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Originally Posted by CaptainYooh
Why? Rights are irrelevant here. Trump's argument against bringing Muslims into US roots in the fact that they have no rights in the US until they get there. The cause and effect he uses against bringing them (because some of them could be terrorists that kill people) are very analogous to "no guns" (some of them can be used to kill people). I just wanted to demonstrate the extremism of both arguments.
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I believe I understand you - you are saying that the structure of the argument is similar. However, in my view, the stakes are completely different, so when you put the two discussions in context there is a massive chasm in what conclusions are drawn.
That is, the argument on guns you've identified is, some guns are used to kill people, so none should be allowed. However, one could at least argue that all guns are inherently dangerous, so the analogy fails here. Further, what's at stake (basic human rights vs missing out on the ability to shoot a gun recreationally or delude oneself into thinking one is providing some sort of check on authoritarianism, lolol), there's no comparison. So that's why I think your analogy fundamentally fails.
That being said, I'm not sure it's a crucial analogy to make or that you can't make what I take to be your underlying point about "all or nothing" viewpoints among both liberals and conservatives without it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinordi
Just note that my language specifically refers to the stupidity of the argument not the person. Maybe this is the most poignant piece of insight, that the positions, beliefs, arguments are so personal in nature for, then the rebuttals, attacks, counter arguments to then are also fundamentally personal. This would go a long way to explaining the sense of victimhood.
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Yes, but you've provided absolutely no basis for it. You've just come in and said, "that's the dumbest thing I've ever heard" and left it at that. How can there be any discussion about that, or frankly anything else, between you after you've done that? You've killed all discourse before it can start and without making any substantive statement at all. If that's what "calling someone out" is, it seems to me to be jackassery to no clear purpose.