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Originally Posted by Strange Brew
Who is saying that what someone says isn’t valid? Don’t put words in my mouth.
Now a year ago Fox was already traded. So that’s a bad timeline so unless you’re some fan that constantly ranks your favorite Flame prospects based on all currently available info I would say the last time most people objectively compared Fox to the other D prospects was 2 off seasons ago. And most would have had him behind IMO.
Fox’s value has consistently gone up since his draft year. Good for him.
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I guess it depends on how you define "objective" in this instance. Sure, there is no data from which we can draw to see where Adam Fox ranked in the thinking of the majority of posters on this board, but I don't think we have to if the argument is that he was legitimately behind other of the Flames defensive prospects. It would require one to review the trade thread from last year, but from what I recall there were PLENTY of posters who saw either Fox as #4 on the Flames's list of young blueliners at the time of the trade behind all of Valimaki (#1), Andersson (#2), and Kylington (#6), or in a dead-heat with Kylington behind the other two.
It seems pretty likely to me that had he been included in last year's prospect rankings, Fox would not have supplanted either one of the top two, who BOTH played NHL games last year. There is actually some pretty good discussion about it ...
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Originally Posted by wingmaker
[Adam Fox] was ranked #7 last year. Have to think he'd be in the top five or potentially top three. Some people think he is a better prospect than Valamaki but I doubt he'd have been voted top spot.
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Originally Posted by Imported_Aussie
Fox would be below Valimaki, Andersson, Parsons, Dube, Gillies and Mangiapane for me. In same tier as Kylington, Foo, ahead of Klimchuk, Phillips
So lower part of top 10 and close to Kylington as the 3 and 4 ranked defencemen on the list
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Imported_Aussie
To me, Fox has a high ceiling, but may also not make the NHL as a regular. Kylington is in the same boat.
Valimaki and Andersson will be NHLers, and soon, yet neither gives much of a drop off to Fox in terms of ceiling. You could argue one/both may have a higher ceiling - up to your perspective
Fox may end up the best, but he is more of a risk.
But that is what makes these rankings so great - everyone has a slightly different methodology and how much emphasis they place on pure upside vs likelihood of having an NHL career (and the role they would have)
As to why such a highly rated prospect could be dealt, with the Flames having 2 strong prospects with high likelihood of NHL careers, and adding Hanifin under team control for 4 more years, that's 3 young guys before looking at Kulak (low ceiling, high floor) and Kylington (high ceiling, low floor). Even if one/both of Brodie and Hamonic leave via trade/UFA in the next couple of years, that is a pretty strong pipeline, which is what made Fox expendable.
And as for Fox vs Kylington, maybe it is better the boom/bust guy you control vs the one you risk losing? Both have that dynamic quality that teases upside, but both have barriers to being NHLers
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Originally Posted by 868904
Valimaki is top dog for sure.
Size, skill, and skating. Resume looks good. Complete package. If there were a 5 tool rating system in hockey like in baseball, Valimaki would meet them all as a defensemen.
Only thing keeping Andersson below Valimaki is the skating issue. It sounds like it has progressed, but it's probably not on par with Valimaki's.
As for where Fox would be, he'd be 3rd or 4th ranked for me, behind the above two and on par with Kylington. Fox has the best resume of the 4 defensemen, but he is inferior to Valimaki in skating and size, inferior to Andersson in size, and inferior to Kylington in skating. Where you rank Fox depends on how much more weight you put on hockey sense (which Fox exudes) over size and skating.
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Originally Posted by FBI
[Fox would have ranked] probably around 5th for me if I didn't have to worry about him signing or not. Lower if I was still worried about him signing.
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I am well aware that this is all anecdotal, but it sure appears a hell of a lot more "objective" than merely pointing out how quickly Fox's draft stock has risen.