[Devils'Advocate]

Originally Posted by jammies

I don't eat elephants or dolphins. And those scientists are making a logical leap from "exhibiting intentional behaviour" and "possessing substrates" neither of which equate to consciousness. I don't even think all humans are conscious, so the idea that cow is self-aware because it can make a choice to eat clover instead of grass is laughable.

You have a very strange, narrow definition of "consciousness". But in your narrow definition, if a human is so badly brain damaged that they will never attain your level of consciousness, will you eat them?

If Jane Goodall tells me that animals are self-aware, that's good enough for me.

You can't prove that eating cows leads to eating humans because it doesn't happen. Billions of people have eaten cows without subsequently becoming cannibals. This is called "evidence", you might want to look into it. On the other hand, cruelty to animals does correlate to anti-social behaviour and cruelty to other humans. Again, this "evidence" is what normal people use to prove an assertion.

This so-called-"evidence".... you have some that says that anyone that cruel to animals automatically becomes cruel towards humans? If I kick my dog, there is a 100% correlation and that I am destined to kick a human? Firemen are also the most likely arsonists... I'm not going to say that becoming a fireman is evil.

Also, nowhere did I claim I enjoy animal suffering, I claimed that I was willing to countenance a minimum of it in order to provide me with meat to eat. This does not imply I enjoy this suffering, only that I recognize its necessity.

THERE IS NO NECESSITY!!! I'll wager $100 that your doctor will not say that it is impossible for you to live without eating meat.

BTW, I'm being especially condescending because that is the default attitude of all animal rights zealots and vegans I've ever met. Isn't it annoying when someone presumes to know all the myriad ways that they are better than you?

Like I said, we all think our morals are better than everyone else's. You think yours are better than mine, so I expect no different in terms of attitude.