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Originally Posted by PepsiFree
Even though you guys both have your biases I’ve learned a lot from your and Captain Otto’s posts, so why don’t you start at the start? If it educates someone a little bit then it’s probably worth your time, even if you aren’t going to convince the person you’re responding to.
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Thanks Pepsi, I appreciate your post.
Cops are very different from everyone else.
- Not sure how I’m “very” different from everyone else. Seems like an attempt to dehumanize someone because of their job.
As Locke pointed out, it is a cultural thing with most police services. They recruit a bunch of extreme type A personalities who have authoritarian tendencies, give them training which relies on violence for problem resolution, arm them to the teeth, and give them qualified immunity for their actions. What outcome do you expect?
- the psychological screening, background checks and personal reference checks are designed to weed out those who have authoritarian tendencies. Those that somehow make it through even having those tendencies are (from my experience) ostracized and shunned. No one wants to get jammed up in an internal investigation because some jack ass decides to punch someone who’s cuffed or some other idiotic action. They usually don’t last that long in the outfit. However I concede that there those that do and they cause us nothing but grief and headaches both internally and in the public’s opinion.
Our training is not to rely on violence for resolving issues. Literally the first method of intervention on the IMIM (incident management intervention model) which is used as a guide for various levels of resistance etc is officer presence. Then verbal intervention, after that the level of intervention varies to the situation. Crisis intervention and de-escalation training is mandatory and requires to be completed annually, same with other mandatory training for mental health awareness training. I’m not sure what Lanny is referring to when he mentions qualified immunity for their actions, 5 Mounties just got charged last week for their actions, obviously they will have their day in court but they certainly aren’t getting away with anything.
The problem with cops is they "police" matters, and "enforce" the law, rather act as peacekeepers. If they would hire people who have empathy and understand how to communicate - actually listen and speak to find resolution - rather than relying on their gun or taser to enforce their will, they would have a much better reputation and be better at their jobs.
- there are times the laws must be enforced, there are times when there is no time to talk or to try and de-escalate. However the vast majority of the times this is not the case and things are de-escalated without any force being used. I don’t have the exact statistics at this moment but I believe that something like 98% of police/public interactions in Canada result in no force being used at all, how many interactions are there per day? Certainly thousands.
The reason cops have a bad reputation is because the larger percentage of them are obnoxious alpha types who scare the public rather than being approachable and affable to deal with. Their reputation is well earned but most if has developed over decades of bringing the wrong type of person into the fold and then training them to be use force at the first sign of conflict.
- I’d really like Lanny to quantify the percentage of how many police are obnoxious alpha types, I’m curious as to how he arrived at this conclusion. Again, the formal training standard and courses teach exactly the opposite of what Lanny is alleging. Even on my time on the Emergency Response Team (equivalent of US SWAT) de escalation and peaceful resolution was always the goal despite often facing armed and dangerous individuals who had committed violent acts or presented an immediate risk of harm to the public.
Incidents like those in Memphis are despicable and unfortunately cause an upswell in anti-police sentiment. I don’t begrudge the common person for having those feelings initially, but I do find it exhausting when assumptions and emotion are presented as fact for every single police officer.
Oh well, the policeman’s lot is not a happy one!