[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Wow ...

The bolded is way over the top.

If that being pointed out is making you uncomfortable maybe you should stop and re-think how you're approaching this. You're not a fan of making assumptions without all the information but refuse to look at the information available that spells out what happened. "Your ADD won't let you read the report." Isn't a good enough excuse if you want to wade into something as serious as this and try and claim we just need more information without looking at the information we do have.

Originally Posted by Fighting Banana Slug

This where you lose the plot. Your level of outrage is your right, but people hear are telling you how they see the issue and how their outrage is not the level of yours. I think we can all agree that there are levels of complicity in this situation:

Perpetrator- can rot in hell
Management (Quennville, Bowman, other coaches and front office)- Suspension from the NHL for at least some time, arguably forever.
Players who insulted victim-Should have been suspended, but I can't see any world where that would be forever
Players who knew and did nothing-shameful act, open to ridicule, but suspension worthy? That is the discussion
Players who knew nothing-nothing

Sure, but when you have former players and reports coming out making it very clear that every one knew, why are some people trying to argue Seabrook should be absolved of wrong doing because "we don't know enough,"?

Originally Posted by Fighting Banana Slug

I don't recall the outrage when Kane moved on. Maybe it was there, but it wasn't based on homerism. He made millions more in earnings. Toews there was some discussion, but more so that he probably isn't a good player anymore. No real outrage.

Wait till a Kane thread pops up now, I'll be there reminding everyone what he was a part of just the same. When Kane first moved, what the Blackhawks did was still a top discussion. Now I feel compelled to remind everyone with what that Organization got away with and what it's members did during that time.

Originally Posted by Fighting Banana Slug

Now we have Seabrook, a guy that is what? A part time player development coach? A guy that knows how to play defence and is now teaching defense? That is where we need to draw the line? The level of outrage does not match the harmful conduct nor the position Seabrook has been placed.

Sure, bring him in. Just remember the type of person he is. Remember he was a leader until it was hard. And remember the response his presence will get.

Originally Posted by Fighting Banana Slug

No team is beyond terrible behaviour (Canucks: see Virtanenen, Aquilini, Bertuzi, etc.). In fact any organization of any size will have these issues. I am at a smallish company, and unfortunately internal investigations of all shapes and sizes is part of my job. Sometimes that results in firings, but more often it results in more training, reprimands and the like. Not blackballing an individual forever, which seems to be your solution, unless you have other ideas you would like to share.

And I've never hesitated to call out Virtanen and Aquilini, and I am not about to start stopping. But Aquilini and Virtanen are also permanently stained with their actions, Virtanen with a sexual assault and Aquilini with just being a general piece of #### who abuses immigrant workers. I don't expect Seabrook to be blackballed forever. I do hope he, along with everyone else in the organization wear this mark for the rest of their lives, or at least until something resembling an actual punishment or act of contrition is seen. I hope teams will always remember what the players on the Blackhawks did when it was time to do the right thing. Until we see something of a punishment or an indicaton actual contrition I will never hesitate to remind people what happened on that team in the name of winning.

Originally Posted by Leeman4Gilmour

Maybe all of the things people want Seabrook to do to make amends for whatever he did or didn't know or did or didn't do was done privately. Not everything needs to be carried out in the public domain.

Not everything does but this is a situation where if we want to make sure stuff like this never happens again, we need to make sure that the punishments and apologies are out in the open. Everyone even tangentially involved admitting a huge mistake was made is incredibly important here.

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I just can't get behind the bolded statement. You simply can't assume everyone involved with the Hawks at that time is guilty simply because you don't know the facts and the truth. You are painting with broad strokes and I hope you don't find yourself in a situation where you were in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Well good news. We have facts. We literally have a report and players stating what happened and what was known and by whom. Was it a "Wrong place, wrong time" thing? For a lot of them, sure. I sincerely doubt anyone on the Blackhawks said "I sure hope one of my teammates gets sexually assaulted!" But even in that situation, when you have a chance to do the right thing even if it's just bad timing you still need to do it. No one on the Blackhawks did at the time and very few have tried to make up for it after the fact.