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Old 08-12-2025, 09:11 AM   #12413
Erick Estrada
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Originally Posted by Fuzz View Post
I am in no way suggesting Trudeau didn't make mistakes, but some of those things you list are true only if you look at them through a Conservative lens. And many are Canadian challenges that (oh, here we go!) Harper didn't do any better on. I think we look for a leader to blame, but the reality is some stuff is really hard for Canada(and other countries as well) to solve. It's hard to do the right thing for the country when the previous PM worked to remove taxes, and the entire right has made that the only option, such that anyone on the left who may say "wait, we do need more money to do these things" is instantly written off by potential voters because of the endless deceitful messaging form places like the Frasier Institute.

As to "fanned the flames with is identity politics" I think that's nonsense, and the same pitfall the US made with regard to DEI and "woke". Ensuring all citizens have their rights protected isn't fanning flames. Defending the vulnerable is a good thing. Most of what gets trotted out as initiatives from the left are just reactions to the right attempting to remove the rights of others.

As to your initial question, "what exactly about Trudeau's decade in power could you use to convince Conservative voters that they should jump ship?" that isn't really a question to bother answering. Nothing? Trudeau has zero roll in government. He's gone. The only thing you can do is look at the current leader and direction of the party and relate it to the stuff Trudeau did, if you want to try to understand where they are going.

No, the far more important question for democracy is "how does voting for this current iteration of Conservative parties in Canada help move them back to sanity, and way from Trumpism?" If you are going to do the political groundwork to change the party from inside, well go ahead. That would be great. But most people don't, so all they have is their vote. And if you vote in support of them, you are admitting you are OK with that direction, which, well, look south. You actually have to reject a party for them to change, which Liberal voters know well, and Conservatives used to. Yes, it means another party will be in power, but that at least ensures we will continue to have a country worth caring for.

And if you do support the current direction, well WTF am I supposed to conclude? You already know my feelings on that, and it's why I am not shy on calling it out. Because it's indisputably wrong.
Fuzz you are an extremist. It is what it is. I don't hold it against you as I think your heart is in the right place but you are too far gone to be reasoned with. I think too many of you are using Trump as a boogeyman here equating what's going on in the US to what would happen in Canada under a Conservative government. Like I said before I'm happy with Carney right now because I want what's best for the country but the Liberals under Trudeau weren't that at all, and if the Liberals revert back to that my patience will be tested especially if the Conservatives ever trot out a competent leader.
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