Two school systems. Does it cost more?

[MacFlame]

Recently we've moved back to Calgary and we've been asked to determine which school system we support. This got me thinking.

Does having 2 school systems (public and catholic) cost taxpayers more money than having one? I would assume it does, and it makes logical sense that is does. So if it does, why is this issue not raised more often, especially during times when people are complaining about school funding?

I'm hoping this is not going to get into a religon war, but more of a tax dollar debate....

[NuclearFart]

Do catholic schools receive tax payers money?

[flip]

Originally Posted by NuclearFart

Do catholic schools receive tax payers money?

Sure do. You get to pick which system you support.



It is one of those "well its always been done this way" kind of things.

That and Catholic schools are safer and constantly score significantly higher in all aspects of standardized testing so the people who support seperate schools would certainly not give it up.

Yeah, I'm sure it does cost more. But I can tell you this much, as long as I live in a place that has both I'll NEVER send my kids to a public school, no matter how stupid and pointless religion class can be sometimes (although I learned A LOT from a few of my religion teachers).

[MacFlame]

Originally Posted by NuclearFart

Do catholic schools receive tax payers money?

Well it sure isn't a private school.....

[Locke]

The Catholic school system was a guarantee that was placed in the articles of confederation when Alberta joined Canada.

Not going to change.

Does it cost more? Probably, but I also think giving people options is a bonus.

In high school my Religion Teacher was my Rugby coach...just a little Locke trivia for you there...

[MacFlame]

Originally Posted by Locke

The Catholic school system was a guarantee that was placed in the articles of confederation when Alberta joined Canada.

Not going to change.

Does it cost more? Probably, but I also think giving people options is a bonus.

In high school my Religion Teacher was my Rugby coach...just a little Locke trivia for you there...

Oh... I went to a Catholic school as well. My religon teachers were always Gym teachers...almost everyone of them.

I don't really understand by what you mean when you say" giving people option is a bonus". Is the curriculum not the same...minus the religon part?

[NuclearFart]

Originally Posted by MacFlame

Well it sure isn't a private school.....

No financial support from the Catholic church? With all the tithe you guys throw into the dish, I would have thought they could send some of it to their schools. I guess this doesnt occur?

Also Western Canada HS >> St. Mary's HS

[MelBridgeman]

The catholic system was far superior in my day.
Also there was not having class because of the church...was a good thing...it was more of a social event or a time to catch up on some zzz's

religion class was great..usually just a movie and again more nap time. sometimes it was interesting...but was a nice break from regular classes

[guzzy]

Originally Posted by NuclearFart

No financial support from the Catholic church? With all the tithe you guys throw into the dish, I would have thought they could send some of it to their schools. I guess this doesnt occur?

Also Western Canada HS >> St. Mary's HS

Then how is the Vatican going to pay all of the lawsuits for allowing priests to molest boys?

I have no problems with two systems....i kind of like it. Besides, I always found the Catholic girls a little easier when I was back in school

[DementedReality]

and if any politician ran on the platform of consolidating the administration, the clergy would make sure that their congregants were warned of the hell and damnation that would come if they voted for them.

political suicide.

ps ... i think its a croc! why not fund muslim and jewish school systems?

[guzzy]

Originally Posted by DementedReality

and if any politician ran on the platform of consolidating the administration, the clergy would make sure that their congregants were warned of the hell and damnation that would come if they voted for them.

political suicide.

ps ... i think its a croc! why not fund muslim and jewish school systems?

The thing with that is the country was founded on Christian beliefs so I believe the way it is set up works well for everyone. Those who disagree can leave the country.....is that harsh? I wish we would fight harder for those beliefs like they do in Australia. Over there you can celebrate whatever you want but you can't change the foundation of the country. Ex. Sikhs RCMP officers wearing turbans instead of traditional hats. That wouldn't fly in Australia. It's kind of sad we are such wussies over here.

[MacFlame]

Originally Posted by guzzy

The thing with that is the country was founded on Christian beliefs so I believe the way it is set up works well for everyone. Those who disagree can leave the country.....is that harsh? I wish we would fight harder for those beliefs like they do in Australia. Over there you can celebrate whatever you want but you can't change the foundation of the country. Ex. Sikhs RCMP officers wearing turbans instead of traditional hats. That wouldn't fly in Australia. It's kind of sad we are such wussies over here.

Yup that is harsh....and nonsensical. If everyones left Canada that disagreed with something there would be a population of 1.

[kootenayguy9]

Originally Posted by flip

Sure do. You get to pick which system you support.



It is one of those "well its always been done this way" kind of things.

That and Catholic schools are safer and constantly score significantly higher in all aspects of standardized testing so the people who support seperate schools would certainly not give it up.

Yeah, I'm sure it does cost more. But I can tell you this much, as long as I live in a place that has both I'll NEVER send my kids to a public school, no matter how stupid and pointless religion class can be sometimes (although I learned A LOT from a few of my religion teachers).

The last time I saw the Fraser Institute rankings for High Schools in Calgary CBE Schools performed higher then the separate system in standardized testing. Also if you are student that has any kind of special needs the Separate system has minimal supports in place compared to schools in the CBE.

I teach at a public school where we have many students coming from both Catholic Junior or Senior Highs and all they tell me is how rotten the Catholic School System is. Many of my students tell me how the Catholic System didn't meet their learning needs and how our school is now meeting their learning needs.

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by guzzy

The thing with that is the country was founded on Christian beliefs so I believe the way it is set up works well for everyone. Those who disagree can leave the country.....is that harsh?

You are aware that allowing Catholic schools was a constitutional right given to French-speaking (and predominantly Catholic) Quebec, right? It had absolutely nothing to do with Canada being founded on "Christian beliefs", since the majority of English-speaking Canada at the time was Protestant. When the British North America Act was signed in 1867, Quebec politicians ensured that they had the right to "protect" their province's children from cultural assimilation by Protestant Ontario by providing them with a Catholic education (in those days, it was mainly churches who ran schools, not the government).

Over the past few decades, many provinces have done away with publicly-funded Catholic schools entirely.

[ken0042]

I was actually surprised to see only 2 school systems when I moved to Calgary. I know in Winnipeg there were at least 7 representing different parts of the city; something left over from pre-1970 when Winnipeg was made up of a dozen cities and towns.

[psicodude]

Originally Posted by kootenayguy9

The last time I saw the Fraser Institute rankings for High Schools in Calgary CBE Schools performed higher then the separate system in standardized testing. Also if you are student that has any kind of special needs the Separate system has minimal supports in place compared to schools in the CBE.

I teach at a public school where we have many students coming from both Catholic Junior or Senior Highs and all they tell me is how rotten the Catholic School System is. Many of my students tell me how the Catholic System didn't meet their learning needs and how our school is now meeting their learning needs.

Purely made-up crap, and yes, I work for the Catholic System.

2007 - 2008 Achievment test results:

CBE: http://www.cbe.ab.ca/results/pdf_08/...T%20atr_08.pdf

CSSD: http://www.cssd.ab.ca/files/provinci...dents07-08.pdf

Catholic system meets or beats public in virtually every category. You would think a teacher would base his opinion on facts, or at least say what the CBE is doing right, as opposed to slagging the "competition". I would be happy to post the student to teacher ratios as well if you want more proof.

Back on topic...After the govt. combined all of the health boards, there was a lot of talk that they would do the same with the schools. It does make a lot of sense as a taxpayer, but I really would like to keep my job.

[flip]

Originally Posted by kootenayguy9

The last time I saw the Fraser Institute rankings for High Schools in Calgary CBE Schools performed higher then the separate system in standardized testing. Also if you are student that has any kind of special needs the Separate system has minimal supports in place compared to schools in the CBE.

I teach at a public school where we have many students coming from both Catholic Junior or Senior Highs and all they tell me is how rotten the Catholic School System is. Many of my students tell me how the Catholic System didn't meet their learning needs and how our school is now meeting their learning needs.

Sorry but that is crap. On grade 12 diploma exams (the only ones that count) Catholic schools kill public schools.

[Antithesis]

Calgary has absolutely massive school systems compared to, well, everywhere else in Canada. As Ken mentioned, there are 7, if not more, school systems serving Winnipeg.

The CBE is actually the largest school system in the entire country.

There are actually four systems in Calgary but the other two are tiny Francophone districts.

[guzzy]

Originally Posted by MacFlame

Yup that is harsh....and nonsensical. If everyones left Canada that disagreed with something there would be a population of 1.

It was more of a joke than an actual statement. I do believe we should fight harder to create and establish a Canadian identity. Today, any immigrant can come here and change the way society lives. I believe you should be able to celebrate and practice your beliefs. I also believe that us, as Canadians, should be able to celebrate what has made us Canadian all these years.

I remember when I was in elementary school we used to get together every morning for 30 minutes and sing xmas carols on the last week before xmas holidays (you can't even call them xmas holidays in our own country any more). A good friend of mine, then and now, was Jewish. He and another girl would go sit in the library or the arts room with our Jewish music teacher and do whatever they wanted. They loved the half hour, and we loved the half hour. It was diversity at its finest. This can't exist anymore because people have to OUR country and thrown their beliefs in our face. We are such a meek nation that we allowed it.

I believe that if you don't support the way our country was founded then you should tow the line and just keep your mouth shut. Our identity as a nation is crumbling because we are so passive.

[guzzy]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

You are aware that allowing Catholic schools was a constitutional right given to French-speaking (and predominantly Catholic) Quebec, right? It had absolutely nothing to do with Canada being founded on "Christian beliefs", since the majority of English-speaking Canada at the time was Protestant. When the British North America Act was signed in 1867, Quebec politicians ensured that they had the right to "protect" their province's children from cultural assimilation by Protestant Ontario by providing them with a Catholic education (in those days, it was mainly churches who ran schools, not the government).

Over the past few decades, many provinces have done away with publicly-funded Catholic schools entirely.

You are aware that catholicism is a Christian-based religion?
Quebec was here when the country was founded so they deserve those rights and we should continue to fight for them. What i don't agree with is that religion is being torn from public schools (xmas and easter holidays are now known as winter and spring break....disgusting). I am not even a religious person. I don't support organized religion...for myself, but I do think it is an amazing thing for those who need it.