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					Originally Posted by Roughneck  Flames and bad face offs are basically a club identity at this point. I feel I’ve only ever known a bad face off team that has occasionally had good faceoff specialists (and by specialists I mean Stephane Yelle). 
 I’m sure somebody knows the stats, how many years since Joel Otto has been at the club have the Flames been a positive faceoff team? It seems like a perennial issue.
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Flames were 3rd in the league last year. It was a big part of what made them successful. They are currently 25th.