LeBrun: How one more Stars win in 2016 could have made Frederik Andersen a Flame

[sureLoss]

Been discussed before, but I think Lebrun provides more detail

https://theathletic.com/683338/2018/...calgary-flame/

Anaheim’s offer to Calgary was to flip first-round picks in the 2016 draft, the Flames had the sixth overall pick and Anaheim had No. 24, plus the Ducks would have thrown in another asset and of course Andersen. One assumes Anaheim would have made that deal over the one it did with the Leafs.

But Flames GM Brad Treliving just couldn’t stomach the idea of giving up the sixth overall pick.

He also goes on to talk about the conditional pick that the Flames got from Dallas in the Kris Russel trade:

Had that pick changed to a first, it’s my understanding that Treliving would have packaged that pick in the offer to Anaheim along with another asset or two. That Stars pick would have ended up being 26th or 27th had they lost in the conference finals, a few spots ahead of that 30th overall pick the Ducks got from Toronto in the actual trade that went down.

He says in that scenario the Ducks would have probably wanted 3 assets instead of the 2 the Leafs gave up for keeping Andersen in the division and speculates that the Flames would have been able to get the same contract that Andersen signed with the Leafs

[Vinny01]

Obviously couldn’t give up the Tkachuk pick to the ducks but if they would have been able to trade the Stars 1st and their 2nd which was in the 30’s and possible the other 2nd from Hudler they likely could have topped the Leafs offer.

No Dube or Parsons then and with those prospects looking strong he may have held off trading for Hamonic (at least giving up 3 picks for him)

[Textcritic]

When I read stories like this my initial thought is, “thank god Treliving did not trade the #6 pick in 2016.” Can you imagine if he had?


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[Enoch Root]

Of all the places Tkachuk could be, imagine him being in Anaheim.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Of all the places Tkachuk could be, imagine him being in Anaheim.

Like I dont hate Anaheim enough as it is.

Although the thought of Tkachuk pushing children off of Space Mountain is pretty funny.

[Erick Estrada]

As good as Tkachuk is you only have to look at Anaheim to see that a top goaltender addresses a lot more issues than a winger. If the Flames make that trade you can argue they may be a better overall team today but it didn't happen so it is what it is.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Of all the places Tkachuk could be, imagine him being in Anaheim.

Like they need another #######.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

As good as Tkachuk is you only have to look at Anaheim to see that a top goaltender addresses a lot more issues than a winger. If the Flames make that trade you can argue they may be a better overall team today but it didn't happen so it is what it is.

Tkachuk is still a more valuable asset than Andersen or Gibson. Goalies just don't have this kind of value in the NHL.

[Red Slinger]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

As good as Tkachuk is you only have to look at Anaheim to see that a top goaltender addresses a lot more issues than a winger. If the Flames make that trade you can argue they may be a better overall team today but it didn't happen so it is what it is.

Yes, that can be argued. But the equation isn't Anderson or Tkachuk. It's Anderson or Tkachuk and Smith/Rittich/Whoever else is starting.

[Toonage]

100% certain that Treliving adds the final piece (a top goalie) this off season, and the Flames will have all they need to make a legit run without having given up Tkachuk.

Also, isn't LeBrun above make work projects like this?

[Huntingwhale]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Of all the places Tkachuk could be, imagine him being in Anaheim.

Jesus Lord. We're still waiting for that team of ######s to decline 5+ years after they were supposed to, and adding Tkachuk would have revitalised that core for another 10 years.

At least we would have known how other teams feel when they play against him *shudder*.

Andersen would have been nice though.

[1991 Canadian]

Tkachuk under the tutelage of Perry and Kesler would be terrifying. He's enough of a shirt disturber on his own.

This might be one of those scenarios where the Flames have the better player, but they might be a better team if they had Andersen instead of Tkachuk.

If the Flames can continue to get solid goaltending out of Rittich, this non trade becomes a non factor, but poor goaltending will sink this team regardless of how well Tkachuk plays.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

As good as Tkachuk is you only have to look at Anaheim to see that a top goaltender addresses a lot more issues than a winger. If the Flames make that trade you can argue they may be a better overall team today but it didn't happen so it is what it is.

You can, but I think it is a pretty silly argument, to be honest. Tkachuk is tracking to be the best player on the team, and he is potentially a high-impact producer for the Flames for a full decade. Andersen is not so good that he makes up for all of that. I don't think he is nearly as good as Jon Gibson, who deserves the credit you attribute to Anaheim's performance under a top goalie.

[Enoch Root]

Yeah, Anderson is a good goalie, but his replacement is another good goalie (might turn out to be Rittich).

Conversely, Tkachuk is almost unreplaceable. You can't just go out and acquire another one.

Also, goalies can go bad at any moment - no matter how good they are. But great young players tend to have substantially longer shelf-lifes.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Yeah, Anderson is a good goalie, but his replacement is another good goalie (might turn out to be Rittich).

Conversely, Tkachuk is almost unreplaceable. You can't just go out and acquire another one.

Also, goalies can go bad at any moment - no matter how good they are. But great young players tend to have substantially longer shelf-lifes.

You guys make it sound like Tkachuk is going to carry this team to the playoffs. He hasn't, won't, and can't. Andersson could. It's silly to compare Rittich to Anderson because one goaltender has a career .919 SV% over 278 games while the other one is still unknown. All the Flames have needed over the past few years is a goaltender that puts up consistently league average or better to be a perennial playoff team. I like Tkachuk but unless we are talking about Ovechkin there's no way a winger has value to a team like a top goaltender.

[David Struch]

Originally Posted by 1991 Canadian

This might be one of those scenarios where the Flames have the better player, but they might be a better team if they had Andersen instead of Tkachuk.

I'd say it would've been the same case for sending 16th overall in 2017 to Vegas for Marc-André Fleury.

Flames would be a better team (with a better shot at the Cup) atm but in the long term, losing Juuso Välimäki would've been a stinger.

[dammage79]

I'd rather try for Matt Murray this year than lose Chuckles for Anderson that year.

[ForeverFlameFan]

Tkachuk on Anaheim would make me cry.

Tkachuk - Kesler - Perry

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by David Struch

I'd say it would've been the same case for sending 16th overall in 2017 to Vegas for Marc-André Fleury.

Flames would be a better team (with a better shot at the Cup) atm but in the long term, losing Juuso Välimäki would've been a stinger.

I suppose it all boils down to when you think your window is open and if you have to pounce. I think the Flames are certainly better off with Valimaki than Fleury due to his age but if you think your time to win is now losing out on a guy like Valimaki is not the end of the world with Andersson and Kylington in the organization.

[Toonage]

^ Which is why I think the Flames move their 1st round pick this year to secure the rights/sign for a guy like Varlamov.

The window is just opening and this off season will be the time to secure that goalie