Quote:
Originally Posted by Pointman
When Putin annexed Crimea, he held a referendum. The people of Crimea voted whether they want to be a part of Russia. It was a joke. It was buffony. No sane person can accept that as a legit vote. The west dismissed that laughable mockery of a "vote".
Yet, in 1954 there was no vote at all. Not even a joke of a vote. Not even a "vote-yes-or-tanks-shoot" type of vote. Nevermind vote, there were not even any opinion polls. Not any type of public discussions of any sort. Mind you public discussions were not a thing in USSR. This is how Ukraine got Crimea. Yet somehow that's ok. Somehow that totalitarian decree is in line with the western values. Somehow the whole civilized world can get behind this USSR decree? To the point that we are having bloodshed over a border line arbitrary drawn by a head of tyrannical state, that no longer exist?
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I guess at some point I need to go longer on your historical claims, but I'm going to make two quick points here.
1. Russia wants to shed blood over Crimea. They are starting a war over it. They are 100% the only one to blame because without Russian aggression, no war would be fought.
2. There are basically no borders drawn in the world that were drawn by a democratic process. It's a completely bogus argument that you can make about literally any border area in the world to justify wars, and it's also qn argument that HAS been used for literally thousands of years. "This area is traditionally ours" might be the most common excuse for war of all time.
It's what makes it an undefensible non-argument
Also, Ukraine 100% has the right to join NATO if it wants, because it's an independent country, and the reason they wanted to join NATO is because they justifiably fear Russian aggression. It's understandable that Russia wouldn't like it, but it's 100% unjustifiable as an excuse for war.
To turn that around and say "we're only attacking you because you are trying to make yourself able to defend yourself from us, and we wouldn't attack you of you made yourself even more unable to defend yourself" is just grotesque.