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Originally Posted by Itse
Is there any actual proof suggesting that these people are somehow Antifa, other than people just saying they must be because it fits with their idea of Antifa?
Because I'm really not seeing it, and yeah I am kind of an expert. Sure, the antifa in the US isn't the same as it tends to be in Europe, but generally these days it's pretty easy spot the antifa if they're actually present as a group, because they tend to be way more organized than any other group present. In some cases better organized than the police.
Since the antifa-movement is heavily influenced by the long history of organized civil resistance and tends to be influenced by anarchist ideals of self-organization, they're not typically a force of chaos in situations like this, nor do they typically move alone. Unless that is their chosen tactic of course.
I'm not saying it's out of the question that in some places in the US the local antifa has decided that maximum chaos is somehow in their interest. Some of them are kind of nuts.
I am however saying that at least in Europe it would be pretty unlikely that a bunch of random civilians could catch an antifa-member that was out there deliberately causing chaos, because they'd have an exit strategy for that scenario and backup. At least that goes for the type of anarchist-antifa -types who would be the sort of troublemakers you're thinking of, at least in Europe.
It is also ridiculous to suggest that every riot in the US right now has an antifa presence. It's just not realistic at all. It's even less realistic to suggest that every rioting city in the US has that specific type of anarchist-antifa-presence. Even if they would be present in every city, they would act differently in different places, because they are self-organizing groups who choose their own goals and tactics.
Antifa is just not an organization like that. Some groups are like A and some are B and some are C. The unifying factor is not that they're anarchists, or violent, but that they're anti-fascists.
Also it's worth noting that while the sort of boogeyman violent anarchists the conservatives likes to talk about do exist, they're extremely rare even among anarchists, and anarchists are really rare.
Also, not all anarchists are antifa.
The media unfortunately loves a simple narrative with two opposing sides with differing goals.
It's why they're usually absolutely terrible at covering a protest of any significant size, because any protest like that is just bound to have all sorts of people with really different ideas.
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I'm not saying Antifa is this highly organized, undergroup group that is controlling everything like the circle gang loves to say. I'm just saying there is ample evidence that they are to a certain degree organizing themselves to go out and destroy and loot.
Not sure what is hard to understand.
The reason it is an issue is because the media isn't reporting the proper story. They have turned it into the police state versus the rioters, when that isn't what it is at all. Most of the protesting has been peaceful. There is a small group of people on both sides, cops & rioters that are making it all worse.
But when we make 2 min videos of 'police brutality in America', or 2 min videos of 'how America is burning', everyone seems to think this is the norm and it just makes the problem worse.
Most groups that are peacefully protesting have caught on to this and are working to help the cops apprehend the people rioting and destroying businesses. Even the gangs in Chicago are working with the police to help.
People really need to stop reading what they see on Fox News or CNN. The media has been contributing to this problem for many years with their style of headline reporting.