[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Discuss things with them? You don't think that was tried??? Jiri, come on, hold up the mirror for second. Using you as an example, you dug your heels in and refused to acknowledge the obvious over his tenure. It takes two to have a discussion and a willingness to acknowledge the facts and the dependencies. A great example has always been the state of the development system. Someone points out that the system is in terrible shape you trot out it's not the poor drafting, it's the lack of draft picks - like the GM had nothing to do with the lack of picks. You can't have a conversation about something if someone doesn't see the connection between the two events and understand the guy controls both measures. Even though all sorts of media experts support the Flames have a poor development system and drafting has been historically poor the obvious is ignored.

You can look and see the same thing happened with the trade history, with the contract discussions, with the handling of Gaudreau and failure to get a contract done while the team had leverage, with the inability to find a coach, with cap management, and so on and so on. It was very obvious that the guy was middling at best, but the whole team sports thing kicked in and he became an epic manager. We are still seeing it. Even though the team has been left in horrible shape as an organization, the same tired defenses still come out. I mean, he went on to become the GM of the Toronto Maple Leafs! How do you have a rational conversation with that? Even on the heels of the Athletic's fan survey, and the Flames being dead last in confidence in management - as voted by their own fans (opposition fans had us at second worst!) - we can make the admission that this team has been poorly managed over the last decade and the guy who was in charge did nothing to improve the organization? And I'm the one whose crap is old?

This is just an example of the many posts I've had over the year where I acknowledge BT's strengths and weaknesses

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

So you counter my point that you are taking too extreme and binary of view by offering up another extreme and binary view?

As many have pointed out, Tree was good at some things and bad at others. Generally he got good value in trades (Hamonic trade being an exception), was good at signing RFAs, and the organization's drafting was better under his tenure.

He had some bad coaching hires, horrible UFA signings and bled too many picks.

I see few people who don't recognize that he had strengths and weaknesses or that are "blaming Murray for all the bad ones" and giving "Tree credit for all the good moves". I think most people here have a more balanced view.

I'm perfectly capable of discussing both what he was good at and what he was bad at.