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Originally posted by Bleeding Red+Dec 9 2004, 02:53 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Bleeding Red @ Dec 9 2004, 02:53 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Bring_Back_Shantz@Dec 9 2004, 08:35 PM
As far as the priest goes, as far as he is concerned, he cannot marry two gay people, anymore than he can fly, why? Because as far as the church is concerned marriage is only between a man and a woman. Forcing a priest to do it would be just as descriminatory as me not fixing someone's car because he is black. No where in the bible (or anything the pope has said) does it preclude gay people from going to church, or does it say that catholics can't marry non catholics (using catholic as an example), but it does have a pretty clear set of rules for marriage, so saying they include them in their services isn't a valid arguement.
You ask me to build a brick house out of wood, and I can't do it regardless of whether you are black, white, gay, straight, or if I even care if you are. You can't build a brick house out of wood. Priests can't build a catholic marriage out of two men, or two women, because in either case they are missing a vital component. Is that right in the moral sense, some say yes, some say no, but the priest is definately saying yes, and making him do it would be just as illigal as anything you have put forth.
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"No where in the bible (or anything the pope has said) does it preclude gay people from going to church, or does it say that catholics can't marry non catholics (using catholic as an example), but it does have a pretty clear set of rules for marriage"
The penalty for homosexuality is excomunication from the faith - those that have professed to a homosexual lifestyle are barred from the faith (including services in church) and the Bible commands Jews not to marry non-Jews or face the same penalty.
The Catholic Church does have a clear set of rules for marriage - they include catholics can't marry non catholics.
"Priests can't build a catholic marriage out of two men, or two women"
I think there are some gay couples and a few "Progressive" clergy who would dissagree with you there.
I'm just saying that the argument is possible. If the activist gay couple could prove that the clergyperson has been flexible in his beliefs and practices in the past, then the court may say that he/she must be flexible now [/b][/quote]
Interesting, I wasn't aware that Jews were catholics. And all along I just though I was a normal white cahtolic guy, turns out I'm a jew.
That being said, fine the bible says gays aren't allowed in the church and jews can't marry jews. So who is in charge of the rules of the church? Well eventually God is, and who is his rep on earth? The pope, and the pope has said that people of different faiths can marry, and that homosexuals are allowed to participate in services, but still not marry, and guess what, short of JC commnig back to earth and telling us what the new rules are, the pope is the ultimate trup card regardless of what the bible says.
That being said, your comment about forward thinking clergy is a little naive. Sure many religions think it's okay, and those clearly aren't the ones that will be forced to perform the marriage, it's the ones that have rules against that sort of thing. For example, any catholic priest who doesn't think it's a sin to marry another man, and presumably have sex with him, should probalby rethink his faith, especially his own vow of celebacy.
Besides, you're missing the point. The SCC has already said that it would be unconstitutional for people to try to force priests, or whoever to perform the marriage, so any appeal would be dismissed immediatly. Could someone try? Sure, but I could also try to appeal murder laws, does that mean that the Supreme court is going to give it a listen? NO. Why? Because they've already ruled on it, and they aren't going to change their minds. That's one of the best parts about the SCC, they have the right to say "That's stupid we aren't going to listen to it".