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Calgary4LIfe · 02-12-2019, 01:03 AM

I think that trading Tkachuk away to Ottawa is a bad move. I don't think it has anything to do with value, however - I would assume that Treliving would have received permission to at least hold preliminary talks with the players and their respective agents about signing extensions. For me, it is a bad move for two reasons:

1) Too big of a chemistry change. You don't 'shake-up' a team before the playoffs. Tkachuk seems to be a big part of the locker-room and culture.

2) Argue about just how good Tkachuk is, but no matter which side of the argument you fall on, I think everyone agrees that Tkachuk can often be a game-changer and can help you win games, and I bet especially during playoffs. He was unbelievable in London's run, and played injured for instance. You want that type of player in your lineup, and you want to add more of them, not merely exchange them for another game-changer.

IMO, Stone will probably end up being traded for:

2 first round picks
Prospect
Salary cap player

Calgary should be able to match that if they wanted to quite easily, if not beat it.

1st 2019
Dube (he is probably worth a late first - almost NHL-ready and looking like a sure-fire player which is what you hope for in a late first)
Kylington/Andersson - this hurts, but either of them are worth a late first
Frolik - cap space, but not negative hit, so that's a bonus

Rationale:
A late first is a late first. Ottawa isn't going to be getting any offers from teams who aren't sure they are making the playoffs. Probably 5-10 teams that think of themselves as contenders with Stone in the lineup.

Dube - He is a good prospect. Near NHL ready, he is fast, and it looks like he will be a solid 2-way player with strong underlying metrics. To me, that's worth a late first. It is really difficult to find a better player 20th overall or worse.

Kylington/Andersson - if they aren't worth a late first, I don't know who is. Young defencemen not getting their heads caved-in at this early stage is impressive, and they can move the puck well. Either of them look like they will become top 4 defencemen. Maybe a #2 guy down the road. What they have been doing is impressive.

Frolik - look at Ottawa. They are 2nd last in goals against. Remove Stone, and they will be last almost assuredly. Frolik will at least help replace Stone's defensive presence on the team, and his speed will fit in nicely on that team that likes to play with tempo. I actually would rather not lose Frolik for this upcoming playoffs as I think he is great depth and you can trust him against any line out there in the NHL - that's value, and he helps Calgary win. However, Calgary will need to clear some cap for next season, and in no way do I want Frolik's agent to start tweeting about Frolik being utilized on the 4th line once Stone pushes him off that 2nd line. That's a distraction I would rather not have on the team during the playoffs.

Calgary can also kick-in a prospect or two and/or a pick, and get back some depth on D - if not from Ottawa, then from some other team.

I think Treliving would be given permission to discuss an extension with Stone with him and his agent, I would assume, given that the acquisition price is fairly high. That's a lot to give up just for a single playoff run. This to me only makes sense if you re-sign Stone and have him for most if not all through the cup window.

I just don't see much sense in trading Tkachuk away as part of a package. I don't like Duchene enough to have to include Tkachuk. Duchene will probably go for a similar package, but I would rather not touch him. If Duchene could buy into becoming a 2-way player, that would be awesome, but he isn't.

I want game-changers on this team that are difficult to play against - maybe not necessarily big, physically dominating players (though that would be wonderful too!), but players with a high compete level all over the ice. Players that fight for the puck and hate to get beaten. Players that make other players on the team better. That's what I want Calgary to acquire. Nyquist, Zuccarello, Schenn (before St. Louis decided to be good again, making him unavailable... dammit!!), etc., would all be welcome additions if Stone is too costly. I am actually expecting more of these types of moves once their prices go down if Stone, Duchene, Dzingel, Hoffman and Panarin hit the market.

02-12-2019, 01:03 AM	#9635
Calgary4LIfe Franchise Player Join Date: Jun 2010 Exp:	I think that trading Tkachuk away to Ottawa is a bad move. I don't think it has anything to do with value, however - I would assume that Treliving would have received permission to at least hold preliminary talks with the players and their respective agents about signing extensions. For me, it is a bad move for two reasons: 1) Too big of a chemistry change. You don't 'shake-up' a team before the playoffs. Tkachuk seems to be a big part of the locker-room and culture. 2) Argue about just how good Tkachuk is, but no matter which side of the argument you fall on, I think everyone agrees that Tkachuk can often be a game-changer and can help you win games, and I bet especially during playoffs. He was unbelievable in London's run, and played injured for instance. You want that type of player in your lineup, and you want to add more of them, not merely exchange them for another game-changer. IMO, Stone will probably end up being traded for: 2 first round picks Prospect Salary cap player Calgary should be able to match that if they wanted to quite easily, if not beat it. 1st 2019 Dube (he is probably worth a late first - almost NHL-ready and looking like a sure-fire player which is what you hope for in a late first) Kylington/Andersson - this hurts, but either of them are worth a late first Frolik - cap space, but not negative hit, so that's a bonus Rationale: A late first is a late first. Ottawa isn't going to be getting any offers from teams who aren't sure they are making the playoffs. Probably 5-10 teams that think of themselves as contenders with Stone in the lineup. Dube - He is a good prospect. Near NHL ready, he is fast, and it looks like he will be a solid 2-way player with strong underlying metrics. To me, that's worth a late first. It is really difficult to find a better player 20th overall or worse. Kylington/Andersson - if they aren't worth a late first, I don't know who is. Young defencemen not getting their heads caved-in at this early stage is impressive, and they can move the puck well. Either of them look like they will become top 4 defencemen. Maybe a #2 guy down the road. What they have been doing is impressive. Frolik - look at Ottawa. They are 2nd last in goals against. Remove Stone, and they will be last almost assuredly. Frolik will at least help replace Stone's defensive presence on the team, and his speed will fit in nicely on that team that likes to play with tempo. I actually would rather not lose Frolik for this upcoming playoffs as I think he is great depth and you can trust him against any line out there in the NHL - that's value, and he helps Calgary win. However, Calgary will need to clear some cap for next season, and in no way do I want Frolik's agent to start tweeting about Frolik being utilized on the 4th line once Stone pushes him off that 2nd line. That's a distraction I would rather not have on the team during the playoffs. Calgary can also kick-in a prospect or two and/or a pick, and get back some depth on D - if not from Ottawa, then from some other team. I think Treliving would be given permission to discuss an extension with Stone with him and his agent, I would assume, given that the acquisition price is fairly high. That's a lot to give up just for a single playoff run. This to me only makes sense if you re-sign Stone and have him for most if not all through the cup window. I just don't see much sense in trading Tkachuk away as part of a package. I don't like Duchene enough to have to include Tkachuk. Duchene will probably go for a similar package, but I would rather not touch him. If Duchene could buy into becoming a 2-way player, that would be awesome, but he isn't. I want game-changers on this team that are difficult to play against - maybe not necessarily big, physically dominating players (though that would be wonderful too!), but players with a high compete level all over the ice. Players that fight for the puck and hate to get beaten. Players that make other players on the team better. That's what I want Calgary to acquire. Nyquist, Zuccarello, Schenn (before St. Louis decided to be good again, making him unavailable... dammit!!), etc., would all be welcome additions if Stone is too costly. I am actually expecting more of these types of moves once their prices go down if Stone, Duchene, Dzingel, Hoffman and Panarin hit the market.