/b]

Why would there be anything about he min wage? I don't see why that would be in a budget of spending.

<!--QuoteBegin-fotze
New officers is good, as long as it's not a bunch of high paid camera operators. [/quote]
Well you can think of it as an investment with $20,000/day revenue generation on memorial drive as they move speed limit signs back and forth to fool drivers.......errrr, I mean an investment in safety, ya, safety.[/b][/quote]

Ever since you first mention that I have looked at the signs and are you sure that they move? I just haven't seen them move. It is usually around the soccer field that there is the 70k/hr is it not (I assume you are talking about going westbound by the way).

[JiriHrdina]

Originally posted by albertGQ@Apr 13 2005, 04:20 PM
Hmmm, nothing about AISH or the minimum wage

There is this about AISH.

Living allowances for the disabled, currently limited to $850 a month, are also scheduled to rise, but McClellan said details would be released Friday.

[Tron_fdc]

Originally posted by Mean Mr. Mustard+Apr 13 2005, 10:26 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Mean Mr. Mustard @ Apr 13 2005, 10:26 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

Why would there be anything about he min wage? I don't see why that would be in a budget of spending.

<!--QuoteBegin-fotze
New officers is good, as long as it's not a bunch of high paid camera operators.

Well you can think of it as an investment with $20,000/day revenue generation on memorial drive as they move speed limit signs back and forth to fool drivers.......errrr, I mean an investment in safety, ya, safety.[/b][/quote]

Ever since you first mention that I have looked at the signs and are you sure that they move? I just haven't seen them move. It is usually around the soccer field that there is the 70k/hr is it not (I assume you are talking about going westbound by the way). [/b][/quote]
Moving signs? How crafty! Are they employing tall skinny guys to run around and hide behind trees with speed limit signs attached to their backs?

Now that's daft!

[I-Hate-Hulse]

Originally posted by Tron_fdc@Apr 13 2005, 03:52 PM
I'm all for spending on education as long as it goes to the right places. A general subsidy would be wrong IMO, as it would encourage foreigners from other countries to take cheap schooling in Alberta, then blaze when they're done.

Maybe subsidize tuition on Canadian citizens only? That would be nice.

Foreign students already pay significantly more than Canadian ones. Besides, some of that highly trained talent just might stay and be taxed afterwards, rather than jet back to their "countries".

In fact, I think the bigger issue is of students in general taking up space in Alberta universites, and leaving the province afterwards. Medical & nursing schools are a great example of that.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally posted by JiriHrdina+Apr 13 2005, 03:29 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (JiriHrdina @ Apr 13 2005, 03:29 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-albertGQ@Apr 13 2005, 04:20 PM
Hmmm, nothing about AISH or the minimum wage

There is this about AISH.

Living allowances for the disabled, currently limited to $850 a month, are also scheduled to rise, but McClellan said details would be released Friday. [/b][/quote]
Global news was saying it should go from $850 to $1000. Alot of people feeling like it's still not enough though.

[Bend it like Bourgeois]

Seems to me this budget suggests 2 things:

1) Albertans are a lot more like the rest of Canada than Albertans (and probably the ROC) would like to admit
2) The sooner Ralph steps away the better

We're spending like drunken sailors, our budget is based on $30 + oil just to break even, and the government has absolutely no vision.

Short of an ad scandal, there's nothing to choose between Edmonton and Ottawa.

[Hot_Sauce]

Maybe someone can educate me on how the AISH program works. Should I assume that the ONLY source of income or support comes from the AISH program for people of moderate to severe disability? Are AISH recipients also entitled to funding from other sources? I am assuming that someone of moderate disability can still function to a certain extent in the workforce and uses the AISH as a supplement and not as their be-all-end-all? Do others with more dramatic disabilities (unable to earn AT ALL) receive only AISH or do they also get some form of social assistance - subsidized housing, etc?

Just wondering as it would make me think that if I were to get only $1000 per month I would live a pretty bleak life.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally posted by Hot_Sauce@Apr 13 2005, 07:19 PM
Maybe someone can educate me on how the AISH program works. Should I assume that the ONLY source of income or support comes from the AISH program for people of moderate to severe disability? Are AISH recipients also entitled to funding from other sources? I am assuming that someone of moderate disability can still function to a certain extent in the workforce and uses the AISH as a supplement and not as their be-all-end-all? Do others with more dramatic disabilities (unable to earn AT ALL) receive only AISH or do they also get some form of social assistance - subsidized housing, etc?

Just wondering as it would make me think that if I were to get only $1000 per month I would live a pretty bleak life.

Should I assume that the ONLY source of income or support comes from the AISH program for people of moderate to severe disability?

Generally yes that is the case. If they get a part-time job or what not most of the time their AISH payments will decrease.

Are AISH recipients also entitled to funding from other sources?

Jobs - generally no. Not sure what other sources you are wondering about?

I am assuming that someone of moderate disability can still function to a certain extent in the workforce and uses the AISH as a supplement and not as their be-all-end-all?

That's generally not the case. The funding is supposed to be "Assured Income for the Severely Handicapped" - key word being severe - basically people that cannot work. For most people this is their sole means of income.

Do others with more dramatic disabilities (unable to earn AT ALL) receive only AISH or do they also get some form of social assistance - subsidized housing, etc?

Many do receive other social assitance in the form of subsidized housing, workers, and also rely on services such as the food bank quite heavily. But their AISH cheque is likely the only actual cash they are getting.

[browna]

Originally posted by Bend it like Bourgeois@Apr 13 2005, 07:15 PM
Seems to me this budget suggests 2 things:

1) Albertans are a lot more like the rest of Canada than Albertans (and probably the ROC) would like to admit
2) The sooner Ralph steps away the better

We're spending like drunken sailors, our budget is based on $30 + oil just to break even, and the government has absolutely no vision.

Short of an ad scandal, there's nothing to choose between Edmonton and Ottawa.

lol

[Bend it like Bourgeois]

Originally posted by Hot_Sauce@Apr 13 2005, 06:19 PM
Maybe someone can educate me on how the AISH program works. Should I assume that the ONLY source of income or support comes from the AISH program for people of moderate to severe disability? Are AISH recipients also entitled to funding from other sources? I am assuming that someone of moderate disability can still function to a certain extent in the workforce and uses the AISH as a supplement and not as their be-all-end-all? Do others with more dramatic disabilities (unable to earn AT ALL) receive only AISH or do they also get some form of social assistance - subsidized housing, etc?

Just wondering as it would make me think that if I were to get only $1000 per month I would live a pretty bleak life.

There are many subsidies available beyond AISH, some reduce the AISH payment, some do not.

The problem with AISH is that what was supposed to be assistance for people with severe disabilities has become a welfare system, and a very tricky one at that.

Near as I can tell, the government has chosen to address the problem of AISH becoming welfare by treating it like welfare on the benefits side, but not doing anything to address whether or not it should be welfare.

[Hot_Sauce]

Thanks for the info Jiri. It might be interesting to note that I know of a lady who receives AISH becasue she is a manic depressive. Not 'severely' physically disabled and can hold down a job from time to time. I think the 'severely' handle can be misconstrued to conjure up images of only helpless paralyzed souls bound to whellchairs. Not always the case.

It is unfortunate that the abuse of some forces the gov't to reduce benefits when some can actually earn a few extra bucks. Where is the incentive to work a few hours a week if the proceeds are simply deducted from an AISH check. Crap!

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally posted by Hot_Sauce@Apr 13 2005, 07:49 PM
It is unfortunate that the abuse of some forces the gov't to reduce benefits when some can actually earn a few extra bucks. Where is the incentive to work a few hours a week if the proceeds are simply deducted from an AISH check. Crap!

Yeah that's pretty dumb. I would imagine finding and keeping work is hard enough for most of the people that need these benefits. Why should they go through all the hassle to make literally no money? Who would?

I don't want to stereotype, but I can't imagine that AISH beneficiaries are going to be getting the most fulfilling/stimulating of jobs. Having them do it for free doesn't make sense.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally posted by Hot_Sauce@Apr 13 2005, 07:49 PM
Thanks for the info Jiri. It might be interesting to note that I know of a lady who receives AISH becasue she is a manic depressive. Not 'severely' physically disabled and can hold down a job from time to time. I think the 'severely' handle can be misconstrued to conjure up images of only helpless paralyzed souls bound to whellchairs. Not always the case.

It is unfortunate that the abuse of some forces the gov't to reduce benefits when some can actually earn a few extra bucks. Where is the incentive to work a few hours a week if the proceeds are simply deducted from an AISH check. Crap!

Agreed. And it speaks to how misunderstood things like depression are. The challenge is that for many people suffering from mental disorders - they can indeed hold down jobs from time to time - but those jobs can also lead to stress which can make their mental disorder worse. Its very tricky stuff. I'm not sure if there is a perfect system. In my view though - I recognize that some people take advantage of AISH but what is better.

1. Having a system that is vulernable to being taken advantage of?
or
2. Having a system that is restrictive enough that people can't take advantage of, but at the price of eliminating some people that actually need the help?

I'll take the first choice...even if it means some low lifes are using the system to get AISH when they dont' really need it. The most important thing is making sure people that need the help get it.

Bend it Like... - what do you mean by AISH being treated by as a Welfare system? I didn't follow where you were going with that.

[Incinerator]

Originally posted by fotze@Apr 13 2005, 09:49 PM
Advanced education is the centrepiece of what McClellan called an investment budget with spending pegged at more than $1.6 billion, 13.4 per cent more than last year. Colleges and universities will get a 10 per cent funding increase, including targeted money to increase the number of classroom spaces.

A previously announced $3-billion endowment fund for post-secondary education will be started this year with an initial $250-million contribution.


Well we all know doubt that the infinite bitching and moaning of all the student unions will end now, right?

I got 1 more year and this is when they start, pfft...damn high school kids will get all the gravy next year :P

[the_only_turek_fan]

Originally posted by Hulse Hater
In fact, I think the bigger issue is of students in general taking up space in Alberta universites, and leaving the province afterwards. Medical & nursing schools are a great example of that.

Not just Alberta but Canada in general

Well lets face it, education in Canada is a lot cheaper than the States, and there are more opportunities in the US than Canada.

With a 10 to 1 tax payer ratio, and a ratio less than that for infrastructure maintenence y you can see why the States have more money for there doctors, nurses etc.....

A lot of docs, nurses, engineers and others have left to the States for more opportunities and less taxes.....

[Incinerator]

Originally posted by Tron_fdc@Apr 13 2005, 09:52 PM

There’s also money to hire 190 more police and court security officers in what the government called the largest single-year increase in police officers in 20 years.

New officers is good, as long as it's not a bunch of high paid camera operators.

Highly paid camera operators in bright yellow "Special Constables" jackets with a box of timbits sitting in air-conditioned Dodge Caravans to be exact.

[Tron_fdc]

So why not offer partial refunds on tuition for sticking around in Alberta for 3-5 yrs after graduating? Maybe partial refunds as well for students who can't find work in their fields (although I don't have a lot of sympathy for people who get graduate degrees in areas that are TOTALLY useless).