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Originally Posted by TheGrimm
Sorry to pick at your comment again Witty, but I disagree here. I get that a woman has risks and undergoes stresses and changes carrying a baby to term, however I disagree that this entitles you to have the sole decision on whether to terminate a pregnancy.
A woman has a choice whether to have sex, she, just like the man, should understand that one potential "side effect" of that little act is pregnancy. Once conception occurs, I don't see how the guys opinion should have zero weight. Regardless of whether he can carry the fetus to term, he has as much invested into the process from an ethics an morality standpoint as the woman does.
It's a touchy subject though, as each case is very different, I don't believe the current system is flexible enough for this type of situation, but I do believe there should be an avenue for a man to "appeal" an abortion.
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Here's the thing, if the woman is in a committed relationship, and there is an unwanted pregnancy, I would imagine most women would discuss this with their partner. If the pregnancy comes from a sexual encounter of a casual nature, how often does the guy want to raise that child? Honestly? If he's having casual sex with a girl, he's probably as unlikely to want to raise that child as she is. I just feel like this argument is a very, very rare occurrence used only for the sake of argument. How often is this honestly an issue?
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Originally Posted by woob
Haha, I was going to call her out on that too but you beat me to it.
Also, to provide an opposing view to your 8/10 wife example, witty: How many times in a movie where some shy girl pines after a guy, is he an average joe skinny dude? Typically, he's some jocky football player stud or what not. The angle goes both ways in Hollywood.
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I'll take back the reference to Ross, it was a poor way to say things, and I apologize. I see your point on that, but also, that "shy" girl, the "unattractive/nerdy" girl that they use in those movies, is she ever actually unattractive? In general, they're very attractive girls who get put in ill-fitting clothes with bad hair and glasses to make them look less attractive than they actually are. Are they ever honestly average looking girls? And what do they have to do to get the guy? Get a makeover so they're acceptably "hot," and then the jock looks at them differently.
Show me five examples of movies/tv shows where a girl who was bigger than a size 6 or less than an 8 on the hot scale who nabbed the "hot" guy?
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Originally Posted by mikey_the_redneck
Purity? A woman is considered a tease if she leads a man on and indicates she will sleep with him, but does not follow through. A tease is not when a woman simply says no.
If said woman sleeps with the man shortly after meeting him at a bar (is not a challenge) than he will most likely put her into the short term category, and rightly so. It's a trust thing.
The pay gap is a myth. Women get paid less because they choose certain professions and work less hours. In the 20-30 age range, women are actually starting to make more money than the men.
-Who has no reproductive rights?
-Who is constantly told to "get over it" when someone offends them? - this can apply to both sexes
-Who experiences more workplace fatalities/injuries? That's not equal!
-Who gets favourable treatment in the divorce court/custody arrangements?
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But if a man sleeps with multiple partners, does that affect his "long term" prospects from women? Men are not in any way held up to the same ridiculous "purity" standards as are women.
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Originally Posted by Cain
Just wanted to take a little issue with both statements. I don't disagree with everything you said, but I think these two points deserve a bit.
Men are used as visual stimulation a fair amount. Most actors have quite a bit of sex appeal just like their actress counterparts. I agree that this happens more with women for sure, but let's not pretend it only goes one way.
As for you only have the right to say that sexism doesn't exist if you have a vagina...I hope you were just getting a little worked up with the end bit because that doesn't make sense at all. Sexism clearly goes both ways. Women are victimized by parts of it, and men are victimized by others. It isn't a perfect 50-50 split, very few things are in this world. But it also isn't a game of who has more instances and examples to prove that they are more hard done by either....it should be a collaborative effort on both parts to show where things need to change and work together to change them. It shouldn't be women vs men, or men vs women....This is the part that drives me nuts.
Sexism debates and topics always devolve into a competition to show which sex has the tougher time when really...who cares? Instead of arguing endlessly about poor me, why not take issues from both sides as they come up and try to fix them? The pissing contest solves nothing, and those people who dismiss one side because one side has it "worse" are just as bad.
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I would just love to know, as a count, how many people in this topic are men, and how many are women. My point with that is that if you are not a woman, you do not know what women deal with. Of course men have some issues to deal with as well, but it's not nearly as widespread as what women deal with. Men claiming misandry is basically as ridiculous to me as a white person claiming reverse racism.
Men are just in recent times being objectified the way that women have been objectified for centuries. Is it right? No, but now men are realizing what women have dealt with for ages, and realizing how much it sucks.