Quote:
Originally Posted by GGG
Not sure if you are referring to me or not but I think I have been idealogicaly consistent in that one of the main issues is the polices choice to escalate. My issue is what happens in this event is the exact same series of events that leads to dead people for non-violent interactions.
Many of the excessive force videos start with encounters like this one, an officer then becomes fearful of their life, then escalates. The difference between drawing the taser and using it in this instance is very small.
The statement of “If you resist force will be applied” is a huge part of the problem currently with Police. Mentally ill people get shot on wellness visits as a result of that logic.
What if police simply contained the situation until verbal compliance was achieved and only use force to prevent escape. It might take several hours but eventually the kid would allow himself to be cuffed or he would try to escape at which point you could escalate the level of force.
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No, wasn't referring to you.
With everything, it's situational. I don't really agree that "if you resist force will be applied" is part of the problem, it's the fact that reasonable force is unclear. Pulling the taser was over the line, but that was mitigated by the fact that the taser wasn't fired. Yes, this situation could have gone much worse, but almost every situation can go worse. And the situations that end in death or injury could probably have gone better. It's hard to theorize on hypotheticals. We should look at where excessive force wasn't applied and acknowledge it as a positive, and look to where it was and acknowledge it as a negative.
Using force appropriately and successfully is part of the job when it comes to someone who is physically resisting or trying to escape. What makes force excessive is based on the situation. It would have been excessive to taser Ocean, just as it's been excessive every time we've seen lethal force used on someone who was not an immediate lethal threat, but it didn't happen.
It's also why I believe that people who are better equipped to handle certain situations regarding mental health or domestic issues should be present, and budgeting should make that possible. It helps to avoid things like a mentally ill person being shot at a wellness visit. But a 20-something man of sound mind willingly breaking the law and refusing any directions from bylaw? That's a job for the police. And when police try to arrest you and you struggle or look to escape? That's where appropriate levels of force are needed.