[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

If one's opinion resides in a vacuum of reason or evidence, then he will be criticised for it.

An opinion residing in a vacuum of reason or evidence? Your arrogance really is incredible. The only evidence of anything you have presented is the fact that the media loves this selection. Considering the reaction to most media on this site, that is not a ringing endorsement. In fact, it seems that the only time anyone seems to think highly of the media is when the media agrees with a particular narrative one wishes to forward. It's called confirmation bias and I think it is playing hard in this thread.

The reasons people have thus far provided for not liking this hire are so far not very good, and they are being called on it. It seems to me that some people are more nervous and paranoid about the Flames repeating past history more than they are actually disappointed by the fact that the new GM is Treliving.

I don't like nor dislike the hiring, although your constant confrontational approach to not loving it is making me lean towards disliking it. I'm on the fence because his background is neither impressive or substantive in my opinion.

But my problem is that those who are "reserving judgment" seem to be ignoring the reputation that Treliving has developed among professional observers, hockey analysts, and executives. I would agree that Treliving will need to prove himself, but it is perfectly reasonable to 1) Acknowledge his past accomplishments, and to treat these as great prerequisites for future success as a general manager; 2) Recognise this hire as a positive change in direction for this franchise, and a great indication of forward thinking.

What fabulous reputation? What fabulous accomplishments? What positive change? Are you saying this is a great hire because we didn't go full Oiler?

I have asked this before, but have yet to receive any response: Beyond his inexperience, what is it about Treliving that you do not like?

See, that's just it, I'm just not sold on his experience! I see a Phoenix team that is not very good and plays the worst brand of hockey imaginable. He is part of that legacy. I'm sure you're going to demand specifics, so here's what I don't like.

From a business side of things, Phoenix is the 5th largest media market in the United States, yet there is no buzz around the team, and frankly, no one gives a #### about the team. The management of the Coyotes has done such a piss poor job reaching out to the community and attempting to build the game. All they have done is allowed a small vocal group, the Goldwater Institute and friends, to build up a level of animosity toward the team and the NHL that the locals in Glendale spit blood when the team is mentioned. They did a very poor job countering this narrative and getting their own out in the media. They have done nothing to reach out to the public and develop the grassroots fanbase. They have managed the market horribly. While this is not Treliving's primary responsibility, he has to assume some of the blame. He was part of the management team for the past seven years.

The Phoenix Coyotes system is not very good. Since Treliving arrived on the scene, outside of their first round picks, they struggle to find and develop talent. I just hate some of the players they have drafted. The Flames are big on character, but the Coyotes have drafted the antithesis of character in my opinion. Wheeler and Mueller were picked before he arrived, and Turris was drafted the year he joined the club, but Samuelsson and Domi are definitely on his watch. The Coyotes go after guys that just have character flaws in spades. I do not want that being brought over to the Calgary Flames. I like the guys the Flames have picked, and with the exception of Baertschi, they continue to over-achieve and make big gains because of that character.

Their minor league teams have never been very good. San Antonio in 2007-2008 finished 5th in their division, but made the playoffs. In 2008-2009 they finished 8th (last) in their division. In 2009-2010 they finished 6th in their division (2nd last). In 2010-2011 they finished 7th (2nd last) in their division, and then relocated to Portland for the 2011-2012 season. During that season they finished 3rd in their five team division. In the 2012-2013 season they improved, finishing 2nd in the division and making the playoffs. In the 7 years Treliving was with the Coyotes their farm team only made the playoffs twice and never got past the first round. Not a stellar record, and that spills over to the NHL club.

That NHL club is just not very good. They play crap hockey. They have had some success, but nothing consistent. Yes, they have been handcuffed by the economics of their situation, but every team has faced constraints that make their situation unique and challenging. I just don't think they have done the things required to take their team to the next level, and the management team would have done anything different in a different city. They are what they are.

So is Treliving responsible for all of that stuff? Hell no! Is it a great series of accomplishments that many seem to be proclaiming? Again, hell no! He's coming from a mediocre organization, who don't have a great draft record or have much success at developing players, and they have been a failure in their marketplace. He may be the right guy for the Flames job, or he may not. His resume doesn't wow me, but it also doesn't make me shake my head either. He seems like a good guy and he comes with a lot of different experiences, but so would a lot of other guys available at the moment.

He [Treliving] is NOT an unknown. He is unknown about fans, but is by all counts very well regarded in the NHL and throughout professional hockey.

Big ####ing deal! Craig Button was highly regarded! Greg Gilbert was highly regarded! There are all sorts of people that are highly regarded in hockey circles, and they fail regularly!

I don't think I have proclaimed the team a winner with this hire, but in my mind that is completely different from recognising this as a great move. Of course, we don't know how it will all work out, but at this stage and based on what we do know, it looks very promising.

What is the difference between a great hire and proclaiming the team a winner with the hire? Based on the amount of time you're investing arguing with those who are wanting to take a wait-and-see approach, and your attempts to either convince them of their ill-conceived position, or attempt to discredit them all together, you have taken a firm stance that this is a great hiring and the team is a full on winner by making the hiring.

Let's spin this and ask you a question. What exactly is it in Treliving's accomplishments that makes him great for the job? Please list specific accomplishments and successes that are directly attributable to Treliving that make him great for the job?