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Originally Posted by jonesy
Both sides believe at some point in the distant past that the universe was 'started'
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Not necessarily, 'started' implies time and time is part of the universe, so when describing the universe as a whole from an "outside perspective" the word 'started' might not even be meaningful. We don't even know if the question 'what started the universe' isn't a nonsensical one, like asking what the smell of purple is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jonesy
Creationists call this force 'God' Evolutionists don't know what it was, and say it was from nothing.
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So much in so small a sentence...
First you say "Evolutionists" don't know but then say it was from nothing, you can't claim they say they don't know and also claim they say they know.
Second evolution has nothing to do with the origin of the universe, so "Evolutionists" don't say anything about it.
Third, tons of "Evolutionists" are religious and would attribute the origin of the universe to their chosen god(s).
Fourth, people (like cosmologists) who would care to comment on the origin of the universe don't say with certainty it was nothing, nothing is only one hypothesis (and one most probably wouldn't spend much time on, and their definition of nothing is probably different than what you have in mind). Currently there isn't enough knowledge to say anything much beyond a hypothesis.
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Originally Posted by jonesy
Something from nothing is not a plausible scientific theory so they need a better answer than that.
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Hence science!
EDIT: And depending on what one means by nothing, something from nothing happens ALL the time, it just has to make sure to eventually go back to nothing.
At one point lightning was attributed to the activity of supernatural beings as well, but since then we've learned.
So attributing this universe to a direct act of creation of a god just because the current answer in science is "Don't know yet" is somewhat risky and flawed reasoning. Maybe God created the multiverse and this universe is part of a natural process of universe creation, just like God created gravity instead of having angels push planets around.
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Originally Posted by jonesy
I am calling it 'God' you can insist it was nothing that made everything, but I can't understand how that is a satisfactory answer.
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Who says answers have to be satisfactory? They just need to be correct. Not knowing isn't satisfactory, but needing to be satisfied doesn't make an idea true or not.
Besides, saying the universe was created by God just moves the unsatisfying part up a level. Just as easy to say the universe was created by the multiverse. Who or what created god or the multiverse? Still run into the infinite regress problem.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jonesy
I guess I am saying both arguements take a leap of faith on how things got rolling.
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The argument from science though doesn't take a leap of faith though, because "I don't know yet" doesn't require faith.